Not By Works

[joefizz]

Maybe pick up a book for some relaxing reading, eh?

If you insist,sure I'll read the phone book,it's so mind stimulating,and there are slight changes every year to keep my interest!

 

[NoNameMcgee]

Then why did Jesus even bother with the sermon on the mount?

Then why did Jesus even bother telling us to repent?

Then why did Jesus even bother telling us to be baptized?

If all there is, is I believe, I am saved, and now I can go back to being a couch potato. What's the reason to live any more?

you wouldnt want to love Him for loving you first?

that doesnt sound like a new heart to me....

if you have issues with all the scriptures i posted

maybe we can talk about them

not lean on our own understanding

 

[dcontroversal]

Then why did Jesus even bother with the sermon on the mount?

Then why did Jesus even bother telling us to repent?

Then why did Jesus even bother telling us to be baptized?

If all there is, is I believe, I am saved, and now I can go back to being a couch potato. What's the reason to live any more?

No body teaches this......and that is not the point of this thread...it is about how one is biblcally saved....not what happens after salvation.....Ephesians is clear...

SAVED unto good works
not
SAVED by good works

Salvation is based entirely upon faith.

It pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to same them that believe.

 

[MHz]

If you insist,sure I'll read the phone book,it's so mind stimulating,and there are slight changes every year to keep my interest!

Whatever floats your boat.

 

[NoNameMcgee]

We are discussing how one is saved, Not the results of salvation.

That would be another thread.

amen



the fruits of the spirit are a wonderful gift for those God who God has already started in

 

[NoNameMcgee]

ohhhhh
by the way ben hur

have you been here before?

 

[joefizz]

Yes, there is a sin Jesus did not pay the penalty for.

Jesus did not pay the penalty for rejecting Jesus Christ.

That is the sin that man alone will bear. There is no sacrifice for that.

Alrighty Ralph finally established that he believes that Jesus didn't die for all our sins,thereby throwing out his entire doctrine.
And here I thought he was gonna be a smarty pants a little longer.

 

[benhur]

its about those who CLAIM to have faith. Not about those who actually do hae faith.

So does James tell us how we can all know if a man has faith?

 

[joefizz]

Alrighty Ralph finally established that he believes that Jesus didn't die for all our sins,thereby throwing out his entire doctrine.
And here I thought he was gonna be a smarty pants a little longer.

Oh and Ralphie boy in case you wanna try disputing this "don't bother" Jesus died for "all sin" including rejection of himself,after all while on the cross he died for "everyone" including the ones who denied him such as peter and thomas and those who mocked him and rejected him before he gave up the ghost!

 

[benhur]

ohhhhh
by the way ben hur

have you been here before?

Yes, many years ago.

 

[joefizz]

Whatever floats your boat.

Boats float?
I thought they sailed?

 

[joefizz]

ohhhhh
by the way ben hur

have you been here before?

No name and his run on puns...

 

[eternally-gratefull]

So does James tell us how we can all know if a man has faith?

He was not telling you or me how we can know someone else has faith, that was not his purpose, He was speaking to people who CLAIMED to have faith, But were hears of the word not doers. He asked them the question. Can your faith save you (if you are hearers only not doers)

Then he told them to SHow James their faith. He he will show them his.

What does the Bible say about faith?

1. It works, it does not sit idle. Heb 11 shows us the faith hall of fame, by showing that people who trust God actually do things he asks them to.
2. Faith as small as a mustard seed can move a mountain, So how much faith does it take to be saved? Well according to james, any faith that is more than combed faith (has more than zero zip nada works) is enough to save you
3. That Abraham was saved before he did one work, and after his work, he commited a lot of pretty serious sins, Yet he also did some pretty serious works (which are all written down for us to see)

James did not contradict paul,

 

[BillG]

OSAS believer ....is ....clearly not scriptural, is the greatest sham against the written, as well as intent, of G-d's word ever to come down the Christian belief trail. It will account for a great percentage of lost souls if permitted to exist. The Bible says.....put on the coat of armor daily..........we must maintain the good fight until the end........allow no man to take your ccrowns...et al.

The... OSAS believers...which seem to have evolved since the 1960's....is a prime example of ....they will be sent great delusions at the end times.

No doubt ...along with all the other converging end time signs, for the first time in history........we are there.

Neither is that works save us scriptural.

That's what the Pharisees thought that and accused others who were not like them.

I am OSAS so according to you I'm going to hell yet you know nothing about me and my walk and how I walk with people.
And I know nothing about you and your walk either.

Maybe just maybe those who fall foul of "My works save me?

Will be walking on the wide road with the OSAS.

I say just maybe because I think God sees beyond the outward and sees the heart.

 

[NoNameMcgee]

Neither is that works save us scriptural.

That's what the Pharisees thought that and accused others who were not like them.

I am OSAS so according to you I'm going to hell yet you know nothing about me and my walk and how I walk with people.
And I know nothing about you and your walk either.

