Not By Works

[PHart]

Pleasing the one who died to cover your past sins "doesn't interest you much"?

No. Arguing that that one can never sin again is what doesn't interest me.

Wouldn't a complete escape from sin solve yours and their problem entirely?

One step at a time...

It solved my drunkenness and adultery and drug abuse and lying and thievery and porn addiction and vile affections.
Thanks be to God!

And that's wonderful. I'm not going to take that away from you and insist you have to be like the rest of us who have struggled with, or are struggling with sin. I don't think Jesus was lying when he spoke of the 4th type of soil, so I'm not coming against that. I'm coming into that blessed place myself. But you just have to accept that we all have our different timetables and paths to that victory in Christ. Surely you have noticed that I'm not taking the pessimistic view of many Christians who have resigned themselves to a life of defeat. I'm not on board with that at all. But I'm keenly aware of the different rates of progress we're all going to make towards the 4th type of soil.

 

[PHart]

42000 posts! Woooooo!!!

And you said about as much in your post toward the resolution of the discussion that as all of us have in the 41999 posts before it, lol.

 

[PJW]

When you said you were sinless, you lied. There is no righteous, no not one...including YOU!
Time to add this log to my burn pile.
Adios senor...

I really hope you aren't accusing Jesus of sin.
Our past sins can be washed away, right?
Only a return to service to sin would change your status of "clean" after that.
That is why your repentance from sin must be real.
You can't go back.
And God makes it all possible!
It is written..."[FONT=&quot]There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear it." (1 Cor 10:13)
Look for the escapes God provides us to resist temptation.[/FONT]

 

[WineRose]

And you said about as much in your post toward the resolution of the discussion that as all of us have in the 41999 posts before it, lol.

Now, the REAL question is if this thread can reach 50000 posts...lol.

 

[PJW]

Sorry to disappoint you......until my body is redeemed I will carry a sin nature that occasionally wins because it is weak....maybe you like to disregard the words of Jesus in the garden..

You should have said..."Until I am reborn I will carry a sin nature..."
The new creature has a divine nature.
Peter and his fellows didn't get theirs till the day of Pentecost.

 

[PJW]

You just embellished John 8......is that not sin...adding to the word...if I remember right the context is being a disciple of JESUS.....

Hardly...
It is written..."And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.They answered him, We be Abraham's seed, and were never in bondage to any man: how sayest thou, Ye shall be made free?
Jesus answered them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whosoever committeth sin is the servant of sin."

The "truth" can free you from being a servant of sin.

 

[Stunnedbygrace]

Surely you can see that the areas of lack of trust after you met Him are different than your trust in the area of the forgiveness of your sins. The believer's struggle with, for example, believing for healing, is clearly different than a struggle with whether Christ has really forgiven all your sins and justified you before God.

You don't lose your salvation for not being able to trust God for a healing. That's clearly a different matter of trusting God than not being able to trust God for the forgiveness of your sins. One is not a matter of salvation. The other is. See the difference?

The most important trusting is that you are trusting God for the forgiveness of sin for all the times you weren't trusting him to provide in life what you need so you don't have to sin to get them. It's entirely possible to trust God for the forgiveness of sins and not trust him to make it so you don't have to sin to get what you need in this life. I'm confident that is exactly what is happening in your life. You have no problem trusting God for salvation, but you struggle with trusting that his grace is sufficient to get you through trials and temptations and sufferings without sinning. That is how all devout Christians struggle.

My areas of lack of trust after I met Him - this is unbelief. Whatever is not of belief is sin. I think we agree on this.

My unbelief and mistrust are sin. In your first sentence you say this sin is different than my trust in the forgiveness OF these sins.

These unbeliefs are sin.
I know these unbeliefs/sins are forgiven because of the Blood.

I'm trying here, but unbelief is unbelief. It is always sin. This is why I am utterly glad my sin is forgiven.

Maybe I need to come back to this with a fresh eye later. Your first sentence is an enigma to me. It seems to me like saying: surely you can see that your sin after you met Him is different than trusting your sin is forgiven. Yes, sin is different from trust in the Blood. Head ready to explode. This is very hard but I enjoy talking with you PH. Bedtime here.

