Next time she tells you to go get it elsewhere, tell her, "Phew, I was kind of worried you'd be upset that I did. She's a real hottie," and then ask her if she made your sammich.
Marriage is Hard
- Thread starter SoldierofChrist
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You need to address this issue before anything else.
1. God says you should work for only six days in the week.
2. Common sense and general observation will tell you that you should work only eight hours per day. That is the standard work day for most people.
3. Let's say we round out 6 x 8 = 48 to 50. Which means you are spending 60% more time at work than you should.
4. So if you took those extra 30 hours and divided them by 6, you would be spending 5 hours per day with you wife. Do you think you would then get her support since you are giving her time and attention?
good points, though on number two, that's a terrible oversimplification, our swing shift is on 4 10 hour days a week, and longer hour days are sometimes a given in certain occupations.
Sorry for the long post.
I can only judge from what I see written here. Looks to me like you are doing what God has commanded all Christian husbands to do: be the provider. And you keep yourself productive and your mind occupied with that. And you had the "gumption"(as my Dad called it) to roll up your sleeves and to start and run a business. it takes a diligent, resourceful man to do that. God has also called us to provide for and love our wives and it appears you have done all that sacrificially. You have been faithful to her in spite of being falsely accused by her. But it also sounds also like she was from an ungodly messed-up family and you can't fault her for that.
But any individual or group of people who would encourage a wife not to submit to her husband and deny him physical affection is ungodly and wicked and certainly doesn't deserve to be called a "church". We live in a self-destructing society which castigates men and kicks them to the curb. In doing so, countless families have been destroyed. What's worse is that churches follow the trend. Many pastors say stuff like "if husbands would be 'leaders', wives would just automatically fall into their roles and everything would be fine". No it won't: wives are individuals with minds of their own. Too many pastors are afraid to teach what the Bible says: that the man is the "head" and wives are to "submit". They are afraid of the pushback from the women in their churches and afraid of being called "sexist" or "bigots".
Many wives don't know that they are to be "leaders" too, so, this is what the Bible says.
1 Peter 3:1-2 KJV Likewise, ye wives, be in subjection to your own husbands; that, if any obey not the word, they also may without the word be won by the conversation of the wives; while they behold your chaste conversation coupled with fear.
Most wives would tell you that they "put their children first". That, sounds great on the surface. But the Bible teaches to put the husband first. If the husband puts the wife first and the wife puts her husband first, the kids could live in a home with alot less turmoil and strife, and not end up in a fatherless home with all the pain and disfunction which goes along with that. If spouses do not put each other first, they are NOT putting the children first like they believe. All of the following passage is important so I'm showing it in context. But I'm going to highlight one of the leadership roles of women that I'm not hearing from any pulpits....
Titus 2
1But speak thou the things which become sound doctrine: 2That the aged men be sober, grave, temperate, sound in faith, in charity, in patience. 3The aged women likewise, that they be in behaviour as becometh holiness, not false accusers, not given to much wine, teachers of good things; 4That they may teach the young women to be sober, to love their husbands, to love their children, 5To be discreet, chaste, keepers at home, good, obedient to their own husbands, that the word of God be not blasphemed. 6Young men likewise exhort to be sober minded. 7In all things shewing thyself a pattern of good works: in doctrine shewing uncorruptness, gravity, sincerity, 8Sound speech, that cannot be condemned; that he that is of the contrary part may be ashamed, having no evil thing to say of you.
Denying Hubby in the bedroom is NOT "loving" him. (there's another verse about that). It is impossible to "love" the kids like they need to be loved when you are allowing tension like this in the home. But if pastors only teach wives in their congregation that everything will be ok IF "Dad just "leads", without teaching wives that they need to "lead" too, we'll just keep getting more of the same.
I understand, you work so hard and for no real appreciation. God alone knows your heart and motives, so put your feelings at His feet and ask Him to show you what to do.
On a practical level, could you reduce your hours and spend more time with your wife and family?
If this doesn't work, then propose to your wife that you separate and she finds a life that satisfies her better. Perhaps she could work.
Remember God punished women in two ways as a result of the Fall:
"I will make your pains in childbearing very severe; with painful labor you will give birth to children.
