Poll about how you see predestination/freewill

[Gideon300]

The Lord is not talking about "Gideon300" In Romans 8:29.

Time is God's creation. He dwells outside of time. He can stop time if He so chooses. Since that is so, He knows the end from the beginning - and everything in between. (Isaiah 46:10).

So I absolutely disagree with you. You God is too small.

 

[Komentaja]

I would agree with you, if you mean by "Church", the Universal Church that Christ is building.

For the Church is not a building. It is not an institution. It is not a man or a particular teacher. The Greek word translated Church, would be better translated "ASSEMBLY'. It simply means - where a group of believers come together. This could be anywhere. However, the "Universal Assembly", is every member (Believer), that will make up the completed Assembly of Jesus Christ. (Eph. 1:4)

Having said the above.. of course Rom. 8:28 is dealing with individuals. Individuals, Predestined to be fitted into that Universal Assembly were placed into His Son, by the Father, before the foundation of the world. All believers are Predestined - O.T. and N.T. believers - who are then Redeemed by Christ's Person and Work.

The confusion for most, in understanding this Doctrine of Salvation, stems not from Predestination or Election but from not knowing what to do with the subject of Regeneration. Most know what Conversion is but few really understand Regeneration and most Churches today do not teach it. I have had Pastors tell me, that they don't teach it because there congregation would not understand it. Sad is it not?

Any verse for the "before the foundation of the world?"

Ephesians 1:4 does not say you were chosen for salvation before the foundation of the world.

Let me quote the verse: "For he chose us IN HIM before the creation of the world to be holy and blameless in his sight. In love "

Bolded the key part which is, He chose us IN CHRIST. Christ is the elect one to whom we are connected to.

 

[Komentaja]

I voted for Arminianism because it seems to be the plain meaning of the text. You just read through the Bible and it seems like God knows the future but many times His will is rejected by the people and He commands the people to repent and turn which means He did not predestine everything that occurs and men have some level of free will.

 

[GWH]

I voted for Arminianism because it seems to be the plain meaning of the text. You just read through the Bible and it seems like God knows the future but many times His will is rejected by the people and He commands the people to repent and turn which means He did not predestine everything that occurs and men have some level of free will.

Amen, that is why I converted from believing the OSAS or P part of TULIP that as a Baptist I had been taught.
The critical "level" of FW is moral free will (MFW), so I identify as a biblical MFWist rather than an Arminian.