(Potentially) Profound Thoughts

[Ballaurena]

Ooooooo... kay then! That sounds like we're starting to get into witchcraft here.

Actually I once asked God the difference between what His people do and witchcraft - I mean some of those things Elijah did sure look like it and Moses looked to do the same as Pharaoh's magicians except that Moses' snake staff ate the others, and He gave me a lesson by letting me accidentally overstep. Anointing oil has a real and proper use in the Bible, but I started using it in a manner as though it was itself powerful, magical even. This seemed to invite spiritual problems rather than solve them. When I instead used it in a manner more like soap, where it isn't magical but just a tool with God and I the real power, things went the other way.

Feel free to take your questions to God for yourself, though. I am certainly no expert on witchcraft, though God has taught me a lot about fallen angels for practical reasons.

I do wonder about the use of the word empath to be honest, though. God hasn't liked the use of words like 'demon,' 'ora,' and even 'weird' due to their connections to false religion.

 

[Ballaurena]

If I went through the whole list, picked every item apart and explained why it was both illogical and contradictory to what the Bible says... You would just keep arguing about it. You always do. There's no profit in doing that.

I will instead just make the blanket statement that almost all the items on that list are both illogical and contradict with the Bible says.

Proceed with your arguments.

I am slightly amused by your reply (there wasn't a perfect emoji for that, though, so I did my best). I am disappointed that you would dismiss prophetic words that have been in several cases life-altering truths for me and others, but I appreciate both that you think for yourself and that you aren't argumentative.

I am torn between trying to explain things anyway (The core of my being is teacher so I LOVE to explain things. And I have a hard time giving up on people even when I should), and just letting you find your way with God for yourself. Realize though, that there are depths of meaning to these statements that will be missed if you just give them a cursory look. Also, like any word of God, you really need to have Holy Spirit help with the interpretation.

I will settle for the funny story that came from one that might also be a helpful illustration if it isn't too much a case of you had to be there: "Perfection is the goal; failure is the means. "

I used to homeschool two brothers from my church so we were all familiar with the bulk of the prophetic words I shared. They were close enough in age that I sometimes gave them the same assignment, but this caused problems because not only were they a few years apart, but the younger one had learning disabilities and tended to struggle with school activities while the older one found them too easy. Anyway, all sitting at the same table, I had just had to make a significant correction aloud about the younger brother's work, which made him look a bit foolish. Without missing a beat the younger brother turned to the older and proclaimed, "I am now closer to perfection than you." We all burst out laughing.

 

[enril]

Qualifies as an empath.

A real empath is someone who can literally feel your emotions - you know possessing actual empathy, not just someone who can read your body and make an educated guess about what you are feeling. The latter is the way a spiritually blind and ignorant world tries to explain away the supernatural.

Rather just like from the overflow of the heart the mouth speaks (Luke 6:45), physical signs are an overflow of the spirit, but they are a much weaker and insufficient way to determine what is really going on than actually reading the spirit of the person. Physical signs can be helpful evidence to point out to non-empaths and to confirm one's read, and the flow from heart to body can probably be felt, making identification of the physical evidence easier, but a real empath doesn't start with them. The physical signs can also be suppressed or obscured where the spirit cannot

An example of a real empath would be a woman at my church who has had occasion to have to leave our group meetings because she was picking up the negative emotions of those around her so strongly even though no one was even particularly focused on how they were feeling. That is a real empath. There are elements and similarities of this in my spiritual gifts, though my purpose is a little different than this term implies.

Really though, empath is a word of the world and not how God has ever defined somebody's purpose in my awareness. I would say some of the types of beings (purposes, callings) God creates have this trait. For example, it might be helpful for an evangelist to truly understand what their audience is feeling.

as in cold reading. used by every fortune teller since the dawn of time.

 

[enril]

Moses looked to do the same as Pharaoh's magicians except that Moses' snake staff ate the others,

actually, the pharaoh's magicians imitated what moses did. you got it backwards. plus, the devil has no true power, only cheap imitations. the paraohs magicians would have hidden snakes in their clothing to cast, while hiding the staffs. they used chemicals to turn water red. they pulled frogs from clothing. (frogs were already literally everywhere.) magic healing relies on belief, but has no real healing effect.

