Key OT Teachings

[GWH]

Marriage is not a Spiritual union. The Lord never said the two become married, the Lord said the two become One flesh. Many people today are disorderly and are One flesh without being Married. I am guilty of this crime and working in this time to correct it with the One who I first became One flesh is.

This was thousands of years ago, there is much better order on the Earth this day. In America Marriage is a thing ordered by the Higher Powers that are the Police force and Government of Pay, In Our time, One ought to get married by LAW before they lay together, or they simply lay together out of order, which is what I myself am going through and on my way to fulfilling what God said to do when that happens:

16 ¶ And if a man entice a maide that is not betrothed, and lie with her, he shall surely endow her to be his wife. -- Exodus 22:16 (1611 King James)

I am on the Journey to winning back the heart of the maide that I first lied with as the Lord revealed to me everything in my life started going through Spirituall affliction Less than a decade ago when I first laid with the wife of my Bosom and left her due to very ignorant reasons.

When Jesus quoted GN 2:24, he added "So they are no longer two, but one flesh. Therefore what God has joined together, let no one separate." We will get to this TOJ later (in that thread). but the point now is that obviously the two do not go around town joined physically as one, so the union that is not separated MUST be spiritual--which I can affirm from observing my parents' 75-year-long happy marriage and by experiencing my own 50+ years of happy marriage.

IOW, a reason your marriage involved fornication is that you two did not have the proper understanding and commitment. I am glad you are doing better now and I hope the teaching of Jesus along with my two cents helps.

 

[Eli1]

Sigh.
Why do some of you try to find words in different concepts and then try to unify the concepts?

How about the concept is the same but the words people use could be different?
Just like apostles were different too and used different styles of writing derived from their personalities in writing the Bible.
Why are you trying to find the word "bang" in scripture? I mean seriously? Where is the word 'airplane' too?

But the concept is there:

Bible: "And God said, “Let there be light,” and there was light. God saw that the light was good, and he separated the light from the darkness. God called the light “day,” and the darkness he called “night.” And there was evening, and there was morning—the first day. "

Science aka 'Us understanding reality through our eyes and mind": In the beginning there was nothing and then there was a Big Bang which started everything in existence.

Both of these groups are talking about the same thing using different language.
Focus on the meaning, as opposed to trying to find points to argue ... unless you like arguing which could be fun for some folks.

The only difference is that we as believers know that God is real not just through observance of reality but through Jesus Christ alone.
And atheists will do everything to evade or reject sound arguments based on reality, because we all know they don't believe in the Bible.

 

[GWH]

Sigh.
Why do some of you try to find words in different concepts and then try to unify the concepts?

How about the concept is the same but the words people use could be different?
Just like apostles were different too and used different styles of writing derived from their personalities in writing the Bible.
Why are you trying to find the word "bang" in scripture? I mean seriously? Where is the word 'airplane' too?

But the concept is there:

Bible: "And God said, “Let there be light,” and there was light. God saw that the light was good, and he separated the light from the darkness. God called the light “day,” and the darkness he called “night.” And there was evening, and there was morning—the first day. "

Science aka 'Us understanding reality through our eyes and mind": In the beginning there was nothing and then there was a Big Bang which started everything in existence.

Both of these groups are talking about the same thing using different language.
Focus on the meaning, as opposed to trying to find points to argue ... unless you like arguing which could be fun for some folks.

The only difference is that we as believers know that God is real not just through observance of reality but through Jesus Christ alone.
And atheists will do everything to evade or reject sound arguments based on reality, because we all know they don't believe in the Bible.

Amen!

 

[GWH]

I thought someone might object to me citing science as a source along with the story of A&E for understanding humanity, but seeing none I will move on to GN 2:24. “For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife, and they will become one flesh”.

This indicates that marriage is a spiritual union of one man and one wife, not merely a ceremony or legal contract. Jesus quoted this verse and added “So they are no longer two, but one. Therefore what God has joined together, let man not separate.” (MT 19:4-6)

The only relationship in which sexual intercourse is appropriate or moral is marriage; extramarital sex is the sin of fornication, which is akin to the sin of pornography (cf. GL 5:19, RM 1:27).