Your desire will be for your husband, and he will rule over you.”
The second punishment, to put it bluntly, is submitting to the husband. No matter how wonderful the husband is, women want to have their own way when there is disagreement. In the New Testament, Paul explains that everyone has to submit to someone. However, I believe the "feeling" of punishment still lingers over from the Fall for women with respect to their relationships with their husbands. I think it would be helpful for husbands to realize that their wives' behavior, just like pain in childbearing, may actually be a result from the Fall.
If she is refusing him he already has grounds for divorce. The Bible speaks on that and I believe that would be considered a Biblical reason for divorce.
Agreed: everyone's behavior, specifically bad behavior, is a result of the fall. But in a Christian family, there should be no dynamic of "punishment" and no need for "ruling". Husbands are to love their wives, and wives are to love their husbands. Whether "ruling", loving or submitting, it should all be done voluntarily and intentionally; not by force. A wife is never going to force her husband to love her by complaining or by withholding affection and the husband is never going to force the wife to submit by being overbearing and mean. Needs are to be met by showing love to the other person.
God did give permission for divorce, in the Old Testament "because of the hardness of people's hearts". But the only 'grounds" I've ever seen mentioned by Christ is for "fornication". You know, doing stuff like molesting the kids, committing sex crimes, homosexual stuff etc etc.
Matthew 19
7They say unto him, Why did Moses then command to give a writing of divorcement, and to put her away? 8He saith unto them, Moses because of the hardness of your hearts suffered you to put away your wives: but from the beginning it was not so. 9And I say unto you, Whosoever shall put away his wife, except it be for fornication, and shall marry another, committeth adultery: and whoso marrieth her which is put away doth commit adultery.
7They say unto him, Why did Moses then command to give a writing of divorcement, and to put her away? 8He saith unto them, Moses because of the hardness of your hearts suffered you to put away your wives: but from the beginning it was not so. 9And I say unto you, Whosoever shall put away his wife, except it be for fornication, and shall marry another, committeth adultery: and whoso marrieth her which is put away doth commit adultery.
Genesis 3:16 already says husband ruling over wife is intended as punishment for the woman. I think it is more wise to understand wives from this perspective and go from there, instead of saying there is no punishment at all. I think this helps men understand women more. God's design for marriage is that husband is head of family, but that doesn't mean He got rid of the punishment from the Fall just like with childbearing pain. A wive can still love and submit despite feeling this punishment, but Genesis 3:16 suggests it will be an internal battle at least because her desire is to do what she wants instead.
I strongly disagree. Punishment was not a factor in the "Proverbs 31" family. In this model family, the wife was an entrepreneur and had full freedom to do things like making and selling goods, buying real estate: She even had servants. Her husband and children praised her. That is a family that sustains, prospers and builds each other up through love for one another instead of tearing one another down with conflict and strife.. Notice again, that this woman has no "boss" to order her around on the job: she is an entrepreneur and happily submits to her husband only. By contrast to many men, the "proverbs 31" man is a well known man in his community, and he doesn't have to beg for intimacy with his wife. He trusts her fully to "have his back" and to meet all his needs as he meets hers. Read it bro. I see no "punishment" in any of that.
Any honest woman will say she is nowhere close to being the Proverbs 31 wife. The Proverbs 31 wife is not based on a real woman. The verses also say this type of woman is as rare as rubies.
No, Proverbs 31 is a model, an example for us as to how a Christian family is supposed to be. I never said it was common nor did I say it existed. But this is the model of a family which God WANTS people to have. If He didn't he wouldn't have put it in there for us to read. It's our choice whether or not to aspire to and pursue that lifestyle. It's not God's intentions for a Christian woman to endure "punishment" through submission to her husband, simply because she's a female. That's absurd and unbiblical.
Proverbs 31:10-31 is a composite of characteristics taken from a diverse group of virtuous women throughout the Bible.
A wife of noble character who can find? (v. 10)
Ruth was know as a woman of noble character (Ru 3:11). Lydia was a woman of noble character. The name “Lydia” means noble. She is clothed in fine linen and purple (v. 22b). Lydia sold purple cloth (Ac 16:14). Both Lydia and the Pr 31 woman were merchants.