 

[enril]

actually, the pharaoh's magicians imitated what moses did. you got it backwards. plus, the devil has no true power, only cheap imitations. the paraohs magicians would have hidden snakes in their clothing to cast, while hiding the staffs. they used chemicals to turn water red. they pulled frogs from clothing. (frogs were already literally everywhere.) magic healing relies on belief, but has no real healing effect.

could/did the pharaoh's magicians grow their snakes? turn them back into staffs? grow their staffs? moses and aaron did.

 

[enril]

so... cold reading... psychologist tricks. used by the devil to decieve. used by christians to give a name for fakery to the rest of us.
Read this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cold_reading

 

[Lynx]

Actually I once asked God the difference between what His people do and witchcraft - I mean some of those things Elijah did sure look like it and Moses looked to do the same as Pharaoh's magicians except that Moses' snake staff ate the others, and He gave me a lesson by letting me accidentally overstep. Anointing oil has a real and proper use in the Bible, but I started using it in a manner as though it was itself powerful, magical even. This seemed to invite spiritual problems rather than solve them. When I instead used it in a manner more like soap, where it isn't magical but just a tool with God and I the real power, things went the other way.

Feel free to take your questions to God for yourself, though. I am certainly no expert on witchcraft, though God has taught me a lot about fallen angels for practical reasons.

I do wonder about the use of the word empath to be honest, though. God hasn't liked the use of words like 'demon,' 'ora,' and even 'weird' due to their connections to false religion.

I am slightly amused by your reply (there wasn't a perfect emoji for that, though, so I did my best). I am disappointed that you would dismiss prophetic words that have been in several cases life-altering truths for me and others, but I appreciate both that you think for yourself and that you aren't argumentative.

I am torn between trying to explain things anyway (The core of my being is teacher so I LOVE to explain things. And I have a hard time giving up on people even when I should), and just letting you find your way with God for yourself. Realize though, that there are depths of meaning to these statements that will be missed if you just give them a cursory look. Also, like any word of God, you really need to have Holy Spirit help with the interpretation.

I will settle for the funny story that came from one that might also be a helpful illustration if it isn't too much a case of you had to be there: "Perfection is the goal; failure is the means. "

I used to homeschool two brothers from my church so we were all familiar with the bulk of the prophetic words I shared. They were close enough in age that I sometimes gave them the same assignment, but this caused problems because not only were they a few years apart, but the younger one had learning disabilities and tended to struggle with school activities while the older one found them too easy. Anyway, all sitting at the same table, I had just had to make a significant correction aloud about the younger brother's work, which made him look a bit foolish. Without missing a beat the younger brother turned to the older and proclaimed, "I am now closer to perfection than you." We all burst out laughing.

Case in point, and an excellent demonstration of why I didn't bother. Quod erat demonstratum.

 

[Solemateleft]

 

[Solemateleft]

so... cold reading... psychologist tricks. used by the devil to decieve. used by christians to give a name for fakery to the rest of us.
Read this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cold_reading

And then of course there is the more common use of Intuition…
Where everyone has different and unique personality types… The popular Myers Briggs personality types include “Intuition” as one of the major characteristics that serves to assess and define the 16 personality types in general terms…
Where individuals can score high or low on each of these major characteristics…
All this to demonstrate that they include there are people in this world who simply have very high intuition…
Now, how those people choose to use these unique qualities in their lives, is another matter all together…
Where many of these people simply tend to be advisors, counselors, life coaches, advocates, ministry leaders etc with the earnest intentions for using their gifts of higher intuition to help others to help themselves…
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intuition

 

[Ballaurena]

as in cold reading. used by every fortune teller since the dawn of time.

People can use their talents with God or against Him.

 

[enril]

People can use their talents with God or against Him.

cold reading is not a talent. it is a skill learned to decieve. how could lying to someone by knowing things about them be used for God?

 

[Ballaurena]

actually, the pharaoh's magicians imitated what moses did. you got it backwards. plus, the devil has no true power, only cheap imitations. the paraohs magicians would have hidden snakes in their clothing to cast, while hiding the staffs. they used chemicals to turn water red. they pulled frogs from clothing. (frogs were already literally everywhere.) magic healing relies on belief, but has no real healing effect.