Also, because divorce is wrong, the only moral option for a married couple is to work to be happy rather than be miserable and become spiritually divorced, and if happiness is not achieved, it would have been better not to marry (cf. MT 19:8-10).

GN 3:4. The serpent contradicted God and thereby tempted Adam and Eve to commit the first sin. In GN 2:17, God had told Adam and Eve they would die if they ate fruit from the tree of knowledge of good and evil, but the serpent introduced the option of ungodliness or functional atheism, which they chose. The first or original sin was not eating physical fruit, but rather choosing not to doubt the Devil, not to cooperate with God, and not asking God why the serpent contradicted what He had told them (MT 7:7). It is wise to question God.

GN 3:7-13. Adam and Eve tried to cover up their crime, refusing to accept responsibility for their mistakes. They should have confessed immediately (1JN 1:9). Instead their ungodly attitude was manifested by a chain of sins, including their silly attempt to hide from God and to blame someone else, and very likely by “dysfunctional” parenting that probably contributed to the emotional disturbance (anger) in Cain that resulted in the murder of Abel and so on and so forth through the millenniums (cf. humanity’s sinful “King of the Hill”/KOTH strife).

 

[GWH]

Now that we all understand what was the first sin, that it was committed by A&E together, and that we should learn from their mistakes/chain sinning to confess ignorance rather than argue pridefully, let us continue.

GN 9:6. “Whoever sheds the blood of man, by man shall his blood be shed.” Capital punishment is appropriate for capital crimes. The principle of "life for life" (stated in EX 21:24) is introduced.

This is the first time the role of humanity in establishing moral laws and enforcing them with just or logical consequences is affirmed in the Bible. Its NT equivalent is RM 13:1-4. It is intended to discourage people from choosing or practicing KOTH and to encourage God's will to be done/the kingdom of God to come on earth.

 

[GWH]

GN 9:7-17. In verse seven, humanity is commanded to “Be fruitful and increase in number”, but not to overpopulate and pollute the earth.
In verse 15 God says, “Never again will the waters become a flood to destroy all life.” If God promises not to destroy life again, neither should mankind create a flood of pollution that destroys it, but rather mankind should be good stewards of our earthly resources.

Of course, sin is the worst form of pollution.

 

[GWH]

GN 11:9b. “…The Lord confused the language of the whole world. From there the Lord scattered them over the face of the whole earth.”

This verse apparently contradicts the teaching of Paul in 1CR 14:33: “God is not a God of disorder [disunity or KOTH] but of peace.” Sometimes when interpreting the Bible, we are forced to choose between diverse interpretations or conceptions of God--unless they can be harmonized.

In this case, it would seem that one needs to distinguish between God’s intentional will for all to be saved (1TM 2:3-4) and unified (JN 17:20-23) and His permissive will that allows souls to sin (MT 23:37), become divided and engage in KOTH (king of the hill struggle).

 

[GWH]

GN 12:3b. All people on earth will be blessed through Abraham. About 2,000 B.C., Abraham became a monotheist and moved from Ur to Canaan, where he became the patriarch of the Hebrews, who became the Israelites after the Exodus and eventually the Jews by the time of Jesus, who fulfilled God’s promise made to Abraham by completing His mission as Messiah or the Savior of all humanity who accept Him as Lord. This Abrahamic covenant is restated in GN 17:1-14, 18:18-19 & 22:15-18. Abraham is also claimed as the patriarch of the Arabs through Ishmael (GN 16:12, 17:19-21 & 21:9-21), who are part of the people who would be blessed by accepting God’s Messiah.

 

[GWH]

GN 15:6. Abraham’s faith in the Lord was credited to him as righteousness. This was a major theme of the teaching of the apostle Paul in his epistle to the Romans (RM 4:3,9-12&16-17). This is why Paul teaches that a true Jew is one whose “circumcision is of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the written code” (RM 2:29). Thus, all who become one with Jesus by faith are spiritual Jews and God’s chosen people (EPH 2:13-3:6), although it is possible that the political nation of Israel may play a further role in history before the eschaton.