Maybe just maybe those who fall foul of "My works save me?

Will be walking on the wide road with the OSAS.

I say just maybe because I think God sees beyond the outward and sees the heart.

the broad road...

well

id say thats the worldly walk with no faith at all
or faith in the world like evolution
or random other theories
false gods <- like muslim (based in works)
or sects of catholics who believe their works save them
or "sinless perfectionists"
jews who reject Jesus
people who think saying a sinners prayer saves them (works)

shoot

sooo many involve worldly desires
and working their way in


id say the narrow path

is Jesus Christ

....

Him alone

 

[BillG]

Yay my day is totally ruined,I'm going to stay so upset,and cry and whine and type run on sentences,wa wahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh boo hoo,so Billy Green why are you taking my job I'm the "date ruiner"!?(ruin people's days)

Just drink some warm prune juice

 

[MichaelOwen]

Yay my day is totally ruined,I'm going to stay so upset,and cry and whine and type run on sentences,wa wahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh boo hoo,so Billy Green why are you taking my job I'm the "date ruiner"!?(ruin people's days)

Want some gouda cheese with that whine? Haha Love you Joe!

 

[joefizz]

UnderGrace, eternally-grateful, stonesoffire, decontroversal, Rosemaryx, Lucy-Pevensie, ljs:

From https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perseverance_of_the_saints#Free_Grace_doctrine

The Free Grace or non-traditional Calvinist doctrine has been espoused by Charles Stanley, Norman Geisler, Zane C. Hodges, Bill Bright, and others. This view, like the traditional Calvinist view, emphasizes that people are saved purely by an act of divine grace that does not depend at all on the deeds of the individual, and for that reason, advocates insist that nothing the person can do can affect his or her salvation.
The Free Grace doctrine views the person's character and life after receiving the gift of salvation as independent from the gift itself, which is the main point of differentiation from the traditional Calvinist view, or, in other words, it asserts that justification (that is, being declared righteous before God on account of Christ) does not necessarily result in sanctification (that is, a progressively more righteous life). Charles Stanley, pastor of Atlanta's megachurch First Baptist and a television evangelist, has written that the doctrine of eternal security of the believer persuaded him years ago to leave his familial Pentecostalism and become a Southern Baptist. He sums up his deep conviction that salvation is by faith alone in Christ alone when he claims, "Even if a believer for all practical purposes becomes an unbeliever, his salvation is not in jeopardy… believers who lose or abandon their faith will retain their salvation."[SUP][6][/SUP] For example, Stanley writes:

Look at that verse [John 3:18] and answer this question: According to Jesus, what must a person do to keep from being judged for sin? Must he stop doing something? Must he promise to stop doing something? Must he have never done something? The answer is so simple that many stumble all over it without ever seeing it. All Jesus requires is that the individual "believe in" Him.
— Charles Stanley[SUP][6][/SUP] (p. 67).
​

In a chapter entitled "For Those Who Stop Believing", he says, "The Bible clearly teaches that God's love for His people is of such magnitude that even those who walk away from the faith have not the slightest chance of slipping from His hand (p. 74)." A little later, Stanley also writes: "You and I are not saved because we have an enduring faith. We are saved because at a moment in time we expressed faith in our enduring Lord" (p. 80).


Now maybe you all can see you have been pushing Freegrace doctrine in this thread.......and getting away with it.

Do yourself a favor and at least go back to traditional 'P' once saved always saved. At least that doctrine doesn't have people living in sin and them still being saved.

ooooooo so Impressive a Wikipedia link,how very wise,a site that is untrustworthy because anyone can change what is written at any time,and the credibility goes down further.....

 

[BillG]

Whatever floats your boat.

We say that over here.
I remember once on another forum a thread was started about worship.

Basically it what was right and what was wrong.
I shall rephrase what the poster was saying "Worship this way and it's wrong"

I responded "What ever floats your boat, if it's genuine worship that draws you close to God then go for it"

I was surprised by how many admonished me.

I was so because of "Whatever floats your boat" apparently offensive and inappropriate.

To float ones boat

"Whatever soothes your soul or works best for you"

I didn't bother to respond.
Seems to me they missed the point and added a different meaning adding to it "This is the only way to worship"

No point arguing

 

[benhur]

Alrighty Ralph finally established that he believes that Jesus didn't die for all our sins,thereby throwing out his entire doctrine.
And here I thought he was gonna be a smarty pants a little longer.

It seems that if a man does not believe in Jesus, (rejecting Jesus is worse because you have been given knowledge and understanding about him and you unilaterally reject him as your Savior) Jesus's sacrifice will not save that unbeliever in the KOH. IOW the first law of salvation is to believe that Jesus can save you. Am I right?

Do you believe that Jesus died for unbelievers?

Also, I believe that a good Christian would not use words like 'smarty pants' when referring to another Christian on the forum.