Not By Works

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FranC said:
Oooh. Another Christian that believes we should be worshipping on Saturday!

LGodF will be happy to hear it.
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Not what I said. Only that Christians engaged in corporate worship on the first day of the week because the dominant religion would not allow them to worship on the same day as they were gathering.

I think that Sabbath keeping as we see it today is vain and pretentious.

Christians worship everyday.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 
FranC said:
That's what they believe.

Dcon has told me I'm going to hell for what I believe.
What's the difference?

YOU believe what you believe.
YOU try to convince everybody that YOU are right.
What's the difference?

Hypocricy is the difference.
Seeing the splinter in the other's eyes and not the log in your own.

What we should be doing is paying attention to what JESUS SAID.
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that is a good point. but, one should pay attention to EVERYTHING that He said, not just zero in on certain things.
 
Rosemaryx said:
Hi everyone...I believe i am truly saved, why, because God called me :D...I had faith in God before i had faith in His Son Jesus...Now i am saved i like to obey Him, no i love to obey Him, when i sin i know i hurt Him and i repent, receive His forgiveness and carry on in Him...I do not believe works are added to keep me saved, but i do believe we are to do works, to represent ourselves to the world, to let the light of our Lord shine in the darkness,just as Jesus said in Matthew 5:16 " Let your light so shine before men that they may see your good works and glorify your Father in heaven...xox...
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Hi Rosemary,

Weren't we having more fun Yesterday?

What changed??
I wish we could get back to how it was Yesterday...
Maybe if some here disappeared ??
 
That would work seeing that it is scripture.. But miss lady if you must dig in because I asked a real question and you feel threatened by it, I shall respond again..

I'm really asking why he uses third party opinions or teachings. If he understands and feels he can correct, why send them elsewhere but scripture

I normally wouldn't see your post fyi, but it happened to be quoted
Ariel82 said:
If scripture is enough...then why do people bother talking at all? Why not just quote scriptures 24/7?
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Grace777x70 said:
There are always new viewers to the thread so I will post again about "good works" in light of Christ's finished work on the cross and resurrection.

All religions - including the religion of Christianity ( as there is a religion like this that tries to mimic the life of Christ ) - are really manifesting that they are eating from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil which has been set lose in this earth by Adam's transgression.

They are basing their life on what they do or don't do. They are attempting to establish their own righteousness by what they do or don't do. Good works are an example of this.

We see the "descriptions" in the words and actions of Jesus and in the epistles of what the true Christian life looks like when Christ's life and His fruit are being manifested. The religion of Christianity then takes these "descriptions" and tries to "dictate" to the believers the life of Christ or the fruit of the Spirit into being.

In essence they are trying to mimic or duplicate the life and fruit of Christ and at the same time "demanding" that others do the same thing or else they are not saved. The true Christian life is Christ Himself joined as one spirit with us manifesting His love, His grace, His life in and through us. It is His fruit - without Him we can do nothing.

All works-based - works-righteousness belief systems ( including the religion of Christianity ) have this as their core essence and it really nullifies the true grace of God from operating in our lives like it should.

This is the "why" behind when people say we must do "good works". That is what the fruit brings behind the work-for-salvation mindset and to maintain and create righteousness.

The reality is - as we behold the glory/goodness of the Lord as in a mirror - we are transformed by the Holy Spirit and the life of Christ will manifest itself in the doing of good works as the fruit of being in union with Him.

We do good works because it is a fruit of being in union with Christ not "to be saved" Christ alone is our Savior.

Preach and teach the love and grace of God in the gospel of the Lord Jesus Christ and Christians will have the proper nutrients to walk out what already is within them - which is Christ in us - the hope of glory.

We live by His life in us now - Christ Himself is that tree of life. Notice it is not the "knowledge of the tree of life" ( like it is with the other tree - the knowledge of good and evil ). We live by His life now.
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James 1:26-27 If anyone considers himself religious and yet does not keep a tight rein on his tongue, he deceives himself and his religion is worthless. Religion that God our Father accepts as pure and faultless is this: to look after orphans and widows in their distress and to keep oneself from being polluted by the world.

