Persecution

[leonardronaldo]

Christians have a right to defend themselves from violence and rape whenever they can and the spiritual authority to create communities together in which justice is maintained.

It may seem like God's will to you for them to meekly pull down their pants, bend over, and allow themselves and their children to be robbed, raped, beaten, and finally murdered at will by non-Christians but that is NOT God's will. That's the devil's will.

As with so many of Christ's teachings self-defense is to be employed with wisdom, understanding, and tact when necessary but not as a tool of revenge.

For example, stopping a murderer from murdering your neighbor is a much greater display of love for your neighbor (and ultimately the murderer as it stops them from committing more murders) than standing around watching it happen and then allowing them to murder you afterwards to get rid of the witness which is nothing more than a cowardly perversion of true love and righteousness.

Stephen had no ability to prevent his stoning as he was not strong enough to stop the government from wrongly executing him. He would have if he could have and he would have been right to stop it if he could have. Stephen did what he could do which was to become a conduit and witness for God's truth and face that which he could not stop courageously.

since our flesh is of the world, and we live in the world, it might not be strange if the world hates Christians. (especially when the world has hated Christ for more than 2000 years)

 

[AgeofKnowledge]

No confidence in the flesh for salvation by works. No confidence in the Mosaic Law to earn God's favor. You need to put that in context which is Paul speaking against legalistic judaizers entering the early church agitating for circumcision and a return to the old covenant Mosaic law as a necessity for salvation and God's favor.

Philippians 3 NASB - The Goal of Life - Finally, my - Bible Gateway

"Beware of the dogs, beware of the evil workers, beware of the [SUP][a][/SUP]false circumcision; [SUP]3 [/SUP]for we are the true [SUP][b][/SUP]circumcision, who worship in the Spirit of God and glory in Christ Jesus and put no confidence in the flesh, [SUP]4 [/SUP]although I myself might have confidence even in the flesh. If anyone else has a mind to put confidence in the flesh, I far more: [SUP]5 [/SUP]circumcised the eighth day, of the nation of Israel, of the tribe of Benjamin, a Hebrew of Hebrews; as to the Law, a Pharisee; [SUP]6 [/SUP]as to zeal, a persecutor of the church; as to the righteousness which is in the Law, found blameless.

[SUP]7 [/SUP]But whatever things were gain to me, those things I have counted as loss for the sake of Christ. [SUP]8 [/SUP]More than that, I count all things to be loss [SUP][c][/SUP]in view of the surpassing value of [SUP][d][/SUP]knowing Christ Jesus my Lord, [SUP][e][/SUP]for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and count them but rubbish so that I may gain Christ, [SUP]9 [/SUP]and may be found in Him, not having a righteousness of my own derived from the Law, but that which is through faith in Christ, the righteousness which comes from God on the basis of faith, [SUP]10 [/SUP]that I may know Him and the power of His resurrection and [SUP][f][/SUP]the fellowship of His sufferings, being conformed to His death; [SUP]11 [/SUP][SUP][g][/SUP]in order that I may attain to the resurrection from the dead." -Philippians 3:2-11.

You're pulling part a verse out of context and assigning it a meaning it never had.

You need to man up.

understood, even though when it comes down to either take the mark of the beast and deny Christ are you willing to go to the death and or watch others die, and stand in Faith, while you are being asked to deny or you will be killed, saying where is your Lord to save you. He is not here and they put your loved one's in a burning oil pit, you watching as they are persecuted to death, suffering, dying slowly. What are you thinking you are going to do, you are tied up and can't save them unless you deny Christ, what are you going to do in that situation, hopefully never there in it, yet if it ever were, today is the day to know if you will go to the death as Abraham was willing even to kill his own Son. in belief that god is able to raise him back to life if god so chooses.
Now brother that is Faith in the living God is it not? So again are you ready, after caught if you are here during this time of full pledge persecution. Remember Columbine, and that girl they killed that said no way in denying Christ.
Are we ready and reckon by Christ through death, burial resurrection, and his ascension, that we are saved by God the Father through this, no work ever of our own? Flesh attitude dead and Spirit of God alive in us, living through us in God's power, not any of my own. Put no confidence in the flesh
Philippians 3:3 For we are the circumcision, which worship God in the spirit, and rejoice in Christ Jesus, and have no confidence in the flesh.

 

[AgeofKnowledge]

 

[ChristianUk13]

Christians have a right to defend themselves from violence and rape whenever they can and the spiritual authority to create communities together in which justice is maintained....

I think the answer is to listen to God and let Him direct your steps concerning any persecution. The bible says do not fear him who kills the body, but fear Him who can destroy the soul in hell. I think this is a difficult issue. We loves our families and friends and don't want any harm to come to them. It really is for the believer to determine which action to take. If you believe God is permitting you to defend yourself, then act on that. It's likely a persecution which is not world-wide as in Revelation 13 type, may permit us to defend ourselves and family. We have to be so careful before we act out in the flesh.