 

[GWH]

Remember that y'all are invited to add any key OT teachings you think were skipped. Here is the next one I find:

GN 22:8, "God Himself will provide the Lamb..." These words of Abraham to Isaac may be viewed as the first prophetic reference to Jesus (JN 1:29), although they had an immediate fulfillment (in v.13).

Many years later, Moses instituted the sacrificial system that also portrayed the future messianic atonement. Jesus instituted the observance of the Lord’s Supper as a remembrance of the fact that His death fulfilled this system, so that Believers no longer need to practice it (cf. HB 7:18-10:1).

 

[GWH]

After Abraham, Isaac had two sons, Esau and Jacob. Jacob, whose name was changed to Israel (in GN 32:28 & 35:10), had twelve “sons”, whose families moved to Egypt because of drought and famine in Canaan, where they became slaves of the pharaohs (GN 47:21) until Moses led the Exodus. When Moses was called by God, he asked God to reveal His name, and God’s answer is our next key teaching IMO.

EX 3:14. God is “I AM” or the source of awareness or existence.

In order to study/seek reality it appears that one must (logically or implicitly) begin by assuming at least the reality of the student/seeker. Thus, absolute skepticism in philosophy is like absolute zero in physics: it serves as a hypothetical point that is not actually achieved or else nothing would happen.

An “ism” affirms some valid part of reality. The truth represented by skepticism is that finite human beings cannot know absolutely, infallibly, perfectly or objectively. I find this truth expressed by the apostle Paul in the New Testament (NT) book of 1 Corinthians 13:9&12, “We know in part . . . We see but a poor reflection” (as in a fogged mirror).

The element of uncertainty does not prevent would-be skeptics from talking as if knowledge with some degree of confidence were possible the moment they attempt to communicate their doubts. An agnostic has “certain” assumptions at least implicitly: that truth is believable, rational and meaningful, even though unprovable or subjective.

Rene Descartes (d.1650) became famous for saying, “cogito ergo sum” (“I think, therefore I am”), which expresses the apparent fact that our own self-consciousness is the only truth that we know with certainty. Otherwise we finite and fallible folks walk by faith regarding reality. We accept scientific theories or assumptions and mathematical facts or axioms as true because they work sufficiently well for physical purposes, and we believe Scriptural teachings regarding the Gospel of Christ because they offer the best and most credible hope for heaven, both on earth and for eternity.

 

[GWH]

Cruising right along after Moses led the Exodus, he received the Ten Commandments from God, which for our purposes we will consider as one key teaching, but y'all may want to comment on some of them individually.

EX 20:1-17. God requires moral perfection (cf. DT 5:6-21). Of course each of the Ten Commandments is important, and Jesus affirmed many of them in the “Sermon on the Mount (MT 5:21-48). The key point is that all commandments teach us to cooperate with the Lawgiver, whose moral will was not ended by the Gospel or rescinded by the death of Messiah.

There are additional moral precepts, such as those found in EX 21, 22 & LV 18-20, but most of the other Mosaic commands are either part of the sacrificial system or instructions for treating various health problems.

Jesus taught that God’s standard is perfection (cf. LV 19:1), and he clarified that the Sabbath was made for the sake of humankind (MT 12:7f.), perhaps so they would have a day to rest and worship God. However, Paul indicated (in CL 2:16f., cf. 1CR 10:23&31) that we should serve God every day or continually, and both he and Jesus explained how the perfect “rest” is attained (Paul in 2THS 5:16-22 & PHP 3:7-9, cf. HB 4:9, and Jesus in MT 11:28).

 

[GWH]

The next key teaching I find is not until after the 40 years of wandering in the wilderness. It occurs in the sermon Moses preached just before he died and Joshua led the Israelites in the conquest of Canaan.

DT 30:19. We have moral free will, which makes us accountable for our attitudes and actions, our belief and behavior, with ultimate logical or appropriate consequences, which are termed heaven or hell.

It is this teaching that explains why this life has so much pain and hatred: Most of it results from human sinfulness/ungodliness. If humanity spent as much energy trying to solve problems as it has engaged in KOTH (king of the hill struggles), earthly life would be almost heavenly.