I wasn't speaking temporally. I was equating the appearance of two behaviors independent of order. What Moses did looked the same as the magicians because the magicians copied him.

And I disagree on how the magicians did it. Yes there are many modern day magicians who use slight of hand - I just saw one at the fair even, but there are also those who utilize satanic forces. This latter group cannot do what God can do, but they can still do things that are beyond our physical capabilities. I'm not saying that what they present is necessarily always reality, though, because whatever powers they have they will use to deceive.

 

[Ballaurena]

cold reading is not a talent. it is a skill learned to decieve. how could lying to someone by knowing things about them be used for God?

Don't be ridiculous. I spoke of actually truly reading somebody's soul, not lying to them. This was often done by prophets in the Bible. And I never called it 'cold reading,' that was your term apparently chosen to discredit the work of the Holy Spirit.

 

[enril]

I wasn't speaking temporally. I was equating the appearance of two behaviors independent of order. What Moses did looked the same as the magicians because the magicians copied him.

And I disagree on how the magicians did it. Yes there are many modern day magicians who use slight of hand - I just saw one at the fair even, but there are also those who utilize satanic forces. This latter group cannot do what God can do, but they can still do things that are beyond our physical capabilities. I'm not saying that what they present is necessarily always reality, though, because whatever powers they have they will use to deceive.

When it came to influencing nature, Satan was not able to do it without God's permission.

Satan cannot even touch a believer without the permission of God. Satan complained to the Lord about this.

Have you not put a fence around him and his house and all that he has, on every side? You have blessed the work of his hands, and his possessions have increased in the land​

Because he is a created being, Satan cannot read our thoughts. He is not all-knowing like the LORD. It is God alone that knows everything - including our thoughts. (cold reading!)

Daniel answered the king, "No wise men, enchanters, magicians, or diviners can show to the king the mystery that the king is asking, but there is a God in heaven who reveals mysteries, and He has disclosed to King Nebuchadnezzar what will happen at the end of days. Your dream and the visions of your head as you lay in bed were these"

satan has no true power.

 

[enril]

Don't be ridiculous. I spoke of actually truly reading somebody's soul, not lying to them. This was often done by prophets in the Bible. And I never called it 'cold reading,' that was your term apparently chosen to discredit the work of the Holy Spirit.

people have set rewards of hundreds of thousands of dollars, for anyone who can do a magic that cannot be proved false. it has been, I think, over 100 years. so far every magician failed. it was proven to be false.

 

[enril]

Don't be ridiculous. I spoke of actually truly reading somebody's soul, not lying to them. This was often done by prophets in the Bible. And I never called it 'cold reading,' that was your term apparently chosen to discredit the work of the Holy Spirit.

QUOTE A VERSE. man. I know they had true astrologers back then, but I have never heard of this.

 

[Ballaurena]

people have set rewards of hundreds of thousands of dollars, for anyone who can do a magic that cannot be proved false. it has been, I think, over 100 years. so far every magician failed. it was proven to be false.

I didn't say it wasn't false; I said it was a means beyond what we can do physically. For example, I have heard of spiritually compromised church services where things were made to glitter like gold. It was not real gold, obviously, but it was still supernatural that it was made to look that way.

 

[enril]

I didn't say it wasn't false; I said it was a means beyond what we can do physically. For example, I have heard of spiritually compromised church services where things were made to glitter like gold. It was not real gold, obviously, but it was still supernatural that it was made to look that way.

still lacking any in writing evidence, other than ''it is'' or ''I heard'' without grounding.
you mean the sun on crystal? or mirrors? what?

 

[Ballaurena]

QUOTE A VERSE. man. I know they had true astrologers back then, but I have never heard of this.

There was Jesus in the beginning of Matthew 9, and Elisha in second Kings 4:27 off the top of my head. It's 1:30 in the morning, though, and if you really want to know you will search for yourself, anyway, so that's all I'm gonna give.

 

[Ballaurena]

still lacking any in writing evidence, other than ''it is'' or ''I heard'' without grounding.
you mean the sun on crystal? or mirrors? what?

It isn't my job to prove anything to you. Rather I'm offering what I think and know to you for you to vet for yourself with God.

But no, there were no mirrors or anything like that involved. Don't you know that we are speaking of fallen angels, and God uses holy angels to protect us because they have abilities we don't?