....It may seem like God's will to you for them to meekly pull down their pants, bend over, and allow themselves and their children to be robbed, raped, beaten, and finally murdered at will by non-Christians but that is NOT God's will. That's the devil's will....

I think what the bible has to say about persecution and listening to the holy spirit is more important. It may be that God is directing to you protect yourself.

.....As with so many of Christ's teachings self-defense is to be employed with wisdom, understanding, and tact when necessary but not as a tool of revenge.....

....Stephen had no ability to prevent his stoning as he was not strong enough to stop the government from wrongly executing him. He would have if he could have and he would have been right to stop it if he could have.

Stephen on his stoning, looked up to heaven and smiled. It doesn't mean that God has called us to be martyrs unless He tells you, 'ie "he who has an ear let him hear." Paul was tortured as was Paul, and I think all of the disciples were too. Peter was hung upside down. We love our families and don't want any harm to come to them. Self defence may be what God tells you to do. The believer, whether affecting any persecution in India or the Indian person him or her self, has to decide what to do with the consultation of the holy spirit.

Stephen did what he could do which was to become a conduit and witness for God's truth and face that which he could not stop courageously.

Persecutions will become more frequent in these latter days; but this is not to be confused with the great tribulation which is likely to cause those Christians who are not rooted in Him to fall away from the faith. Here's what the bible actually states about the coming great tribulation. It is likely the following is the Holy Spirit's instructions in the tribulation, not to fight back, but to just endure it. The key words you'll see are 'endurance' and 'faith' of 'the saints.'

Revelation 13: verses 9 & 10 are translated here from the original Greek. Verse 9: "Hewho has an ear let him hear. Verse 10: "If anyone [is to go] into captivity into captivity he goes; If anyone with [the] sword will kill, it behoves him with [the] sword to be killed. Here is the endurance and the faith of the saint." Revelation 13:10 Greek Text Analysis

I wonder if Christians will even listen to what the bible says about tribulation, or just try to save their flesh by thinking they're to use self-defence.

 

[AgeofKnowledge]

If your post is directed at me ChristianUk13, I've got you on ignore. You defiled yourself so badly in my thread on the IMF with your trolling and ad hominem that I had no choice but to put you on ignore. I hope you can grow up and stop acting ungodly with such awful behavior but that choice is, as always, completely your own since you are far away and I don't have the ability to approach you and hold you accountable for your bad behavior.

But here we are again with the spotlight on UK13 and his behavior. Anyways, prayers toward that endeavor. I'll unignore you at some point in the future and see if you've grown any or are still acting badly. Peace.

 

[AgeofKnowledge]

Everyone else, MAN UP. Lol.

 

[ChristianUk13]

If your post is directed at me ChristianUk13, I've got you on ignore. You defiled yourself so badly in my thread on the IMF with your trolling and ad hominem that I had no choice but to put you on ignore. I hope you can grow up and stop acting ungodly with such awful behavior but that choice is, as always, completely your own since you are far away and I don't have the ability to approach you and hold you accountable for your bad behavior.

Defiled? A0G was being derogatory to a lady, using patronising language towards her. I just used what he said against himself. I then moved on...whereas he seems to be stuck there, as though he has a rather large chip on his shoulders.

....But here we are again with the spotlight on UK13 and his behavior. Anyways, prayers toward that endeavor. I'll unignore you at some point in the future and see if you've grown any or are still acting badly. Peace.

The epitome of childishness is to ignore when another challenges ideas.

 

[AgeofKnowledge]

Sorry, just over an hour isn't possibly enough time for you to grow up from the trolling, butting into people's personal conversations and diverting threads off track into personal wars, slinging ad hominem, etc... you engage in. Hopefully you're working on it though I would bet money there's no sign yet of any improvement. Focus harder.

 

[AgeofKnowledge]

Interestingly, Christianity is India's third-largest religion (as per the census of 2001) with approximately 24 million followers but because of India's large population that is only about 2.3 per cent of India's population.

Here's a fresh case of religious persecution against a poor 50 year old woman minding her own business trying to get home: India: Violence against Christians on the rise in Karnataka | Christian News on Christian Today

Incidents of violence against Christians in India's Karnataka state have spiked since June, including hospitalisation of a school helper this month after Hindu extremists beat her and marched her through the streets.

According to a story by Morning Star News, Hindu extremists kicked and punched the 50-year-old Christian woman, who goes by the name of Sannamma, after intercepting her in Chamrajnagar District on Sept. 13.

A resident of Kolipalya, Sannamma was in Nirayanpalya village to invite students back to school when a mob of about 40 Hindu nationalists stopped her and demanded she give money for a Hindu festival, a Christian leader said.

