Predestination is misunderstood...

[Genez]

well I think hes evil

Thanks again for the endorsement!

 

[Genez]

I believe you are misreading Paul. Because Adam sinned all die, death came upon all. All who sin sin because their mortality, their limited life span, provokes them into sinning.

Having fallen man to die is the wisdom of God..

For Jesus would still be on the Cross today if man NEVER DIED .
For man's sins would not be finite in number, but never ending.

The fact that we die in our fallen state is a good thing.
That way, God could pay for our sins, and be done with it!


In Christ.....

 

[Thunderrr-mental]

Thank you..... .....how nice of you.

His sermon is full of errors opinions cruelty and lies.

I found him evil. And I won't be listening to his rubbish anymore.

 

[maxamir]

You have to be kidding....

Its only unbiblical for those who approach God from a Calvinistic world view.

Mat 13:10 And the disciples came and said to Him, "Why do You speak to them in parables?"
Mat 13:11 He answered and said to them, "Because it has been given to you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it has not been given.

Luk 10:21 In that hour Jesus rejoiced in the Spirit and said, "I thank You, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that You have hidden these things from the wise and prudent and revealed them to babes. Even so, Father, for so it seemed good in Your sight.

Joh 6:65 And He said, "Therefore I have said to you that no one can come to Me unless it has been granted to him by My Father."
Joh 6:66 From that time many of His disciples went back and walked with Him no more.

Joh 10:26 But you do not believe, because you are not of My sheep, as I said to you.
Joh 10:27 My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me.
Joh 10:28 And I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; neither shall anyone snatch them out of My hand.

Joh 17:9 "I pray for them. I do not pray for the world but for those whom You have given Me, for they are Yours.

To deny the doctrine of God's sovereign election means you also deny the triune work of the Godhead and therefore the Trinity.

 

[maxamir]

I wasn't saying it so not sure why you are but ....

1Tim.2:1-4
Therefore I exhort first of all that supplications, prayers, intercessions, and giving of thanks be made for all men, 2 for kings and all who are in authority, that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and reverence. 3 For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior, 4 who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth.

Hard to see how it is unbiblical to say God wants all men to be saved when the scripture says that very thing.

You seem to be under the mistaken impression that those who are not saved have never been given the opportunity to respond to God.

If you take into context the whole of Scripture you would have no problem understanding that God's promise to Abraham was that in him all nations would be blessed but that does not mean every single person in every nation without exception but all types of people without distinction, including kings, lest you ascribe to the heresy of Universalism and create a God whose will is left frustrated by man and rob Him of the glory of His salvation by giving it to the choice of men.

You obviously do not yet understand what the term reprobate means.

If God sincerely desires to save every person then why does Christ rejoice at the knowledge that the truth is hidden from some and even thanks His Father for doing so???

Luk 10:21 In that hour Jesus rejoiced in the Spirit and said, "I thank You, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that You have hidden these things from the wise and prudent and revealed them to babes. Even so, Father, for so it seemed good in Your sight.

I would recommend you read the article below to avoid any further confusion on your part.

Does God Really Desire to Save the Reprobate?

 

[maxamir]

Before you can believe in Christ you must first believe that Jesus is real.

And without faith it is impossible to please God, because anyone who comes to him
must believe that he exists and that he rewards those who earnestly seek him." Hebrews 11:6

One does not have to be regenerate to know He existed at the time of the Cross.

The demons believe that Christ exists but they are not saved.

True saving faith is a gift of grace from God and not something man creates in which he can boast.

Please read your Bible!

Eph 2:8 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God,
Eph 2:9 not of works, lest anyone should boast.

God has chosen to use the foolishness of Gospel preaching to grant faith to His people.

1Co 1:21 For since, in the wisdom of God, the world through wisdom did not know God, it pleased God through the foolishness of the message preached to save those who believe.

Rom 10:17 So then faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

Psa_119:49 Remember the word to Your servant, Upon which You have caused me to hope.

Php 1:29 For to you it has been granted on behalf of Christ, not only to believe in Him, but also to suffer for His sake,

 

[PaulThomson]

This is the key to understanding what many will miss unless your pastor is skilled at exegetical expository teaching.


Titus 2:11-12

For the grace of God that brings salvation has appeared to all men, teaching us that,
denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly
in the present age.

Your own supposition on how to read the text could never tell you what the Word of God is actually conveying in verse 12.
Not understood unless someone can teach you from the Greek, and teach it with depth... not just resorting to Greek word studies.

The Greek word translated "teaching" is not the word used for a typical classroom setting.
It speaks of a different way to teach.

Parents sometimes use this technique when dealing with an obstinate child...