 

[Leastofall]

I really find your views on creation quite entertaining. I believe that if man were to reason creation to his understanding you gwh would get a reward.
In fact it seems that the Lord had this conversation with job in a sense.
The very details are right before your eyes yet you seemed to have missed them.
I apologize if I sound cross but so many people miss what the Holy Spirit puts before them and the next thing you know some one starts parroting scientist, and ASTRO physics, ....ect......which are 85% theory.

Let's start from the beginning.
In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.......same God that said ..."MY WAYS ARE HIGHER THAN YOUR WAYS.

Now GOD created.........created = Bara which means to create out of nothing. Your talking about yastar which is to make out of something.

Yes indeed it was seven days.....God said it ...Moses confirms it ....and creation displays it.
2 questions ......why do all calenders have 7 day weeks?
Better yet God on the seventh day rested and called it to be holy.......sabbath. now study the moon phases which are important to the sabbaths....see where 7 comes into play..

 

[GWH]

I really find your views on creation quite entertaining. I believe that if man were to reason creation to his understanding you gwh would get a reward.
In fact it seems that the Lord had this conversation with job in a sense.
The very details are right before your eyes yet you seemed to have missed them.
I apologize if I sound cross but so many people miss what the Holy Spirit puts before them and the next thing you know some one starts parroting scientist, and ASTRO physics, ....ect......which are 85% theory.

Let's start from the beginning.
In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.......same God that said ..."MY WAYS ARE HIGHER THAN YOUR WAYS.

Now GOD created.......... Your talking about yastar which is to make out of something.

Yes indeed it was seven days.....God said it ...Moses confirms it ....and creation displays it.
2 questions ......why do all calenders have 7 day weeks?
Better yet God on the seventh day rested and called it to be holy.......sabbath. now study the moon phases which are important to the sabbaths....see where 7 comes into play..

I see you are going back to the beginning, so to speak:

GN 1:1-3. “God created the heavens and the earth” by saying “Let there be…”, so the supernatural world manifests the Word of God in an impersonal way. Created = Bara which means to create out of nothing, or what secular scientists call a "singularity".

There is no reason to believe that the “days” in GN 1 must refer to 24-hour periods, because 2PT 2:8 says “With the Lord a day is like a thousand [or a billion] years”, so it is permissible to believe God created the world using whatever methods taking however long scientific data seem to support, because all truth is God's truth.

However, the point of GN is not how the world was created or how long it took, but who created it and why. It is concerned with metaphysics rather than mere physics. As Paul teaches in RM 1:20, “Since the creation of the world, God’s invisible qualities—his eternal power and divine nature—have been clearly seen, being understood from what has been made, so that people are without excuse.” And John says in JN 1:14, “The Word became flesh [human] and made his dwelling among us. We have seen his glory, the glory of the One and Only, who came from the Father, full of grace and truth.”

 

[Leastofall]

I see you are going back to the beginning, so to speak:

GN 1:1-3. “God created the heavens and the earth” by saying “Let there be…”, so the supernatural world manifests the Word of God in an impersonal way. Created = Bara which means to create out of nothing, or what secular scientists call a "singularity".

There is no reason to believe that the “days” in GN 1 must refer to 24-hour periods, because 2PT 2:8 says “With the Lord a day is like a thousand [or a billion] years”, so it is permissible to believe God created the world using whatever methods taking however long scientific data seem to support, because all truth is God's truth.

However, the point of GN is not how the world was created or how long it took, but who created it and why. It is concerned with metaphysics rather than mere physics. As Paul teaches in RM 1:20, “Since the creation of the world, God’s invisible qualities—his eternal power and divine nature—have been clearly seen, being understood from what has been made, so that people are without excuse.” And John says in JN 1:14, “The Word became flesh [human] and made his dwelling among us. We have seen his glory, the glory of the One and Only, who came from the Father, full of grace and truth.”