 

[PJW]

For I am convinced that neither death nor life, neither angels nor demons,neither the present nor the future, nor any powers, neither height nor depth, nor anything else in all creation, will be able to separate us from the love of God that is in Christ Jesus our Lord.[Romans 8:38,39]

As Apostle Paul so poignantly stated, nothing can separate us from the love of God that is in Christ Jesus our Lord. That includes ourselves.

who through faith are shielded by God’s power until the coming of the salvation that is ready to be revealed in the last time. [1 Peter 1:5]

We are kept(shielded as the NIV puts it) by God's power through faith. Some, sadly, think faith is something that can be obtained. So, logically speaking, if something can be obtained, that something can be tossed aside. But faith is not something obtained, it is not something that is innate within man, but is a gift of God. And the gifts of God are irrevocable.[Romans 11:29]

That is why I am suffering as I am. Yet this is no cause for shame, because I know whom I have believed, and am convinced that he is able to guard what I have entrusted to him until that day.[2 Timothy 1:12]

Paul affirms God's sovereignity in the salvation of His elect. He knows that it is God who has his life in His hands, and He is able to guard them until the day of Judgment.

My sheep listen to my voice; I know them, and they follow me.I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; no one will snatch them out of my hand. My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all; no one can snatch them out of my Father’s hand. I and the Father are one.”[John 10:27-30]

No man, no man, including yourself, can take yourself out of God's hand.

This false earn it as you walk it garbage needs tossed out of our churches. God is not some patsy up there letting His elect die lost. His Son died for them, and it is impossible for one of His elect to die lost. Impossible.

Put that in your pipe and smoke it, phart.

The key to your thesis is "in Christ Jesus".
There are no murderers, liars, or adulterers etc. in Christ Jesus.

 

[PJW]

You are outta ya mind.....he was addressing believers and includes himself....My little children....man...you are entering the realm of cake taker....have not used that in a while.....like I used to......If we, if we, if we, if we, US, US, if we, if we us....

Can we walk in light and darkness at the same time?
John is addressing two kinds of walk.
To the glory of God, I chose to walk in the light; and those who cannot say they have no sin have chosen to walk in the darkness.

 

[PJW]

No. Arguing that that one can never sin again is what doesn't interest me.
One step at a time...
And that's wonderful. I'm not going to take that away from you and insist you have to be like the rest of us who have struggled with, or are struggling with sin.

Don't you mean "haven't repented of sin"?

I don't think Jesus was lying when he spoke of the 4th type of soil, so I'm not coming against that. I'm coming into that blessed place myself. But you just have to accept that we all have our different timetables and paths to that victory in Christ. Surely you have noticed that I'm not taking the pessimistic view of many Christians who have resigned themselves to a life of defeat. I'm not on board with that at all. But I'm keenly aware of the different rates of progress we're all going to make towards the 4th type of soil.

They are not Christians till they start obeying God.
If men commit sin, Jesus is not the One guiding them.

 

[Hizikyah]

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]John 3:36, “He who believes in the Son possesses everlasting life, but he who does not obey the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of Yah remains on him.”[/FONT]

 

[gb9]

I won't be judged for needing glasses or bad knees.
But the perfect in Christ Jesus will hear..."His lord said unto him, Well done, thou good and faithful servant: thou hast been faithful over a few things, I will make thee ruler over many things: enter thou into the joy of thy lord." {Matt 25:21)
How faithful are murderers and adulterers?

so, you want to talk about being perfect until someone properly defines it, then you want to change the subject.

how about , you know, being truthful, which would be a part of being perfectly righteous , and admit you were proven wrong.

but, in todays world, I guess to expect someone who names the name of Christ to tell the truth is asking too much.....

 

[stonesoffire]

No, there is hope for me, because my sin is covered by the blood of Christ because I continue to believe in it. But a willful return to the world in unbelief will most certainly separate me from the grace of God I presently have

Grace is Holy Spirit given to us. Why would you ever think that you would lose faith and go back into sin if you have tasted of grace, and know the words of eternal life, and know Jesus?

One who is a true believer will say the same as Peter. Where would I go? And it is He who chose us. He doesn't make mistakes. He's the perfect One.

 

[stonesoffire]

The language here is very provocative.
Now either dc wrote these tweets or he did not, fact.

Either this is a fair representation of who he really is or not.

My point is actually it fits his profile. But this is now slander and a grevious sin.
Not surprising churches get in a mess if this is enough to cause a problem.

And if quoting someone from twitter is the lowest thing ever on cc, you have not
seen some of the stuff that is posted. Talk about exaguration.

But I think this also makes my point about where your hearts are.
Walking with Christ is about walking in holiness, purity and love.

Listen to Paul

For he chose us in him before the creation of the world to be holy and blameless in his sight.
Eph 1:4

For God did not call us to be impure, but to live a holy life.
1 Thess 4:7

Make every effort to live in peace with everyone and to be holy; without holiness no one will see the Lord.
Heb 12:14

Do you know what this actually means?

