problem related to praying in tongues
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Act 2:4 "And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance."
Did God Authorize this 'error' about His Pure And Preserved Word?
from another post, i know that you stated you no longer held to a trinity nor Presbyterian views [Reformation].
so explain how God is Father-WORD-Holy Spirit, but oneness, i guess you might call your view. you can clarify what i am wrong about if i miss spoken about what i think it is you believe.
you said i was committing idolatry by claiming Jesus is God.
but i think because Jesus says the Father is Spirit, and the Holy Spirit is Spirit, you merged/meshed them as One?
i am trying to see it from your view how it would not be considered idolatry.
but i think because Jesus says the Father is Spirit, and the Holy Spirit is Spirit, you merged/meshed them as One?
i am trying to see it from your view how it would not be considered idolatry.
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Niki7
Guest
From which scriptures do you get your understanding that the Holy Spirit can refer to either God or to the Holy Spirit?
The references given do not employ understanding on your conclusions. Rather, my comment would be that you are the one adding confusion to understanding since the Holy Spirit is the 3rd person of the Trinity...notwithstanding you seem to regard that as non-biblical.
So it appears you are saying that God gives pieces of Himself away. Do you understand you correctly?
It's a little scary actually....
I'll add that the correct understanding of God is that He is Spirit....not a spirit, not one of many or what we understand with our earth bound minds...He is the only One. He is Spirit. The Holy Spirit is not that Spirit, but is sent from God to this earth...Acts....after Jesus ascended
N
Niki7
Guest
Nope. Tongues of angels is only mentioned once and not actually used as any kind of proof of tongues and not found in Paul's teachings on tongues in Corinthians. Paul is using hyperbole...take it in the context in which it is written if you know how. However, are you saying that the recorded instances of angels speaking means that they cannot speak a language unto themselves or another language?
The Bible disagrees with tradition....Jewish or otherwise...which you might possibly understand if you were not an unbeliever...you do practice a religion but again, prefer to have it undisclosed.
So you can put that one to bed and quit beating on your religious drum.
You have little to no understanding of any spiritual import as we all know you do practice a religion, refuse say what it is, but love to deny actual believers know what they are talking about.
Tell that to the myriad tongues-speakers who frequently use it as 'evidence' of a heavenly language (i.e. tongues-speech).
However, Paul in 1 Corinthians 12-14 makes it clear that some believers have the spiritual gift of tongues. I'm not sure what you mean by "praying in Pentecostal/Charismatic Churches." What is their practice now?
My son prays in tongues privately between him and God. That use of the gift fits Jesus' teaching. Paul in 1 Corinthians 14 further restricts the use of the gift. If churches abuse the gift somehow, they will answer for it.
Correct.
There is one God, the Father. He is the only true God, there are no others, there are no parts or "persons" to Him. God the Father is God alone. God's Word (logos) is His will, plan, or purposes. It is not a separate "Person," or entity from God. God has a will, a plan, for redemption. That logos became flesh when God caused Mary to conceive Jesus, God's human Messiah. IOW, Jesus Christ is God's Word made flesh. We have the written Word (the Bible) and the living Word (Jesus Christ).
The words "Holy Spirit" at times refer to God Himself. God IS "the Holy Spirit." In Acts 5:3-4, Ananias and Sapphira lied to the Holy Spirit, they lied to God Himself, they did not lie to a "Person" of God, they lied to God. "Holy spirit" can also refer to the gift that God gives to people. In the OT it was on some people, and it could be lost (Ps 51:11; 1 Sam 16:14). In Numbers 11:17-25, God took of the spirit that was on Moses and gave it to the 70 elders. He did not send a "Person" of Himself, he gave them holy spirit. In the NT, every Christian is sealed with the gift of holy spirit (Acts 2:38; Eph 1:13-14; more).
I have a car. My car is a Honda. That does not mean I have two cars.
God is the Father. God is the Holy Spirit. That does not mean there are two Gods, or two "Persons" of God.
Idolatry is worshiping something/someone as God who is not God. There is one God, the Father, who is the only true God (John 17:3; 1 Cor 8:6). Jesus Christ has a God, and he ascended to his God (John 20:17). John wrote his gospel so that we can believe that "Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God" (John 20:31). Nowhere in the Bible are we encouraged to believe in a triune God. Nowhere in the Bible is God ever described as a Trinity of "Persons," or more than one person. I am aware that "echad" is a plural noun, but it does not mean "compound unity." The word simply means "one."
In Acts 5:3-4, "Holy Spirit" refers to God.
In Acts 2:38, "holy spirit" is the gift of God.
Where is it taught IN THE BIBLE that God is a Trinity? Or that the Holy Spirit is the 3rd Person of the Trinity?
In one sense, that's correct. God gives some of what He is. When we got saved, we became partakers of the divine nature (2 Pet 1:4). We get holy spirit, something we did not have before.
I don't think so..It's a little scary actually....
If God is Spirit (He is), and "He is the only one" (He is), and "the Holy Spirit is not that Spirit," then who is "the Holy Spirit"?
..it's no wonder that people use phrases like "we cannot understand it," "it's a mystery," and "we don't need to understand it" when talking about the Trinity.
I do realize that the position of this forum is to ban people who do not hold to the Trinity or the deity of Jesus Christ.
If I get banned, then I get banned.
God bless
Oh no, I cannot agree with you on this point. The Bible is clear on this.
