Not By Works

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PJW

Banned
Oct 6, 2017
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For the record....I hate no one and I am the one who used the weed killer in comment concerning tares and wheat.....it was metaphorical and aimed at combatting what I believe to be false ideologies....if I offend you or any other in CC by that post

I humbly apologize openly for all to see.
No prob'
There are better ways to fight the fight.
Use scripture to validate your points.
That way we can go over them one at a time and hopefully come to the same conclusions.
 
Dec 12, 2013
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John was addressing those who walk in darkness.
Those who walk in the light have had ALL their sins washed away by the blood of Christ.
Why can't they say they have no sin?

Now I admit that not all supposed converts will remain in the light, but there are some who do.
To the glory of God and the name of Jesus Christ!
You are outta ya mind.....he was addressing believers and includes himself....My little children....man...you are entering the realm of cake taker....have not used that in a while.....like I used to......If we, if we, if we, if we, US, US, if we, if we us....
 
Dec 12, 2013
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On the one hand, I agree.
But you overlooked that Jesus specifically mentioned iniquity.
Iniquity is sin.
Men who say they are Christians, while still committing sin...were never Christians to begin with.
They trusted in their own works, false doctrines, and will suffer eternally for it.

Thank God for making a way to remain in the light, all the time!
They were found in iniquity because

a. THEY were never saved<--he never knew them
b. They trusted in self and works NOT JESUS

HE is the PAYMENT for the sins of the whole world.....
 

Seohce

Senior Member
Jul 15, 2016
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John was clear....Deceived and No truth <----all who say they have NO SIN........
Romans 6:21-22 What benefit did you reap at that time from the things you are NOW ASHAMED OF? Those things result in death! But now that you have been set free from sin and have become slaves to God, the benefit you reap leads to holiness, and the result is eternal life.

DO YOU EVER GET ASHAMED OF BEING A SINNER IN THE PAST OR ARE YOU PROUD THAT YOU ARE STILL ONE OF THEM NOW?
 
Dec 12, 2013
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You've neglected the final judgement all men will endure.. "But I say unto you, That every idle word that men shall speak, they shall give account thereof in the day of judgment. (Matt 12:36)
And..."For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God: and if it first begin at us, what shall the end be of them that obey not the gospel of God?" (1 Peter 4:17)
I have neglected nothing....if you make the final judgment your bumming...

saved -->BEMA seat <---THE following has NO POWER over the ones found here
LOST-->GREAT WHITE THRONE<--final judgment = 2nd death
 
Dec 12, 2013
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I won't be judged for needing glasses or bad knees.
But the perfect in Christ Jesus will hear..."His lord said unto him, Well done, thou good and faithful servant: thou hast been faithful over a few things, I will make thee ruler over many things: enter thou into the joy of thy lord." {Matt 25:21)
How faithful are murderers and adulterers?
David a man after God's own heart under the condemnation of the LAW should have died...instead mercy and the innocent son of DAVID took his place<--JESUS <--You should try it....

Tell me about the Corinthian brothers...works of wood hay and stubble yet saved!
 
P

PHart

Guest
Hmm...I don't think that every time I struggle with mistrust (which is unbelief in something He has said), that my salvation is in danger. This sin is covered by His blood. If it weren't, I'd be a goner. Because I've had areas of unbelief after I met Him, which He walked me through...this is difficult stuff for me so please be patient.:)
Surely you can see that the areas of lack of trust after you met Him are different than your trust in the area of the forgiveness of your sins. The believer's struggle with, for example, believing for healing, is clearly different than a struggle with whether Christ has really forgiven all your sins and justified you before God.

You don't lose your salvation for not being able to trust God for a healing. That's clearly a different matter of trusting God than not being able to trust God for the forgiveness of your sins. One is not a matter of salvation. The other is. See the difference?

The most important trusting is that you are trusting God for the forgiveness of sin for all the times you weren't trusting him to provide in life what you need so you don't have to sin to get them. It's entirely possible to trust God for the forgiveness of sins and not trust him to make it so you don't have to sin to get what you need in this life. I'm confident that is exactly what is happening in your life. You have no problem trusting God for salvation, but you struggle with trusting that his grace is sufficient to get you through trials and temptations and sufferings without sinning. That is how all devout Christians struggle.
 
Dec 12, 2013
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Romans 6:21-22 What benefit did you reap at that time from the things you are NOW ASHAMED OF? Those things result in death! But now that you have been set free from sin and have become slaves to God, the benefit you reap leads to holiness, and the result is eternal life.

DO YOU EVER GET ASHAMED OF BEING A SINNER IN THE PAST OR ARE YOU PROUD THAT YOU ARE STILL ONE OF THEM NOW?
You have proven that there is no sense in even addressing you.....thanks anyway.......
 