She brings him good, not harm, all the days of her life (v. 12).
Zipporah did what Moses failed to do. She circumcised their son. As a result, God spared Moses' life (Ex 4:14-20).
She has been like a merchant’s ship that brings its merchandise from far away (v. 14).
The Queen of Sheba literally brought Solomon large quantities of spices from far away. (1 Ki 10:6-10).
Reward her for her work— let her actions result in public praise (v. 31).
The Queen of Sheba’s quest for wisdom brought her public praise. The Queen of Sheba is one of the few women Jesus publicly acknowledged and commended from the OT(Ma 12:42). She came from afar to hear the wisdom of a mere man. She was amazed at what she saw and heard. However, when Jesus who was greater than Solomon came, many despised, rejected, slighted and slandered Him.
Doesn’t let her lamp go out… (v. 18b).
Anna’s lamp didn’t go out at night because she worshiped God day and night by fasting and praying (Lu 2:36-38).
Helps the poor (v. 20).
Dorcas helped the poor (Ac 9:36).
speaks with wisdom, and faithful instruction is on her tongue (v. 26).
The Wise Woman of Abel’s instruction saved her city from destruction (2 Sa 20:19-22). Huldah spoke with wisdom and sent the king a message from God
(2 Ki 22:14-20). Deborah wisely instructed the people of Israel (Ju chapter 4 & 5). Esther spoke wisely to the king and helped save the Jews from annihilation (Book of Esther). Priscilla helped her husband give Apollos wise and faithful instruction (Ac 18:26). Abigail spoke wisely to David. David recognized the wisdom in Abigail's words, and he decided not to kill Abigail's foolish husband and the other men in that household (1 Sam chapter 25).
She watches over the affairs of her household (v. 27a).
Rahab watched over the affairs of her household. She wisely and faithfully instructed the spies about how to hide and escape. She also negotiated a plan that saved her life and the lives of those in her house (He 11:31).
Her children arise and call her blessed (v. 29).
These women were also called blessed:
Jael; Ju 5:24,
Mary; Lu 1:28,
Abigail; 1 Sam 25:32-33.
Reward her for her work— let her actions result in public praise (v. 31 ISV).
Unnamed woman who anointed Jesus' HEAD (not his feet) at Bethany with perfume to prepare Jesus for burial. Jesus said that wherever the gospel is preached what the unnamed woman did will be told in memory of her (result in public praise). Mt 26:6-13
What are your thoughts/interpretation of Genesis 3:16?
God punished Adam by cursing the ground which resulted in toiling and struggling, something we would not have faced in the Garden.
Genesis 3:17:
To Adam he said, 'Because you listened to your wife and ate fruit from the tree about which I commanded you, 'You must not eat from it,' 'Cursed is the ground because of you; through painful toil you will eat food from it all the days of your life.
Many people including I consider work a blessing and gift. Nevertheless, despite work being a blessing, there is an element of toiling especially evident to farmers or people who grow their own food, but also in other professions as well.
Or broadly speaking, despite life being a blessing, we have to deal with physical decline and death.
Along the same thought, women were cursed with the husband ruling over them. Things were much better before the Fall in that regard. Paul gives some instructions on how husbands and wives should treat and view eachother, nevertheless women have to deal with the "curse-fueled itch" to control due to the Fall.
How is a woman’s desire for her husband a curse (Genesis 3:16)? | GotQuestions.org
Yes, there is "ruling", "obeying". disrespect, nagging, arguing and physical abuse and all that; a constant battle for control in marriages all over the world as we speak. But God's model in Proverbs 31, and for New Testament Christians, is for wives to do the submitting and obeying willingly out of love and obedience to Christ instead of by force or punishment.(see 1 Peter 3) Unfortunately our Feminist society hates that and wants no submission at all. In a Christian family. I think it's actually supposed to be more about order, than punishment. Hence, the husband is designated as the "head" and he is to perform his duty out of love and obedience to Christ as well.
1 Peter 3: 7 Likewise, ye husbands, dwell with them according to knowledge, giving honour unto the wife, as unto the weaker vessel, and as being heirs together of the grace of life; that your prayers be not hindered.