Romans 8:7 the sinful mind is hostile to God. It does not submit to God’s law, nor can it do so.

Malachi 2:17 The Day of Judgment You have wearied the Lord with your words. “How have we wearied him?” you ask. By saying, “All who do evil are good in the eyes of the Lord, and he is pleased with them” or “Where is the God of justice?”

Malachi 3:13-18 “You have said harsh things against me,” says the Lord. “Yet you ask, ‘What have we said against you?’ “You have said, ‘It is futile to serve God. What did we gain by carrying out his requirements and going about like mourners before the Lord Almighty? But now we call the arrogant blessed. Certainly the evildoers prosper, and even those who challenge God escape.’” Then those who feared the Lord talked with each other, and the Lord listened and heard. A scroll of remembrance was written in his presence concerning those who feared the Lord and honored his name. “They will be mine,” says the Lord Almighty, “in the day when I make up my treasured possession. I will spare them, just as in compassion a man spares his son who serves him. And you will again see the distinction between the righteous and the wicked, between those who serve God and those who do not.
 
eternally-gratefull said:

the catholic church as we know it did not exist until the 3rd century AD, The church in Pauls day looked nothing like the roman church.
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What does that have to do with anything?
Did Luther change things?
Do things change?

Study up on Apostolic succession.
The Catholic Church was the FIRST CHURCH and the one that existed at the time of the Apostles.
There is no break is succession. Right up to today.
 
FranC said:
What does that have to do with anything?
Did Luther change things?
Do things change?

Study up on Apostolic succession.
The Catholic Church was the FIRST CHURCH and the one that existed at the time of the Apostles.
There is no break is succession. Right up to today.
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That's not true.
There were many pockets of Christians at that time that never became part of the catholic and had to go into hiding because it was evil right from the beginning.
those pockets of Christians were and still are the true church.
 
stonesoffire said:
The fig tree is the symbol of the nation of Israel. They were cut down in '70 ad.
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Yes, okay, I agree.
This is why we should take care that our hearts do not become evil and unbelieving as theirs did. This is why we should examine if we ARE in the faith. This is why we should look for parallels between us and Israel and take it seriously when we find them. For example:

Collect only enough for you and your family for the day.............do not store treasure on earth.
If we disobey in the same way as they did, yet claim our disobedience is allowed while theirs was not, we have given ourselves a deal to cheat death and tipped the scales in our favor. We have put our finger on the scale between us and them to use unequal weights, which God detests. God will cancel our deal to cheat death. And we are using the Precious Blood to cover continued disobedience of faith. We be the seed of Abraham did NOT cover mistrust and unbelief. We be the seed of the Holy Spirit is our echo and it won't cover mistrust and unbelief either.

Some will see the parallels and examine themselves and wonder why He was so harsh to them for their disobedience of faith, cutting them off, while according to some preaching He lets us slide on it or only takes a certain hat from us. We lose a hat but they were cut off. They were cut off for mistrust and disobedience of trust and we just lose a hat or an unspecified reward of some sort that no one can explain what it is exactly, just some "thing."

So some will see. But others will protect this much better deal for the disobedience of trust and say we got a much better deal because of the Blood but they got a raw deal. This would make God a respecter of persons and would make Him hold double standards where our disobedience of trust is covered but theirs was not. And it would be using the Blood in an unworthy manner.

Even an unbeliever would be astute enough to see that this is not a fair deal and that we have tipped the scales in our elitist favor.

We have made some of the same mistakes as Israel. Some will see it and some will not, even though we all instinctively know unfairness when we see it. Some will do the good work of struggling it through with God and some will dismiss it. Some will see that Israel is an example for us and some won't. Some will see why He scattered the builders and confused their language because of what was being built and some will not. They will see the parallel between the Tower of Babel and now. So I write it for those who will see and be helped away from the hypocrisy and elitism.
 
Honestly...so do we not all try to convince the other? Why should I let someone strive for what has already been accomplished?