PJW

Banned
Oct 6, 2017
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Thank you, but he already responded to my post with this:

I personally can't relate to not sinning anymore which makes me think he's not saying he has not sinned a single sin since being born again, but maybe he does mean just that.
Do you think men are "reborn" with the same nature and faults as the body and mind killed on the cross with Christ?
I hope not!

Perhaps you've noticed my lack of participation in this part of the discussion. And that's because it doesn't interest me much.
Pleasing the one who died to cover your past sins "doesn't interest you much"?
That distresses me greatly.

I think the far more important matter is to help the vast majority of us believers who do struggle with sin. My interest does lie there. I've walked a hard road with personal struggles and I'm coming into the 4th type of soil in my walk with Christ and I want others to get there too.
Wouldn't a complete escape from sin solve yours and their problem entirely?
It solved my drunkenness and adultery and drug abuse and lying and thievery and porn addiction and vile affections.
Thanks be to God!
 

PJW

Banned
Oct 6, 2017
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It does not say that, Stop adding to the word of God!!

It says AFTER you believed, You were sealed. (Both are aorist tense verbs) It does not say after this we must continue to believe or our seal is broken, That would mean we can break the seal of God.

As for your question. Non of the above.

Those who have true faith will never lose faith, because God will never give them a reason to. YOU ONLY lose faith in people WHO PROVE UNTRUSTWORTHY.

it is sad you think God is so untrustworthy people may lose faiht in him. When will you repent?
Do you feel that all the NT exhortations for the saints to be cautious are a waste of time?
 

stonesoffire

Poetic Member
Nov 24, 2013
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I would comment that once Peter learned something he did or said was wrong, he stopped doing that. I think that goes for all those ancient saints, sin by sin dropped out of their lives. Peter stopped doubting, Paul stopped persecuting, both plunged full forward into the gospel ministry. We all start off weak concerning sin and even knowing what it is, but the danger we greatest danger we faced was for those knowing to leave us in our sin such that we are left self deceiving. Each one of us came to learn what was wrong through teachings of rules and eventually laws and regulations. Even the Gentiles practiced enough law among themselves to exhibit a measure of God's law in their hearts. They stood to be judged according to their own laws, which we know would be a dangerous route to take. But the sons and daughters of the Gentiles had no alternative, caught up in those world ways.

I spent years smoking cigarettes, even after learning about the health risks. I dreaded the possibilities, like a sinner dreading hell. But I chose to keep smoking until diagnosed with a spot on my lung. When I rushed in for prayer, a preacher told me to let God help by no longer play-acting like the Marlboro Man in the TV ads, I being given away about that by the yellow stain above my lip. I repented and quit cold turkey by the power of the Lord conquering yet another sin habit of damaging my health and witness.

It appears to me the Devil never gives up on keeping the ignorant ones, the lost, especially those who have been exposed to a little truth of the reality of the living God, of Jesus, and a glimmer of righteousness. If I were Satan, why not do all possible to keep someone from gaining enough revelation to become a new creature in Christ? It's a lot more difficult to ruin a true disciple of Christ who has tasted the benefits of obeying the new Master Jesus! That person is on guard, unlike someone with just enough religion to make their knowledge toxic to themselves and others.

Sin by sin, the Lord will take us to task, expecting a change of direction He provides. But that requires listening, seeking, knocking, making up the mind to change by that power not of ourselves, but of the Holy Spirit within.

The issue of "nature" for man to sin by is misunderstood often. People are not born to be like a wild hog that for all its life would, if taken in as a pet, would devour its master once found asleep. The Gentiles having laws to themselves proves there is a distinct creation of human beings in the image and likeness of God, else none of us could ever rise above hopelessness.

The Law served one purpose, to train people up as to what sin is, and that sin has consequences. It causes an inward battle, a struggle of conscience concerning the righteousness of God. The Law saves none. Jesus saves.
This is the first read from you for me Swordsman. I appreciate what you have written and agree.

It's a bit of hard truth but given in meekness and love.
 

stonesoffire

Poetic Member
Nov 24, 2013
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Hebrews 11:6, “But without faith it is impossible to please Him, for he who comes to Yah has to believe that He is, and that He is a rewarder of those who earnestly seek Him.”





Hebrews 5:9, “And having been perfected, He became the Causer of everlasting salvation to all those obeying Him.”



Hebrews 3:3:18-19, “And to whom did He swear that they would not enter into His rest, but to those who did not obey? we see that they were unable to enter in because of unbelief."



John 3:36, “He who believes in the Son possesses everlasting life, but he who does not obey the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of Yah remains on him.”


John/Yahanan 12:48, "He who rejects Me, and does not follow My words has One Who judges him. The word that I have spoken, the same will be used to judge him in the last day."