"Sannamma agreed to give them the money later, as she did not have any money with her at that time," area pastor Vincent Dass told Morning Star News.

However, the Hindu extremists began beating her, calling her "pagan," and accused her of forceful conversion. As they verbally abused Sannamma, the mob punched, kicked and shoved her around before dragging her to a Hindu temple.

There they tried to forcefully convert her back to Hinduism by pouring water on her as a symbol of religious cleansing from Christianity and applied a red dot on her forehead as a symbol of reconv ersion, Christian leaders said.

The Hindu extremists also forced Sannamma, who belongs to The Glorious Church, to sign a paper stating that she and her husband, Shidda Naik, would not spread word of Christianity. Her husband, however, was not with her at the time of the attack, Christian leaders said.

After that they dragged her out from the temple and marched her around the village again, continuing to slap and push her.

"The attack against her lasted more than six hours, until she was finally rescued by her sister-in- law," Morning Star News reported Pastor Dass said.

She was rushed to the hospital, where she was treated for internal injuries and multiple contusions. Sannamma spoke of pain in her throat, inner chest and back, and doctors said she would require bed rest for some time.

"What I am suffering is nothing compared to what my Lord Jesus has suffered," Sannamma, who became a Christian eight years ago, told Morning Star News.

She added, "I will love him forever for giving me a new life."

Police registered a First Information Report against four attackers, attorney Moses Muragavel of the Karnataka Legal Aid Cell said.

Hello everybody,

As we all know India is predominately a Hindu nation. There is a very small percentage of Christians in India. I wanted to know from your personal experience, if you were ever persecuted for being a Christian? Like in school, college, job or any other place.

My mother was given a very hard time at her job, back when we were in India. She was the only woman in her dept who also was a Christian. Her colleagues used to give her hard time because of that fact.

Looking forward to your responses.

Praying for revival in the entire land of India!!!

 

[homwardbound]

Unfortunately, to live Godly life, according to Jesus and Paul, we are gonna be persecuted

Yes I know and accept it, God to me knows what is best for me, I trust this, no matter what and Thank you

 

[homwardbound]

No confidence in the flesh for salvation by works. No confidence in the Mosaic Law to earn God's favor. You need to put that in context which is Paul speaking against legalistic judaizers entering the early church agitating for circumcision and a return to the old covenant Mosaic law as a necessity for salvation and God's favor.

Philippians 3 NASB - The Goal of Life - Finally, my - Bible Gateway

"Beware of the dogs, beware of the evil workers, beware of the [SUP][a][/SUP]false circumcision; [SUP]3 [/SUP]for we are the true [SUP][b][/SUP]circumcision, who worship in the Spirit of God and glory in Christ Jesus and put no confidence in the flesh, [SUP]4 [/SUP]although I myself might have confidence even in the flesh. If anyone else has a mind to put confidence in the flesh, I far more: [SUP]5 [/SUP]circumcised the eighth day, of the nation of Israel, of the tribe of Benjamin, a Hebrew of Hebrews; as to the Law, a Pharisee; [SUP]6 [/SUP]as to zeal, a persecutor of the church; as to the righteousness which is in the Law, found blameless.

[SUP]7 [/SUP]But whatever things were gain to me, those things I have counted as loss for the sake of Christ. [SUP]8 [/SUP]More than that, I count all things to be loss [SUP][c][/SUP]in view of the surpassing value of [SUP][d][/SUP]knowing Christ Jesus my Lord, [SUP][e][/SUP]for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and count them but rubbish so that I may gain Christ, [SUP]9 [/SUP]and may be found in Him, not having a righteousness of my own derived from the Law, but that which is through faith in Christ, the righteousness which comes from God on the basis of faith, [SUP]10 [/SUP]that I may know Him and the power of His resurrection and [SUP][f][/SUP]the fellowship of His sufferings, being conformed to His death; [SUP]11 [/SUP][SUP][g][/SUP]in order that I may attain to the resurrection from the dead." -Philippians 3:2-11.

You're pulling part a verse out of context and assigning it a meaning it never had.

You need to man up.

No, for the doorway to new life is through the death, burial and resurrection of Christ proof at the day of Pentecost, for they knew the truth, but had to wait fro what? The resurrected Christ and Father coming to live in and through them, and that day came to be at Pentecost and is still today very real, not as in the hoopla of being excited in and of the flesh, rather of the Spirit of God that today is:
Acts 2:17 And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams:

Either one lives by the Spirit of God or by one's own flesh. The choice to be one or the other can only be made daily. as we do not know what the future holds as to what we will do or not do, therefore I as Paul die daily to self. being thus co-crucified with my Lord Jesus and as you put in Phil 3, Life new is secured through death re-read phil 3:10-11. Are you conformed to his death yet? No confidence in flesh Brother none

 

[homwardbound]

Flesh fighting flesh is destruction while is already born dead to begin with
2 Corinthians 5:14 For the love of Christ constraineth us; because we thus judge, that if one died for all, then were all dead:
2 Corinthians 5:15 and that he died for all, that they which live should not henceforth live unto themselves, but unto him which died for them, and rose again.