The problems and issues begin when we cannot deal with, or accept the fact, that we were unsuccessful in persuading the others. Some of us do know however that ultimately whoever has ears to hear will hear.

I am paying attention to what Jesus said, He is the Bread of life, the Living water, His work is Complete, the Author and Finisher of our Faith....are you persuaded?



FranC said:
That's what they believe.

Dcon has told me I'm going to hell for what I believe.
What's the difference?

YOU believe what you believe.
YOU try to convince everybody that YOU are right.
What's the difference?

Hypocricy is the difference.
Seeing the splinter in the other's eyes and not the log in your own.

What we should be doing is paying attention to what JESUS SAID.
Click to expand...
 
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tourist said:
Maybe we should all just clap our hands.

"If you're happy and you know it clap your hands..."
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And now...
FOR A MUSICAL INTERLUDE...


[video=youtube;qHYvkkrSLKA]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qHYvkkrSLKA[/video]
 
AllenW said:
I have been to an SDA service on a Saturday morning.
What you are describing is not true.
My friends who are born again SDA members have a family of friends who care for each other, which again contradicts what you say.

And you would rather go to MMD"s church that you know nothing about.
They may be cannibals for all we know.
After all, it is a big secret who they are.

All this says that you have no idea what you are talking about.
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I did not say I would rather go to any church. except A non denominationa church.

Thanks for assuming..
 
FranC said:
What does that have to do with anything?
Did Luther change things?
Do things change?

Study up on Apostolic succession.
The Catholic Church was the FIRST CHURCH and the one that existed at the time of the Apostles.
There is no break is succession. Right up to today.
Click to expand...

I studied the bible.

I see the catholic churhc

They do not even compair.

Apostolic succession? Where is that found in the bible?

 
hornetguy said:
I don't necessarily want to get into the apostolic succession belief (which I do NOT share)... we could start another thread on it, I suppose...

I don't know all the details of how/why the "church" morphed into the RCC... I have some general ideas, having to do with a representative form of organization, or governance of the church, but I certainly haven't studied it very thoroughly. I'm sure you know a LOT more about it than I do, having come out of the RCC.

And, I AM a member of the catholic church (small c)... the universal church, Christ's church... the one the apostles were a part of.

I have never been a member of the ROMAN catholic church, and could not be.... their beliefs have been so twisted over time that I could not, in good conscience, be a willing professor of that....
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I can only agree.

But do this...It's simple.

Go back to when Jesus died.
Peter and Paul and all of them carried on after Jesus.
Then came the ones after them.
And so forth.
Then in the 300's Constantine made Catholoicism the State Religion and all the problems started.
Then it continued untill the Orthodox cut away in about 1,000 because of the Authority of the Pope not being accepted.
Get to today.

When was there ever a break???
NEVER!
 
I believe there are genuine Christians in every denomination - SDA, Baptists, Roman Catholic, Lutheran, Methodist, Church of God, Charismatic and yes - even in Pentecostal churches ( where I first went after I received Christ ).

Jesus said that there would be tares in amongst the wheat and that the angels will separate them out at the end of the age. Jesus said to leave them alone unless you pull up a wheat thinking it is a tare.

Also Jesus will say to the goats ( these are not Christians that have been born of the Spirit of God ) go to the left and to those that have Christ in them - that belong to Christ - the sheep ( which do not change animal species from a sheep to a goat and then to a sheep again if one never sins.) - go to the right.

There are Christians in all places and we all need each other and each has some aspect of truth that we all need to grow up in Christ and each has a part to play.

We can agree to dis-agree on the non-essentials but not on the essentials which is the deity of Christ, The Person and work of Christ that we are saved by grace through faith alone in the Lord Jesus Christ - no amount of works save anyone nor keep one saved.

We are redeemed by His blood alone.

Ephesians 1:7 (NASB)
[SUP]7 [/SUP] In Him we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of our trespasses, according to the riches of His grace


Colossians 1:14 (KJV)
[SUP]14 [/SUP] In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins:
 
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