Once saved always saved (OSAS) debunked
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Notice the compound fracture of 2 Important words together in ONE SINGLE THOUGHT:
[(DRAW HIM)]
That is still the getting your attention while the Father Invites you to Follow the Son.
Draws Him, tells us, HIM who is being DRAWN TO JESUS has made up his mind to ACCEPT the Father's Invitation.
That is so clear, that all the blind people mentioned in the days of Jesus could read that Passage and know for certain because they made the SAME CHOICE [they were Healed/Sins Forgiven] Followers of Christ.
Your Faith has Made You Whole/Healed/Sins Forgiven...
[(DRAW HIM)]
That is still the getting your attention while the Father Invites you to Follow the Son.
Draws Him, tells us, HIM who is being DRAWN TO JESUS has made up his mind to ACCEPT the Father's Invitation.
That is so clear, that all the blind people mentioned in the days of Jesus could read that Passage and know for certain because they made the SAME CHOICE [they were Healed/Sins Forgiven] Followers of Christ.
Your Faith has Made You Whole/Healed/Sins Forgiven...
Waat? No way! You're stretching it into a pretzel to get it to say what you want it to. Their acceptance has nothing to do with it.
They come to Christ only because they've heard and learned of the Father. Only those indwelt by the Holy Spirt can learn
or hear and come to Christ - meaning that they ALREADY were saved/born-again. If not taught by the Father, then they
will not come to Christ- not everyone is so taught. And because of that, they will be raised on the last day.
Look at verse 6:45.
45 It is written in the prophets, And they shall be all taught of God. Every man therefore that hath heard, and hath learned of the Father, cometh unto me.
They come to Christ only because they've heard and learned of the Father. Only those indwelt by the Holy Spirt can learn
or hear and come to Christ - meaning that they ALREADY were saved/born-again. If not taught by the Father, then they
will not come to Christ- not everyone is so taught. And because of that, they will be raised on the last day.
Look at verse 6:45.
45 It is written in the prophets, And they shall be all taught of God. Every man therefore that hath heard, and hath learned of the Father, cometh unto me.
I am doing no such thing at all.
You are trying to ignore what the process of Drawing Someone to Christ actually is. It's an Experience where God's Love is most abundant and His presence around you,, within you,, where You say, Let Your Will be DONE, FATHER!
You yield completely to God!
He Breaks you down and begins to Mold You into His Plan for you.
It's complete submission.
That is the Greatest Choice you will ever make is by submitting to Him!
You are trying to ignore what the process of Drawing Someone to Christ actually is. It's an Experience where God's Love is most abundant and His presence around you,, within you,, where You say, Let Your Will be DONE, FATHER!
You yield completely to God!
He Breaks you down and begins to Mold You into His Plan for you.
It's complete submission.
That is the Greatest Choice you will ever make is by submitting to Him!
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Okay, just so that I understand your point, which do you think is dependent upon the other - that becoming born-again a prerequisite for the "process"(as you call it), or do you think the "process" a prerequisite to becoming born-again (remembering that to be born again is also to have been saved).
By the way, God doesn't offer invitations for salvation. He, being God, makes born-again whomever He had so chosen for it, whenever He chooses to do so.
By the way, God doesn't offer invitations for salvation. He, being God, makes born-again whomever He had so chosen for it, whenever He chooses to do so.
No, your first sentence was correct in that He can do as He pleases and so He does.
Someone spiritually dead cannot make a correct spiritual choice. It is not that God forces anyone as you
chose to frame it, rather, it is that He gives spiritual life from spiritual death to those whom He has so chosen for it.
After which, they become beyond overjoyed and not the least bit unhappy or angry that it occurred.
Did Saul ask God on the road to Damascus whether He could enter-in, did He give Saul a choice, or did God just save him
because He had so chosen it for him? It works in the same manner for all who become saved/born-again.
Someone spiritually dead cannot make a correct spiritual choice. It is not that God forces anyone as you
chose to frame it, rather, it is that He gives spiritual life from spiritual death to those whom He has so chosen for it.
After which, they become beyond overjoyed and not the least bit unhappy or angry that it occurred.
Did Saul ask God on the road to Damascus whether He could enter-in, did He give Saul a choice, or did God just save him
because He had so chosen it for him? It works in the same manner for all who become saved/born-again.
John 10:28 says "no one" can be snatched from Jesus' hand as the good Shepherd. No one also includes the person he's talking about. Your explanation does not make any sense. Also, you neglect to quote John 6:
Joh 6:37 All that the Father gives me will come to me, and whoever comes to me I will never cast out.
Joh 6:38 For I have come down from heaven, not to do my own will but the will of him who sent me.