 

[homwardbound]

Everyone else, MAN UP. Lol.

For me I am Spiritually up, thanks to my savior Jesus Christ,
for I am:
Romans 6:11 Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.

And since I am:
Romans 5:10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.

Thanks for all your input, for each see differently and are to be here to help each other in each of our growths, taking all that is said to God to sort any error(s) from truth, and live by his power not our own. For it is the truth that sets one free is it not? And is it not God that knows the whole truth? Therefore I have decided to trust God, as you might have as well, Thanks

 

[AgeofKnowledge]

One cannot legitimately misinterpret or pull out of context scripture to escape their duty to stand against evil both spiritually and in the flesh. That is a gnostic worldview NOT a Christian one.

"‎Bad men need nothing more to compass their ends, than that good men should look on and do nothing." - John Stuart Mill

 

[homwardbound]

One cannot legitimately misinterpret or pull out of context scripture to escape their duty to stand against evil both spiritually and in the flesh. That is a gnostic worldview NOT a Christian one.

"‎Bad men need nothing more to compass their ends, than that good men should look on and do nothing." - John Stuart Mill

By Christ done:
John 8:32 and ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

Thanking God I am free in God by belief in God's finished work at the cross where he triumphed over evil.
2 Corinthians 2:14 Now thanks be unto God, which always causeth us to triumph in Christ, and maketh manifest the savour of his knowledge by us in every place
Colossians 2:15 and having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it.

 

[AgeofKnowledge]

What does that have to do with standing against evil? My point is that as salt and light we stand for what is good and against what is evil in this world including what we do and say.

By Christ done:
John 8:32 and ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

Thanking God I am free in God by belief in God's finished work at the cross where he triumphed over evil.
2 Corinthians 2:14 Now thanks be unto God, which always causeth us to triumph in Christ, and maketh manifest the savour of his knowledge by us in every place
Colossians 2:15 and having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it.

 

[homwardbound]

What does that have to do with standing against evil? My point is that as salt and light we stand for what is good and against what is evil in this world including what we do and say.

And that is by the power of God through the Holy Ghost and not man's wisdom ever. thanks

 

[HeIsNowHere]

Never give up on anyone. There really are no atheists as everyone knows deep inside of God. Ever met a 7 or 8 year old atheist? I bet not. This has to be learned. But still there are many doubts. But this is blindness as they simply have not seen the light. They may never see the light or suddenly one day it just comes on for them. Pray for them and feel free to turn them over to God but never give up.

 

[jurez]

Hello everybody,

As we all know India is predominately a Hindu nation. There is a very small percentage of Christians in India. I wanted to know from your personal experience, if you were ever persecuted for being a Christian? Like in school, college, job or any other place.

My mother was given a very hard time at her job, back when we were in India. She was the only woman in her dept who also was a Christian. Her colleagues used to give her hard time because of that fact.

Looking forward to your responses.

Praying for revival in the entire land of India!!!

True in india stats it say 3% Christians, 17% Muslims, 80% Hindus it is difficult, I got converted to christian, it is 9 years back and I am alone got converted at home, it is quite difficult at home because they thought I am different, but grace of god I overwhelm through faith, hoping on god in all things

 

[Jackson123]

In August 2008, i ran away with my sisters and my dad and mom run away in another direction, we went to a nearby Jungle,when people came in larges numbers, with weapons we in that jungle stayed there without proper food and clothes, i was wearing the same shirt and pant for about 15 days, i was about to be bitten by a snake, i had brain malaria, there was severe stomach ache because of the food that i ate their. my sisters were in constant fear, we went to our own house after 2 months, the people were searching us, you know many people refused to give us shelter but God send some to give us food and shelter, our church believers backslided due to threat of life, our house and the church was destroyed, in other parts of orissa many things happened, to the pastors and nuns and to many brothers and sisters in christ, many were in Jungles, they were tortured raped in front of their families, beheaded, and many lost there property and were in shock, i wish i could show you the pictures and videos of the persecution

I heard some people say, persecution is a blessing, it is scary but there is a blessing in the persecution like what Jesus said

Mathew [SUP]10[/SUP] Blessed are they which are persecuted for righteousness' sake: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.[SUP]11[/SUP] Blessed are ye, when men shall revile you, and persecute you, and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake.
[SUP]12[/SUP] Rejoice, and be exceeding glad: for great is your reward in heaven: for so persecuted they the prophets which were before you.

Also I read from people who are experience being persecute like you, and may be it is your experience to,that persecution unite Chrisitan. They experience how they love each other like never before.