I suggest not. These words appear to be far from your hearts.

Therefore, since we have these promises, dear friends, let us purify ourselves from everything that contaminates body and spirit, perfecting holiness out of reverence for God.
2 Cor 7:1

Praise the Lord that through the cross we have the victory over sin and death.

These are not idle words or promises with no reality. But for some it appears they
do not have faith to believe Christ can deliver this for them today. My encouragement
to you today is ask Jesus to show you the way, and He will, through His word.
It is His promise. Ask the Holy Spirit and He will deliver it to you.

~For he chose us in him before the creation of the world to be holy and blameless in his sight.
Eph 1:

Holy in His Holiness...blameless in His innocence.

Remember Peter, the animal sacrifices were before the age of three, before they could act out in their fallen nature too. For sin affected all the earth. So this is a picture of an exchange of our blame, for His innocence.

This is the simplicity of the gospel. You want to stand in your "holiness" before Father? Good luck with that. The blood on the mercy seat is our intercession before Him. Trust in His blood.

 

[stonesoffire]

John 3:36, “He who believes in the Son possesses everlasting life, but he who does not obey the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of Yah remains on him.”

Did you look at the word obey in the greek?

 

[stonesoffire]

Romans 6:21-22 What benefit did you reap at that time from the things you are NOW ASHAMED OF? Those things result in death! But now that you have been set free from sin and have become slaves to God, the benefit you reap leads to holiness, and the result is eternal life.

DO YOU EVER GET ASHAMED OF BEING A SINNER IN THE PAST OR ARE YOU PROUD THAT YOU ARE STILL ONE OF THEM NOW?

accusation- satan

 

[stonesoffire]

Does anyone have this strange share button that comes up at the bottom of this page? I clicked on it and it is a way to share this thread on several different sites like facebook, pininterest.

Am going to do it. lol

 

[Hizikyah]

Did you look at the word obey in the greek?

I will right now.

 

[SovereignGrace]

Welcome ladies and gentlemen to this infomercial!! I am you host, Chip Everready. On today's infomercial we are introducing you to a greatest hits selection of some oldies of yesteryear. Our featured artist today is Phart and the Self-Starters...

Our first song is titled "Working my way back to you Lord" and it was a top-10 hit amongst the Arminian churches...watch Phart lead them with his classic air guitar...look at the sweat dripping off of'm...

Next, we have a top-5 hit where Phart and the Self-Starters took a more somber approach as they sang "I ran out of works Lord, am I still saved?"...

To show Phart and the Self-Starters musical abilities, they sang the cover to a Queen song that shows what happens to those who run out of good works and die lost...

And the last hit on this album is their number 1 hit "I did it my way"...

So, you better hurry up while supplies last....

Pffffft!! Who am I kidding...

 

[Hizikyah]

Did you look at the word obey in the greek?

John 3:36, “He who believes in the Son possesses everlasting life, but he who does not obey the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of Yah remains on him.”

“does not obey” is word #544 - apeitheó: to disobey, Original Word: ἀπειθέω, Part of Speech: Verb, Transliteration: apeitheó, Phonetic Spelling: (ap-i-theh'-o), Short Definition: I disobey, rebel, am disloyal, Definition: I disobey, rebel, am disloyal, refuse conformity.

G544 ἀπειθέω apeitheo (a-pei-the'-ō) v., 1. to disbelieve (willfully and perversely)., 2. (by direct extension) to be willfully disobedient., [from G545], KJV: not believe, disobedient, obey not, unbelieving , Root(s): G545

I think it is properly consistent with faith in the Hebrew language and mindset, in Hebrew the word faith is to beleive and do

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Habakkuk 2:4, "Behold the proud, his soul is not right in him; but the just will live by faith."

“faith” is word #H530 Hebrew Word Study (Transliteration-Pronunciation Etymology & Grammar) 1) firmness, fidelity, steadfastness, steadiness

“faith” #H530 Brown-Driver-Briggs (Old Testament Hebrew-English Lexicon)
Feminine of H0529; literally firmness; figuratively security; moral fidelity:—faith (-ful, -ly, -ness, [man]), set office, stability, steady, truly, truth, verily.[/FONT]


Hebrews 3:3:18-19, “And to whom did He swear that they would not enter into His rest, but to those who did not obey? we see that they were unable to enter in because of unbelief."

It is seeminly in our modern mindset that believeing is somehow seperate from doing. I dont put my hand on the stove because I have faith it is hot.