Some how I knew you would quote 2 Peter 2:8 as a reference to the creation. Many do.
More importantly I like to say thank you for your peaceful response to my post. I see that you seem to really like a informed discussion on the topic. Many get defensive and start derailing with insistent view points.

Now back to 2 Peter what was he referencing. Yes he is referencing Genesis but not the creation (at least to my understanding) but something that the Lord said to Adam.

" in that day you eat of the fruit you shall surely die." Says the Lord.
But wait both Adam and eve lived long after the offense. Got kicked out , Had sons, ect. Now look at the days of Adam. A bit short of a thousand years.
Paul said it is appointed to man to die once then the judgement .
Peter was referring to the appointed times of God. Which are his sabbaths and feast days. That are established in the creation ( heavens).
God used the setting and rising of the sun to show the count of days it took for creation. Which were 6 which is the number of man.

 

[GWH]

Some how I knew you would quote 2 Peter 2:8 as a reference to the creation. Many do.
More importantly I like to say thank you for your peaceful response to my post. I see that you seem to really like a informed discussion on the topic. Many get defensive and start derailing with insistent view points.

Now back to 2 Peter what was he referencing. Yes he is referencing Genesis but not the creation (at least to my understanding) but something that the Lord said to Adam.

" in that day you eat of the fruit you shall surely die." Says the Lord.
But wait both Adam and eve lived long after the offense. Got kicked out , Had sons, ect. Now look at the days of Adam. A bit short of a thousand years.
Paul said it is appointed to man to die once then the judgement .
Peter was referring to the appointed times of God. Which are his sabbaths and feast days. That are established in the creation ( heavens).
God used the setting and rising of the sun to show the count of days it took for creation. Which were 6 which is the number of man.

Yes, too many on CC seem to prefer scoring points to learning better interpretations of GW, but I view the enemy as ignorance of Truth and try to ignore insults. I have enjoyed adding a few points to my website as a result of interacting with folks here.

This applies to the discussion of literal days vs. figurative days in GN. Whatever is true is fine with me, but at this point it seems like science has a believable case for viewing the latter to be true, and 2PT 2:8 hints at how to harmonize Scripture and science. I love harmonization/agreement/unity rather than argument/divisiveness/quarreling! :^)

 

[GWH]

The next key teaching I find is not until after the 40 years of wandering in the wilderness. It occurs in the sermon Moses preached just before he died and Joshua led the Israelites in the conquest of Canaan.

DT 30:19. We have moral free will, which makes us accountable for our attitudes and actions, our belief and behavior, with ultimate logical or appropriate consequences, which are termed heaven or hell.

It is this teaching that explains why this life has so much pain and hatred: Most of it results from human sinfulness/ungodliness. If humanity spent as much energy trying to solve problems as it has engaged in KOTH (king of the hill struggles), earthly life would be almost heavenly.

I have found this verse to be so relevant for discussion on some CC threads that I think it ought to be repeated before we go on to the next key OT passage.

DT 30:19. We have moral free will, which makes us accountable for our attitudes and actions, our belief and behavior, with ultimate logical or appropriate consequences, which are termed heaven or hell.

This verse indicates why this life has so much pain and hatred: Most of it results from humanity choosing sinfulness/ungodliness.

If humanity tried to solve problems by cooperating with God and working together instead of engaging in KOTH (king of the hill struggles), the Lord's Prayer would be answered and this earthly life would be almost heavenly.

 

[GWH]

Most of the material in the next few books (Joshua to Ezra) is historical rather than doctrinal, but I do find a few important items. Here are a couple from Joshua.

JSH 24-26. God will save everyone who cooperates with Him. The conquest of Canaan (in JSH 6:17-21, 8:2, 10:28 & 11:20) is cited by skeptics as condoning unjust violence by God against innocent babies. However, the Bible teaches that God is just (RM 3:22-30, 9:14), so we should be careful lest our explanations of God’s will seem unloving or unfair.

What is your explanation?

JSH 24:15. We must choose whom we will serve. As a song by Bob Dylan phrased it: “You may serve the devil or you may serve the Lord, but you gotta serve somebody.” (This teaching correlates with DT 30:19.)

Any other songs about this truth?