Not By Works

[Ariel82]

Ariel - I am curious. You said in another post you were very sensitive to people pride
and arrogance. You have said some very strong things to me, which is fine, but I wonder
if you are seeing something that is not there.

I wonder if we justify our positions, and then read in others feelings to make sense why
they behave as they do, but it might be completely wrong. I have seen two sides in a debate
do this when actually different things were going on. Often groups just play to their own
audience, and communication is irrelevant, just passing on party policy. The opposition are
then just a cartoon. It is disappointing, but this is group human behaviour. lol

I don't care about the group or how "they" or you view my ideas as long as they are clearly communicated and not twisted between what I say and what you hear and repeat that you think I believe.

Your statement could easily be misunderstood as a Universalist position. Instead of assuming that you held it. I asked for you clarification.

If you agree with mj007,we can end the,dialog now.

I would rather not waste my time trying to talk someone who thinks I am "trying to put out your fire"

 

[PeterJens]

Sometimes I am here wondering if this is an asylum of some kind.

My daughters have many friends. I am surprised by the number of people who suffer panic
attacks, whose families have sisters, brothers with schizophrenia.
Then you listen to testimonies, with abuse in their backgrounds, it suddenly becomes obvious
nothing is necessarily logical or straight forward. We think emotions appear for logical reasons,
when often it is the other way around, an emotion will appear and we search for a reason.

When talking about faith, life and death, heaven and hell, deep heartfelt experiences, it is not
surprising feelings are all over the place. I suppose the learning experience is how to disengage
and then find something appropriate to share. Not easy.

 

[MattforJesus]

So you believe everyone will eventually be saved?

Everyone will not be saved,but there will be more people saved than some people realize.

Creation testifies that there is a higher power that loves people,which covers the 2 greatest commandments,love God,and love people,so the world is without excuse.

The whole world will be judged on that,and have to abide by that,whether they heard the word of God,or not,or whether they heard of Christ,or not.

Those that knew of the Old Testament sufficiently will be lost if they did not abide,which there were periods in Israel where they were perverted from the truth,and a Gentile if they took hold of God's covenant,then they are responsible for it then.

All the rest will be judged according to creation that there is a higher power that loves people,and their conscience.

Same with New Testament,if they knew of it sufficiently they will be lost if they did not abide.

All the rest are judged according to creation,and their conscience.

All the Old Testament saints,and New Testament saints,will be with Jesus,they are saved,and all the rest of the dead will resurrect at a later date,in which there can be some saved if they meet the qualifications.

At the great white throne judgement,those that heard,and knew sufficiently,but did not abide are lost.

But all who did not hear the word of God,and did not hear of God,or not sufficient to cause them to be responsible,will be judged by creation,love God,and love people,and their conscience.

If they meet the standard of what God expects of them they will be able to dwell with the saints,for they obeyed love God,and love people,sufficiently to be a saint,and be with all the saints that knew the truth on earth,and obeyed,which it has always been love God,and love people.

Those that did not meet the standard will be lost.

So there will be more people saved than some people realize.

Job is a good example,for many people believe he lived after the flood,but before Moses,so he would be before the Old Covenant,but the Bible says he was a man that hated evil,and God said he was righteous.

Another Noah,and another Enoch,all before the Old Covenant,but they were righteous before God,so they are judged without knowing the word of God that had not been out yet,and He was not the God of Israel yet,but a higher power they believed in,and so it is with all the other people that have not heard,they can still be right with God if they lived as those people.

Creation testifies there is a God that loves people,and covers the 2 greatest laws,and there is many people that abided by that,and if they loved people,and did right by their conscience,and asked the higher power to forgive them if anything is amiss,they would be able to be with God after the millennial reign of Christ,and have access to the New Jerusalem.

 

[blue_ladybug]

We do NOT need to do works to get to heaven. Works won't get us into heaven. Nor do they gain us salvation, nor do they KEEP us our salvation.

We DO need to do works because it is required of us by God. But they are NOT to be done for the purpose of getting to heaven or keeping salvation.

I honestly don't know why some people can't or won't accept this truth..

 

[limey410]

We do NOT need to do works to get to heaven. Works won't get us into heaven. Nor do they gain us salvation, nor do they KEEP us our salvation.

