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John Chapter 3 REFUTES Five Point Calvinism
- Thread starter Nehemiah6
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The John passage is the Lord choosing His disciples not salvation. Remember the Lord chose Judas as well.
Timothy is actually a good passage showing that God’s purpose is in Christ and once a person is in Christ, he is set apart for the Lord. Why are we saved and called? Because we placed our trust in Jesus Christ.
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UnderGrace
Guest
2Tim 1:9 confirms John 15:19 making the application to us as perfectly valid.
2Tim 1:9 has the same truth as...
And we know that for those who love God all things work together for good, for those who are called according to his purpose. For those whom he foreknew he also predestined to be conformed to the image of his Son, in order that he might be the firstborn among many brothers. And those whom he predestined he also called, and those whom he called he also justified, and those whom he justified he also glorified. (Rom 8:28-30)
Your approach makes man man the initiator and first mover rather than God. It exalts man's faith over God's grace. It tends to making man the center of salvation, part of the humanism of the age.
I suppose when all is said and done, in heaven you will have room for boasting and can say, "I am here, because I chose Him."
There it is....you said who would receive him......and who would reject him
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eternally-gratefull
Guest
Yep
and preacher tried the same lie
where in this post did I say I chose God
the words are not there
receiving him Is the gospel. It us us recieving his grace, based on the fact
1. he chose us
2. he drew us
3. he taught us and convinced us of our sin, and
4. he taught us What he did to save us
oh and by the way, recieving him is in the word
John 1: 12 12 But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, to those who believe in His name: 13 who were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.
1. we receive him how? By faith
2. We recieve him not by birth (bloodline)
3. we recieve him not by the will of the flesh , it’s not by my will, it’s by gods will, my Will could never save me
4. We recieve him not by the will of man, our parents our spouses our children, no one can Will us to heaven
5. we recieved him by the power of God, through faith just as John said in vs 12
it is NOT chosing him, preacher has you fooled and confused and being into his lies,
try looking up the words, they (the word chose and recieved) do not mean the same
you have been misled
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eternally-gratefull
Guest
Yep
thats not me chosing him
two different words
i asked where I said I chose him
show where I said this? Can you.
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eternally-gratefull
Guest
Oh says who? John disagrees with you
it as many as recieved him to THEM he gave the right or Literally empowered To become children of god
you did not get born again before you received him. No one did
Preacher can you explain to me where EG said he chose God on my above post?...the one you showed me...thank you.
I can’t get my head round it.....show me where he said he chose God?
You involved me in your dispute with one another..now please show me.
I can’t get my head round it.....show me where he said he chose God?
You involved me in your dispute with one another..now please show me.
Correct. The Holy Spirit is NOT given to unregenerate sinners. So only those who repent and believe receive the gift of the Holy Ghost, and only who receive the Spirit (and are sealed with the Spirit) are born of the Spirit.
REPENTANCE AND FAITH COME FIRST, THEN THE GIFT OF THE SPIRIT
Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost... Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls. (Acts 2:38,41)
In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that Holy Spirit of promise... (Eph 1:13)
So if we look at the chronological progression in Ephesians 1:13 it goes like this with explanatory notes (also note that repentance is not mentioned here since that is a given):
1. "the Gospel of your salvation"(was first preached to you)
2. "after that ye heard the Word of Truth" (and you were convicted by the Spirit)
3. "In whom ye also trusted" (then you believed on the Lord Jesus Christ and were saved)
4. "after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that Holy Spirit of promise" (and then you received the gift of the Holy Spirit)
5. Not mentioned here: (and then you were born again)
But it is mentioned here: But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God. (John 1:12,13). To "receive" Christ is to believe on Him with all your heart. The New Birth comes only after believing and receiving Christ, not before.
Spiritual faith comes by hearing, but who is it that hears? John 10:26-29, But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep (regenerated children of God), as I said unto you, my sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me, and I give unto them eternal life, and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand. My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all, and no man is able to pluck them out of my hand.
The world in John 3:16 has reference to the world of those that believe. 1 John 2:15, Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world, if any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him. Does this mean that God does not love some that are in the world?
Misinterpretation of the scriptures proves nothing. If the scriptures do not harmonise, then you are misinterpreting them.
NO, THAT IS TOTALLY FALSE. And here is the evidence.
Οὕτως γὰρ ἠγάπησεν ὁ θεὸς τὸν κόσμον* ὥστε τὸν υἱὸν αὐτοῦ τὸν μονογενῆ ἔδωκεν ἵνα πᾶς ὁ πιστεύων εἰς αὐτὸν μὴ ἀπόληται ἀλλ' ἔχῃ ζωὴν
αἰώνιον.
For God so loved the world*, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
Strong's Concordance (2889)
kosmos: order, the world
Original Word: κόσμος, ου, ὁ
Part of Speech: Noun, Masculine
Transliteration: kosmos
Phonetic Spelling: (kos'-mos)
Definition: order, the world
Usage: the world, universe; worldly affairs; the inhabitants of the world; adornment.
Thayer's Greek Lexicon
STRONGS NT 2889: κόσμος
5. the inhabitants of the world:
θέατρον ἐγενήθημεντῷ κόσμῳ καί ἀγγέλοις καί ἀνθρώποις, 1 Corinthians 4:9 (Winers Grammar, 127 (121)); particularly the inhabitants of the earth, men, the human race (first so in Sap. (e. g. )): Matthew 13:38; Matthew 18:7;Mark 14:9; John 1:10, 29 ( L in brackets); ; Romans 3:6, 19; 1 Corinthians 1:27f (cf. Winer's Grammar, 189 (178)); ;2 Corinthians 5:19; James 2:5 (cf. Winer's Grammar, as above); 1 John 2:2 (cf. Winer's Grammar, 577 (536));
I agree with everything you said on Calvinism. This is a very interesting thing to say. Technically we are all decreed for damnation, if we werent then we would all go to heaven, everyone would. Its like saying all ways lead to God. What you said was very interesting but this is my insight on it.