This way of teaching according to the Greek means letting someone get hurt by learning the hard way.
Sometimes referred to as 'the school of hard knocks.'

It means allowing someone (after is made aware of something being wrong) to go ahead and do it.
After they get hurt and burned enough times?
Then they learn to say, "NO!"

That is how in Titus 2:12 God's grace teaches all men to say no to ungodliness...
It also explains why even unbelievers as they mature seek to live in morality.

I was truly blessed to finally understand another way in how God teaches us.. and is from Him when we mess up our lives.

I learned of this from this pastor... https://rbthieme.org/index.html#tabs-3

Not just bible students, but pastors have ordered his messages for their personal study.
Look over the page. No money required for ordering his materials.

Grace and peace ............

I can't see how your elaboration on the meaning of paideuo as inclusive of scourging in the teaching process, as one chastises children in teaching them, contradicts what I drew out of the language and grammar of the two verses. Where did we disagree?

 

[PaulThomson]

no wonder your head's all over the place

The guy you've learned from teaches the wages for sin is death only refers to Adam and eve and nobody else.

Watch for yourself he says it within the first 2 minutes

Watching this, the name L Ron Hubbard came to mind. If L Ron Hubbard led a bible study, it could sound something like that video..

 

[Thunderrr-mental]

The demons believe that Christ exists but they are not saved.

True saving faith is a gift of grace from God and not something man creates in which he can boast.

Please read your Bible!

Eph 2:8 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God,
Eph 2:9 not of works, lest anyone should boast.

God has chosen to use the foolishness of Gospel preaching to grant faith to His people.

1Co 1:21 For since, in the wisdom of God, the world through wisdom did not know God, it pleased God through the foolishness of the message preached to save those who believe.

Rom 10:17 So then faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

Psa_119:49 Remember the word to Your servant, Upon which You have caused me to hope.

Php 1:29 For to you it has been granted on behalf of Christ, not only to believe in Him, but also to suffer for His sake,

that's because you have to believe be saved and be baptised.

Ain't no holy spirit going to baptise a demon,

Honestly your intelligence astounds
you.

all your focused on is the devil

 

[Thunderrr-mental]

Watching this, the name L Ron Hubbard came to mind. If L Ron Hubbard led a bible study, it could sound something like that video..

honestly watching that video made my skin boil

 

[Thunderrr-mental]

The demons believe that Christ exists but they are not saved.

True saving faith is a gift of grace from God and not something man creates in which he can boast.

Please read your Bible!

Eph 2:8 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God,
Eph 2:9 not of works, lest anyone should boast.

God has chosen to use the foolishness of Gospel preaching to grant faith to His people.

1Co 1:21 For since, in the wisdom of God, the world through wisdom did not know God, it pleased God through the foolishness of the message preached to save those who believe.

Rom 10:17 So then faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

Psa_119:49 Remember the word to Your servant, Upon which You have caused me to hope.

Php 1:29 For to you it has been granted on behalf of Christ, not only to believe in Him, but also to suffer for His sake,

the devil is a liar,.focus on God, and the idea God is father

 

[Genez]

Mat 13:10 And the disciples came and said to Him, "Why do You speak to them in parables?"
Mat 13:11 He answered and said to them, "Because it has been given to you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it has not been given.

Luk 10:21 In that hour Jesus rejoiced in the Spirit and said, "I thank You, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that You have hidden these things from the wise and prudent and revealed them to babes. Even so, Father, for so it seemed good in Your sight.

Joh 6:65 And He said, "Therefore I have said to you that no one can come to Me unless it has been granted to him by My Father."
Joh 6:66 From that time many of His disciples went back and walked with Him no more.

Joh 10:26 But you do not believe, because you are not of My sheep, as I said to you.
Joh 10:27 My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me.
Joh 10:28 And I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; neither shall anyone snatch them out of My hand.

Joh 17:9 "I pray for them. I do not pray for the world but for those whom You have given Me, for they are Yours.

To deny the doctrine of God's sovereign election means you also deny the triune work of the Godhead and therefore the Trinity.

View attachment 262249

The Father chooses those whom he tests with drawing all men....

Those who do not resist God drawing them He then chooses to give to the Son.

Stephen said some men are always resisting the Holy Spirit!

“You stiff-necked people! Your hearts and ears are still uncircumcised.
You are just like your ancestors: You always resist the Holy Spirit! Acts 7:51

Yes!

The drawing of God can be resisted!


There it is! Acts 7:51.


In Christ...

 

[Genez]

The demons believe that Christ exists but they are not saved.

Yes! Proves it does not take being regenerated first before becoming born again....

 

[Genez]

Watching this, the name L Ron Hubbard came to mind. If L Ron Hubbard led a bible study, it could sound something like that video..