Joh 6:39 And this is the will of him who sent me, that I should lose nothing of all that he has given me, but raise it up on the last day.
Joh 6:40 For this is the will of my Father, that everyone who looks on the Son and believes in him should have eternal life, and I will raise him up on the last day.” All believers will be part of the resurrection of the body to live forever in the new heavens and the new earth (Revelation 21-22). Jesus won't lose any of them that the Father has given to him.
Joh 6:37 All that the Father gives me will come to me, and whoever comes to me I will never cast out.
Joh 6:38 For I have come down from heaven, not to do my own will but the will of him who sent me.
Joh 6:39 And this is the will of him who sent me, that I should lose nothing of all that he has given me, but raise it up on the last day.
Joh 6:40 For this is the will of my Father, that everyone who looks on the Son and believes in him should have eternal life, and I will raise him up on the last day.” All believers will be part of the resurrection of the body to live forever in the new heavens and the new earth (Revelation 21-22). Jesus won't lose any of them that the Father has given to him.
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But how you explain the process of God forcing people to Believe in Him is literally not found anywhere in the Bible.
In fact, there's nothing that states God forces people to believe.
There's nothing that even states God makes people believe in Him.
Your Doctrine is a Lie that cannot be found anywhere in the Holy Word of God.
In fact, there's nothing that states God forces people to believe.
There's nothing that even states God makes people believe in Him.
Your Doctrine is a Lie that cannot be found anywhere in the Holy Word of God.
Oh yes indeed there is - it is plainly stated in multiple verses - there are many others besides the below.
BTW- The fruit of the Spirit is only given by being indwelt by the Holy Spirit upon becoming born-again.
[Gal 5:22 KJV] 22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,
[1Pe 1:21 KJV] 21 Who by him do believe in God, that raised him up from the dead, and gave him glory; that your faith and hope might be in God.
[Jhn 6:29 KJV] 29 Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent.
[Gal 2:16 KJV] 16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.
BTW- The fruit of the Spirit is only given by being indwelt by the Holy Spirit upon becoming born-again.
[Gal 5:22 KJV] 22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,
[1Pe 1:21 KJV] 21 Who by him do believe in God, that raised him up from the dead, and gave him glory; that your faith and hope might be in God.
[Jhn 6:29 KJV] 29 Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent.
[Gal 2:16 KJV] 16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.
I agree, there would be no other way because I don't think Father would've accepted Jesus' sacrifice were Jesus not submitting His own will to His Father's, in faith.
Jesus could've lived forever while the rest of the world, one by one, died around Him to perpetuity.
Romans 5:
The Triumph of Faith
1Therefore, since we have been justified through faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ, 2through whom we have gained access by faith into this grace in which we stand. And we rejoice in the hope of the glory of God.
Christ’s Sacrifice for the Ungodly
9Therefore, since we have now been justified by His blood, how much more shall we be saved from wrath through Him! 10For if, when we were enemies of God, we were reconciled to Him through the death of His Son, how much more, having been reconciled, shall we be saved through His life! 11Not only that, but we also rejoice in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom we have now received reconciliation.
Death in Adam, Life in Christ
12Therefore, just as sin entered the world through one man, and death through sin, so also death was passed on to all men, because all sinned. 13For sin was in the world before the law was given; but sin is not taken into account when there is no law. 14Nevertheless, death reigned from Adam until Moses, even over those who did not sin in the way that Adam transgressed. He is a pattern of the One to come.
15But the gift is not like the trespass. For if the many died by the trespass of the one man, how much more did God’s grace and the gift that came by the grace of the one man, Jesus Christ, abound to the many!
Jesus could've lived forever while the rest of the world, one by one, died around Him to perpetuity.
Romans 5:
The Triumph of Faith
1Therefore, since we have been justified through faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ, 2through whom we have gained access by faith into this grace in which we stand. And we rejoice in the hope of the glory of God.
Christ’s Sacrifice for the Ungodly
9Therefore, since we have now been justified by His blood, how much more shall we be saved from wrath through Him! 10For if, when we were enemies of God, we were reconciled to Him through the death of His Son, how much more, having been reconciled, shall we be saved through His life! 11Not only that, but we also rejoice in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom we have now received reconciliation.
Death in Adam, Life in Christ
12Therefore, just as sin entered the world through one man, and death through sin, so also death was passed on to all men, because all sinned. 13For sin was in the world before the law was given; but sin is not taken into account when there is no law. 14Nevertheless, death reigned from Adam until Moses, even over those who did not sin in the way that Adam transgressed. He is a pattern of the One to come.
15But the gift is not like the trespass. For if the many died by the trespass of the one man, how much more did God’s grace and the gift that came by the grace of the one man, Jesus Christ, abound to the many!
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