We DO need to do works because it is required of us by God. But they are NOT to be done for the purpose of getting to heaven or keeping salvation.

I honestly don't know why some people can't or won't accept this truth..

Because they don't truly believe that God has all of the power and authority, and that His love is THAT Big!!!!

 

[PeterJens]

I would rather not waste my time trying to talk someone who thinks I am "trying to put out your fire"

Ariel - You are doing what you are doing. I do not think you are trying to put out my fire.
I see you like a boss I worked for who was simply empathetic above anything else.
There always comes a point when people refuse to be nice and play well.

Being a believer is partly this ethic, and also knowing when to draw the line.
A classic one is respecting ones parents. Fine until they start working against
ones faith.

What I love most about cc is the variation of positions. Jimbo and FranC, Angela,
and HeRoseFromTheDead. Very different and diverse views, yet focused on seeing
God working through them. Works and faith, language and boundaries, definitions
and origins. Powerful stuff. But it all really does matter, and some are very wrong.

I had a friend who was an orphan, grew up in the orange lodge in Glasgow, became
a terrorist, came to the Lord, and we worked together in a christian organisation.
He dedicated himself to the study of scripture, and commentaries. He went one time
to preach in a prison and 140 inmates came to the Lord. Love transforms people, it turns
a person who hates another, to someone who can love and embrace another. I know there
are no limits to what the Lords love can do.

If we can grow together as a body, Amen. I know there is still much for me to learn, but
maybe I can also share to help others grow to.

 

[PeterJens]

So your those on free will?

Why do some accept Jesus and others do not?

You got me. I am also on we are called and chosen. I think both are true at the same
time. Jesus said to His disciples, "I chose you".
Equally they chose to obey and follow. But deep down, in Christ there is no other voice or
choice. But I find the whole discussion not significant because I am chosen and He called.
If I can be a voice that calls others, Amen. I know that much of our sharing that bears fruit
is really one to one.

I sat next to a woman on a train, and started to talk to her about the gospel.
She was an SDA and wanted to find the Lord. I asked her about if Peter asked her why
she should be allowed into heaven, what she would say. After discussion and pray she
gave here heart to the Lord. I have shared like this with others and nothing. The heart
needs to be ready, at the right time. That is the Lords work not mine.

I just want to praise Him for His work and His light. Amen

 

[PeterJens]

Time for bed, too late in London, Goodnight all, God bless.

 

[tourist]

Time for bed, too late in London, Goodnight all, God bless.

Goodnight and God bless you too, sir.

 

[limey410]

You got me. I am also on we are called and chosen. I think both are true at the same
time. Jesus said to His disciples, "I chose you".
Equally they chose to obey and follow. But deep down, in Christ there is no other voice or
choice. But I find the whole discussion not significant because I am chosen and He called.
If I can be a voice that calls others, Amen. I know that much of our sharing that bears fruit
is really one to one.

I sat next to a woman on a train, and started to talk to her about the gospel.
She was an SDA and wanted to find the Lord. I asked her about if Peter asked her why
she should be allowed into heaven, what she would say. After discussion and pray she
gave here heart to the Lord. I have shared like this with others and nothing. The heart
needs to be ready, at the right time. That is the Lords work not mine.

I just want to praise Him for His work and His light. Amen

Your last 2 posts have been the best I've seen you write (I'm sure I have missed others) Sharing the love of Christ to salvation, one on one, that is why we are saved! Praise God. Thank you for sharing.

 

[slave]

I don't care about the group or how "they" or you view my ideas as long as they are clearly communicated and not twisted between what I say and what you hear and repeat that you think I believe.

Your statement could easily be misunderstood as a Universalist position. Instead of assuming that you held it. I asked for you clarification.

If you agree with mj007,we can end the,dialog now.

I would rather not waste my time trying to talk someone who thinks I am "trying to put out your fire"

The rising and falling of the emotion not only hinders the believer from walking according to the spirit, but also directly causes him or her to walk according to the flesh. Since he/she cannot walk according to the spirit, they naturally walk according to the flesh. If they cannot secure guidance in their spirit, they naturally walk according to the impulse of their emotions.