John/Yahanan 5:24, "Most certainly I tell you, he who hears my word, and believes him who sent me, has eternal life, and doesn't come into judgment, but has passed out of death into life."
Did you notice the word believe and then the word obey H? Obey is believe. Look at the greek. :)
 
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PHart

Guest
Written to believers.....Where sin abound grace did much more abound and Shall we continue in sin since grace abounds....
Also written to believers:

"Christ was faithful as a Son over His house—whose house we are, if we hold fast our confidence and the boast of our hope firm until the end." (Hebrews 3:6 NASB)

See your error is that you are not using the whole counsel of scripture to know where grace abounds and where it will not abound. It does in fact abound, but within the boundaries that the Bible itself sets; boundaries that you are not taking into consideration but which are clearly stated in the Bible. You are guilty of not rightly dividing the word of God. And that is what most false doctrines are guilty of-not considering the whole counsel of scripture but rather not rightly dividing and isolating one part away from the rest.


Lose your false mindset and for one second use Godly, biblical reasoning.....the above two statements written unto believers absolutely destroys your theology....even LOGICALLY they destroy your view......
Your doctrine can only stand if you isolate Romans 5:20 from, for example, the Hebrews verse I quoted above. But my doctrine stands in the face of any and all scriptures put next to the Hebrews verse quoted above. That's how you can know what doctrine is true and which one is false. If a doctrine nullifies another part of scripture it is a false doctrine. But the doctrine that does not cause contradiction in scripture is the true doctrine.
 

stonesoffire

Poetic Member
Nov 24, 2013
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Do you feel that all the NT exhortations for the saints to be cautious are a waste of time?

The Word is for correction. There's a scripture stating what its purpose is. Not judgement. Jesus didn't come to judge but to save. And He is the Word.
 

stonesoffire

Poetic Member
Nov 24, 2013
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Going to go wax my new kitchen tile floor, that has gold streaks in it and the shine will make it look like gold.

Nothing to do with the thread. Just happy with my new kitchen. :)
 
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PHart

Guest
Also written to believers:

"Christ was faithful as a Son over His house—whose house we are, if we hold fast our confidence and the boast of our hope firm until the end." (Hebrews 3:6 NASB)
Oh, and by the way, folks. Arguing that the true believer will always believe doesn't remove the condition that one must continue to believe to be saved. In fact, as I'm showing you, it confirms it. Even Calvinism teaches that you must believe to the very end to be saved in the very end.
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
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It is time for you to avail yourself of the rebirth...of Godly seed that cannot bring forth evil fruit.
A real repentance would be the end of sin in your life.
Peter, I am not talking to your personally right now, but the one I fear is in you!

Pick on someone your own size wolf. Do not go after the lambs. You keep insisting on showing us the BAD SEED you are producing.

2 Corinthians 11:13-15 (ESV)
[SUP]13 [/SUP] For such men are false apostles, deceitful workmen, disguising themselves as apostles of Christ.
[SUP]14 [/SUP] And no wonder, for even Satan disguises himself as an angel of light.
[SUP]15 [/SUP] So it is no surprise if his servants, also, disguise themselves as servants of righteousness. Their end will correspond to their deeds.

Everybody else keep your whole armor on. It is not the human Peter we battle now.

IN THE NAME of JESUS CHRIST THE SON OF THE MOST HIGH GOD, COME OUT OF THE ONE CALLED PETERJEN.

WHEN THEY CANNOT WIN WITH THE MATURE CHRISTIANS, THEY TURN ON THE LAMBS.
 
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PJW

Banned
Oct 6, 2017
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So, tell me how you attained sinless perfection whilst Paul, who wrote 13 NT books did not?. Hmmmm?
Careful, there are folks here who don't like "judgers".
Paul's final status in Christ can only be judged by Christ Jesus at the final judgement.
As will mine.
My life is not over yet, but with the protection and provision of God, I will finish my life without going back into darkness/sin, to the glory of God.

As for your first question: How did I attain sinless perfection?
I had read 1 Peter 3:21, and I wanted that "good conscience before God".
I had faith that what Peter wrote in Acts 2:38 was true, so I repented of sin, (turned from it forever), and was baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of my past sins.
As my repentance was real, I was given the gift of the Holy Ghost.
Having turned from sin, making me a non-sinner, and crucifying the old man, I was reborn of God's seed...which we all know cannot bring forth evil fruit.
That is the simplicity of Christ.
 

Seohce

Senior Member
Jul 15, 2016
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You have proven that there is no sense in even addressing you.....thanks anyway.......
You're welcome and I thank you to for answering my questions honestly and with integrity and disposition (hopefully in the future hahaha!!!) BTW, I happen to take a short glimpse at your twitter account. YOU ROCK MAN! But that's not cool.