What TM concluded was not what that man taught... TM was conflating the wages of sin with the original sin of Adam as to being one and the same. That pastor did not teach that.

 

[sawdust]

If you take into context the whole of Scripture you would have no problem understanding that God's promise to Abraham was that in him all nations would be blessed but that does not mean every single person in every nation without exception but all types of people without distinction, including kings, lest you ascribe to the heresy of Universalism and create a God whose will is left frustrated by man and rob Him of the glory of His salvation by giving it to the choice of men.

You obviously do not yet understand what the term reprobate means.

If God sincerely desires to save every person then why does Christ rejoice at the knowledge that the truth is hidden from some and even thanks His Father for doing so???

Luk 10:21 In that hour Jesus rejoiced in the Spirit and said, "I thank You, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that You have hidden these things from the wise and prudent and revealed them to babes. Even so, Father, for so it seemed good in Your sight.

I would recommend you read the article below to avoid any further confusion on your part.

Does God Really Desire to Save the Reprobate?

I'm not confused.

 

[FollowerofShiloh]

It's funny seeing the Reformed use AW Pink as a poster board for their doctrine when we have written and audio of him basically destroying the Gospel of Grace with his...

message.

 

[Chaps]

I begin with the sovereignty of God. And I believe He chooses. But I also believe man is given the freedom to make choices, but being limited in understanding and fallen in his nature, actually chooses to his own detriment. Consequently, if God doesn't intervene in the affairs of man, man will always make himself worthy of destruction.

I believe grace is this intervention which enables men to understand things concerning themselves and God that they will never come to apart from this intervention.

Then what is the purpose of inspiration of Scripture if God has to intervene to help us to understand the Gospel?

 

[Genez]

If you take into context the whole of Scripture you would have no problem understanding that God's promise to Abraham was that in him all nations would be blessed but that does not mean every single person in every nation without exception but all types of people without distinction, including kings, lest you ascribe to the heresy of Universalism and create a God whose will is left frustrated by man and rob Him of the glory of His salvation by giving it to the choice of men.

You obviously do not yet understand what the term reprobate means.

If God sincerely desires to save every person then why does Christ rejoice at the knowledge that the truth is hidden from some and even thanks His Father for doing so???

Luk 10:21 In that hour Jesus rejoiced in the Spirit and said, "I thank You, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that You have hidden these things from the wise and prudent and revealed them to babes. Even so, Father, for so it seemed good in Your sight.

I would recommend you read the article below to avoid any further confusion on your part.

Does God Really Desire to Save the Reprobate?

Reprobates end up becoming a reprobate as the result of God having initiated His drawing to them.
God does not in turn then try to save the reprobate...
For their state of reprobation was punishment from God for their rejecting His drawing them.

Here is one example of what I speak of...

​

​

The wrath of God is being revealed from heaven against all the ​

godlessness and wickedness of people, who suppress the truth ​

by their wickedness, since what may be known about God is plain ​

to them, because God has made it plain to them. For since the ​

creation of the world God’s invisible qualities—his eternal power ​

and divine nature—have been clearly seen, being understood ​

from what has been made, so that they are without excuse.​

​

For although they knew God, they neither glorified him as God ​

nor gave thanks to him, but their thinking became futile and ​

their foolish hearts were darkened. Although they claimed to ​

be wise, they became fools and exchanged the glory of the ​

immortal God for images made to look like a mortal human ​

being and birds and animals and reptiles.​

​

Therefore God gave them over in the sinful desires of their ​

hearts to sexual impurity for the degrading of their bodies ​

with one another. They exchanged the truth about God for ​

a lie, and worshiped and served created things rather than ​

the Creator—who is forever praised. Amen.​

​

Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. ​

Even their women exchanged natural sexual relations for ​

unnatural ones.​

​

​

Romans 1:18-25​

 

[Genez]

I can't see how your elaboration on the meaning of paideuo as inclusive of scourging in the teaching process, as one chastises children in teaching them, contradicts what I drew out of the language and grammar of the two verses. Where did we disagree?

For the Lord disciplines whom He loves, and He scourges every son whom He receives. Hebrews 12:6

Why the inconsistency?

 

[Thunderrr-mental]

What TM concluded was not what that man taught... TM was conflating the wages of sin with the original sin of Adam as to being one and the same. That pastor did not teach that.

it wasn't just what he said about the wages. it was many other things.

Anyone with half a brain can work out Adam did not sin in arrogance.

Not only that he started his sermon with the intimidating hell speech towards people who haven't even started to believe in Christ yet.

Then his intimidating remarks of human emotions also got intimidating.

Then he went on as if he knew it all.

There was plenty other remarks he said which was questionable.

If.you can't see an ignorant person when you see one God help you.