Whenever the spirit ceases to guide, the emotion starts to guide. At that moment a believer will spontaneously take the emotion as their inspiration and the impulses of their soul as the moving of their spirit. An emotional believer can be likened to a pond full of mud and sand. As long as no one comes to disturb the water, it looks clear; but once it is disturbed, it becomes muddy.

 

[Ariel82]

Emotions are not evil. They show the state of the heart.

Fear was given to us to warn of danger. People assume it's physical, but sometimes it's spiritual attack on BOTH people that causes folks to argue. Do we trust in ourselves or God when we are afraid?

Anger also can be a motivator. Especially to fight against injustice. However, God says give it to Him before the sun sets out of love for us. Do not give place to Satan. Each day we stand for justice and truth. each night we trust God to deal with it. We forgive even if they don't deserve it. Not for their benefit but our own peace. Do we forgive and let go of anger every night, or do we horde it and allow anger to poison our lives?

 

[followjesus]

Emotions are not evil. They show the state of the heart.

Fear was given to us to warn of danger. People assume it's physical, but sometimes it's spiritual attack on BOTH people that causes folks to argue. Do we trust in ourselves or God when we are afraid?

Anger also can be a motivator. Especially to fight against injustice. However, God says give it to Him before the sun sets out of love for us. Do not give place to Satan. Each day we stand for justice and truth. each night we trust God to deal with it. We forgive even if they don't deserve it. Not for their benefit but our own peace. Do we forgive and let go of anger every night, or do we horde it and allow anger to poison our lives?

Barney songs and words lIke spirit dont mean a things until you accept this

jesus chrisat who Gives the only holy spirit there is says this john 14:15-17 "If ye love me, keep my commandments.16And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever; 17Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you."

it soes not exist because jospeh prince or paul ellis are explaining a bettr way, its funny one one hand you would all never deny Jesus words yet ive left 30 plus scriptures now and not a single one of you has addressed them you simply ignore and do this wierd thing lol im good with it 100 percent because i live according to the scripture above and actually do Have the Spirit it comes from no other source

john 6:63 " It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life."

john 3:6 "That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit." thats why i cant ever agree with the nonsense of the gog. because flesh and spirit are in conflict .

Lastly i h opr the day comes when you are able to accept the gospel because its not gonna be easyto face this

john 12:He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day. 49For I have not spoken of myself; but the Father which sent me, he gave me a commandment, what I should say, and what I should speak. 50And I know that his commandment is life everlasting: whatsoever I speak therefore, even as the Father said unto me, so I speak.<< God the fathers words meant for spirit and Life....but hey lets only accept the ones that make no condition like this

" the work of God is this to believe in the One He has sent <<<< who said all the above. how again are we actually born again ???

1 peter 1: 22-23 "Seeing YE HABE PURIFIED YOUR SOULS in OBEYING THE TRUTH through THE SPIRIT ( JOHN 6:63) unto unfeigned love of the brethren, see that ye love one another with a pure heart fervently: 23Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the WORD OF gOD, which liveth and abideth for ever.<<< whos words live forever again?? ohhh right

Matthew 24 :35 " Heaven and earth will pass away, but my words will never pass away. hmm well thats the only statemnt in the new testament wierd coincidences since gotta learn that most of it doesnt apply to find some bizzaro form of mans definition of unwarranted favor. whta peter mean by " you have purified your souls through obeying thetruth??? couldnt connectto this since the revolution of grace

John 17:14 "I have given them thy word; and the world hath hated them, because they are not of the world, even as I am not of the world."

hmm...all Jesus words, but yeah thats all "before the cross"

he never said that after the cross...matthew 28"18-20 "And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth. 19Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost: 20Teaching them to observe all things WHATSOEVER I HAVE COMMANDED YOU: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen."

naw thats noit the gospel even though i gave 15 or more of Jesus saying i came to teach the gospel earlier in this thread. the gospel is just what the gog preachers tell you, the ones feasting on millions of peoples pocketbooks and making promises that that sound good.....its a waste of time to even show a scripture unless it lies saying " no effort can never lose any salvation again though Jesus words

Matthew 7:21 ""Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven." naw that doesnt apply,,,,,,,Jesus said it and the spirit comes through some other way than Jesus taught

" grace is the gospel, grace is god, never can do anything right or wrong, no free will, before the cross is different......the gog is very simply the Word of the serpent. " naw, God didnt mean that for you, listen to my salvation and you will not die..............