John 1:1-5 says,
“In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God. All things came into being through Him, and apart from Him not even one thing came into being that has come into being. In Him was life, and the life was the Light of mankind.
verse 14, “‘And the Word became flesh, and dwelt among us; and we saw His glory, glory as of the only Son from the Father, full of grace and truth.
John 10:30 – I and the Father are one. (Jesus says that He is God)
John 20:28 – Thomas answered and said to Him, “My Lord and my God!” (Thomas worshiped Jesus as God, Jesus did not rebuke him)
1 Corinthians 8:6 – yet for us there is only one God, the Father, from whom are all things, and we exist for Him; and one Lord, Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we exist through Him. (The Father and Jesus are equally God, they are the same God).
Matthew 1:23 – Behold, the virgin will conceive and give birth to a Son , and they shall name Him Immanuel , which translated means, “God with us .”
2 Peter 1:1 – Simon Peter, a bond-servant and apostle of Jesus Christ, To those who have received a faith of the same kind as ours, by the righteousness of our God and Savior, Jesus Christ (Peter says that Jesus is God).
'” John 8:58 “Jesus answered them: 'I solemnly declare it: before Abraham came to be, I AM.” [This was the name God gave himself when he first communicated with Moses, Exodus 3:14 “God replied, 'I am who am. ' Then he added, 'This is what you shall tell the Israelites: I AM sent me to you.
in verse 10 " I and the Father are one.”
31At this, the Jews again picked up stones to stone Him. 32But Jesus responded, “I have shown you many good works from the Father. For which of these do you stone Me?”
33“We are not stoning You for any good work,” said the Jews, “but for blasphemy, because You, who are a man, declare Yourself to be God.” ( Jesus claimed to be God)
John 5 "
18 The Jews tried all the more to kill Him, not only because He had worked on the Day of Rest, but because He had also called God His Own Father. This made Him the same as God.
Only God accepts worship, only God can heal, Jesus did both.
That is not true. CC doesn't ban people who do not hold to the Doctrine of the Trinity; they ban those who speak and teach against the Trinity. `
You may disagree, but that is no way to suggest or call the teaching of the Trinity Idolatry or be arrogant as to think you fully know all about the Divine Nature of the living God when no one can.
The ridiculous Honda analogy or those who think they can simply use a hard-boiled egg to explain the Eternal Godhead.
Lack of Reverence and humbleness when Speaking of God, the Holy Spirit, and the Lord Jesus Christ.
They all three are called God in the word of God.
Yet they are one. How can that be? Human reasoning can't comprehend that understanding, so they attack it. Lambast and mock.
Try to act so intellectually sound. What a joke.
and that's why they get banned.
It is a terrible thing when one would try to bring condemnation on you to say it is Idolatry Because You hold to the word of God:
That Jesus is God, The Father is God, and the Holy Spirit is GOD, yet all one.
You don't win the argument by trying to bring condemnation to those who disagree. Many Oneness types to that. They are (many of them )legalistic, and controlling, and will accuse you of Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit, who is God, when you leave their fellowship.
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Niki7
Guest
I'm so very sorry but you are not going to correct the truth here. Yes, God is Spirit but He does not give away little pieces or wisps (since we are talking spirit) of Himself. That, is your error and not to be found anywhere in the Bible. There are spirits all around us in this world and we possess one ourself. The Bible also speaks of demons...also spirits. Since those things are true, why put a different spin on what scripture plainly states?
Well I don't think the position is to ban people who do not hold to the doctrine of the Trinity because I know people here who have been here a long time and they do not believe in the Trinity. The thing is, they don't insist everyone else is wrong and talk about it often so they don't seem to be trying to convince everyone else and change views or understandings.
So you think creating a God different than the One in scripture so people can better grasp His form is the answer to 'mystery'? You have a lot of changing of scripture to do then because mysteries are all over the place. I don't think you might get yourself banned over this if you don't keep harping on it, but the accusations against those who do not agree with you...ie idol worship...might do it.
From all my research many Christians feal it's heresy to claim Jesus is God the father.
This is a full in depth study.
https://bibleauthenticity.com/refuting-claims-jesus-god/
If anyone wants to argue with me, ask God, read the link and understand the dilemma.
I'm just saying it's unfair to single out one person like va, when by all accounts many Christians feel the same way.
This is a full in depth study.
https://bibleauthenticity.com/refuting-claims-jesus-god/
If anyone wants to argue with me, ask God, read the link and understand the dilemma.
I'm just saying it's unfair to single out one person like va, when by all accounts many Christians feel the same way.
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Niki7
Guest
I have personally found the narration concerning Jesus baptism to be plain as day. One, we have Jesus being baptized by His cousin in the Jordan, Two, we have a 'voice from heaven' ~ God the Father ~ saying 'this is my beloved Son in whom I am well pleased and Three, the Holy Spirit descending upon Jesus in the form of a dove.
I was not looking for 'proof' but I suppose there it is. According to what you believe though, it would seem God was Himself, Jesus and the Holy Spirit all at the same time. Of course being God, He could do that anyway but that is not what He is doing. Why represent Himself as 3 distinct 'persons' ? Being God He could just have said from the very beginning that He is going to appear as 3 persons but He is only one. Then, there would be no questioning and no one would try to figure out the 'mystery' or be confused.
Right. So then why didn't He just do that instead of leaving all the little ants on earth to confusion and debate?