Ive wasted the last 3 minutes ill ever waste on ant gog doctrine its BLINFOLD TO TRUTH. Beware those who truly would not be willing to omit thier Lord and saviors word, many gog folks here trying to "cleverly" explain things that arent there.......and its not okay to omit the gospel of Gods eternal Kingdom its the only salvation that exists, find doctrine that challenges the One who offers it and no salvation is all thats left, No other place its found.


you guys need to Learn pretending to be nice and omit the things people dont want to Hear, is the pattern of the enemy......alays leads to apostacy and obviously it certainly has in many people

 

[followjesus]

Emotions are not evil. They show the state of the heart.

Fear was given to us to warn of danger. People assume it's physical, but sometimes it's spiritual attack on BOTH people that causes folks to argue. Do we trust in ourselves or God when we are afraid?

Anger also can be a motivator. Especially to fight against injustice. However, God says give it to Him before the sun sets out of love for us. Do not give place to Satan. Each day we stand for justice and truth. each night we trust God to deal with it. We forgive even if they don't deserve it. Not for their benefit but our own peace. Do we forgive and let go of anger every night, or do we horde it and allow anger to poison our lives?

" Do we forgive"

Jesus " matthew 6:14-15 "for if youi g=forgive men thier trspassae My heavenly father will forgive your trespasses, if tou do not forgive men when they sin against you, your father will not forgive your sins" of course Jesus said that so i undersatnad " its not really meant for christians because of some gog doctrine that isnt there, you only find the explainations in a gog preachers newset insight of what doesnt apply to you in order to keep the gog folks "alive"

I never thought id meet Christians who simply cant or will not accept the Words every one of Jesus Christ, yet claim to have the "spirit"

1 john 5:2-BY THIS WE KNOW WE love the children of God, when we LOVE GOD, and KEEP HIS COMMANDMENTS. 3For THIS IS THE LOVE OF GOD, that WE KEEP his commandments: and his commandments are NOT GRIEVOUS. 4For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our faith.5Who is he that overcometh the world, but he that believeth that JESUS IS THE SON OF GOD?"


"thats not paul"

romans 13:8- 10 "For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet; and if there be ANY OTHER COMMANDMENT, it is BREIFLY COMPREHENDED in this SAYING, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. 10Love worketh NO ILL to his neighbour: therefore love is the FULFILLING OF the law."

James 1:22-23 "Wherefore lay apart all filthiness and superfluity of naughtiness, and receive with meekness the engrafted word, which is able to save your souls. 22But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves."


.......
t

 

[Ariel82]

No one is teaching the false prosperity gospel in this thread.(well most, I am sure we might have a few hiding behind the message of salvation by grace alone through faith)

you ignored because you make false accusations and its not worth talking to anyone in that attack mode mind frame.

 

[followjesus]

Water cannot but be wet! A man of faith cannot except but be faithful!! Whereas his works alone cannot save him, indeed, if he is a man of faith, surely there will be works!!

what if they dont though thers alot of word about that ( condition)

 

[Ariel82]

romans 13:8- 10 "For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet; and if there be ANY OTHER COMMANDMENT, it is BREIFLY COMPREHENDED in this SAYING, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. 10Love worketh NO ILL to his neighbour: therefore love is the FULFILLING OF the law."

James 1:22-23 "Wherefore lay apart all filthiness and superfluity of naughtiness, and receive with meekness the engrafted word, which is able to save your souls. 22But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves

****

Yeah "gog" must be a new type of compliment and term of endearment....

 

[followjesus]

Jason, there is a point were it does not matter what the insult is, because it is just a distraction.
Once you talk about the behaviour, they use that as ammunition. It then becomes a fight, lol.

Some just want this because to them others are just evil.
Truth. They do not know how to love, which means it is all
over in spiritual terms. Everyone is a future brother or sister
or already there. We have no real enemies, just the lost and
those who can see. This is a good place to learn how to bless
and rejoice, people praise Jesus, a miracle, amen.

Peter i Love you in the Lord i pray often for you probably shouldnt tell you that but i see a light in you.

you prabably know my words betterthan any person Here because you actually have insight from The Holy spirit...that being said ANYONE who ever argues and acts like these few do not have any place in my family. this is a repeat of 100 times before i tried many times to ignore and bless my enemies ect...but Honest to God it sets me on fire now. the gog is an open grave, a whitewashed tomb, its the echoe of satan form now on anyone that brings that toxic waste to me is gonna get the truth. no matter what they accuse of or bait me with im coming fully opposed to that ridiculous made up poison of a "octrine."....yeah i left out the "D" because Jesus used the Letter "d" and,,,its unaccaptable to the Gog if the Lord said it.

Jesus Christ suffered all He suffered , i am not one bit sorry and never will be again, ive prayed and prayed and prayed and finally I understand God is fine with it. righteous anger is perfectly acceptable and the things these folks have said have reached thier fill with me. i have no pity for that ridicuolous poisonous blinding, deceitful wretch of a lie called the gog doctrine that even omits Hois name its hate and spitting in the truth, im done im not leaving this site again, because of the gog. ive tried to get them to part ways im tired of seeing the comments that ive already blocked the ridiculous slander the made up " poor me hes attackoing and being "malicous"


Sorry to you man this is in no way aimed at you, i have more respect for you and your words than almost anyone left Here on cc, i have zero room for that rat poison, done finito i may start going to those gog posts exclusively. it will let people know ehat they deny and are actually doing. God bless and Keep you forever man, please do continue what you have been sayoing, i agree with the other comment about how recently your posts are growing and becoming really balanced and helpful, i have not 1 milimeter of patience with that foolishness called gog

 

[followjesus]

Yes.
I've noticed that when someone comes along that doesn't agree with the crowd here, they're put on ignore.
This is fine with me.

So this is insulting to you:

Originally Posted by FranC;3092279[COLOR=#8B4513

[/COLOR]]Getting saved seems simple because you refuse to read Jesus' words and follow them.

He said to pick up our cross daily if we are to follow Him.
He said to put Him first.

In fact, He made the Law MORE difficult.
If you hate someone (as some here do) you have already murdered that person.
Mathew 5:22

If you just look with lust upon a woman, you have already committed adultery.
Yes. He did make it pretty difficult to be Christian.

So, it's easier to teach cheap grace. Jesus hung on that cross, tortured and bloody and carrying everyone's sin and sins, but let's just keep on talking about how all we have to do is believe. As if we have no part in holding on to our salvation.


That was my post. Pretty nasty stuff. You SHOULD put me on ignore.

But before you go, let me ask you:

Did Jesus NOT up the anty???
Did He NOT make following His Law more difficult?

Before you had to have an affair with a woman,
NOW you can't even look at one with some lust...

What do you think?
You don't even agree with that?

And why are you so upset when someone does not agree with you?
Am I NOT ALLOWED to believe what I believe?

anything you say will be whined about as an attack its like speaking korean to a deaf person whoile your backs turnedto them, blinded by what they chose to trust in, which is ? unwarranted favor."

 

[followjesus]

romans 13:8- 10 "For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet; and if there be ANY OTHER COMMANDMENT, it is BREIFLY COMPREHENDED in this SAYING, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. 10Love worketh NO ILL to his neighbour: therefore love is the FULFILLING OF the law."

James 1:22-23 "Wherefore lay apart all filthiness and superfluity of naughtiness, and receive with meekness the engrafted word, which is able to save your souls. 22But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves

****

Yeah "gog" must be a new type of compliment and term of endearment....

you know what thr gog really is Lovely child of God its this

Now the serpent was more subtil than any beast of the field which the LORD God had made. And he said unto the woman, Yea, hath God said, Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden? 2And the woman said unto the serpent, We may eat of the fruit of the trees of the garden: 3But of the fruit of the tree which is in the midst of the garden, God hath said, Ye shall not eat of it, neither shall ye touch it, lest ye die. 4And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die: 5For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil. 6And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make one wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat. Gen 3<<<<

Jesus says one thing they respond " naw thats not for you...listen to my explainations and quotes that dont agree with The word