If it be thy will
- Thread starter Jordon
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to you it is but not to me.
Yep all Gods word being used which was, and has already been ordained. For all means to change things for you or i.
In the beginning was the word and the word became flesh for all means, all ready set in motion by his plan which you can't change, his plan is set in motion to change your mind not his.
Again he wasnt making a case For God changing his mind he was making a case for we can't change his mind.
God changing his mind is not something he needs to do, because he's already provided you the means and the plan he has for you, so where it looks as if he's changed his mind, What's actually happening is his plan is working, where by his means you have responded in away that trusts in his means.
You are arguing two seemingly contradictory things.
1. God changes things.
And 2. God's will is already ordained.
Until you stop presenting contradictory premises as though they are compatible, your theology will remain internally inconsistent and nonsensical.
I agree that God makes out you have a reason to be actively involved in God's will by coming to Him. But not by trusting in means He has already set in place. But by trusting His promises to change the destiny to something good for those who begin to trust in Him.
Does scripture say how soon it is before we pray that God knows we are going to pray. Which scripture/s are you relying on for this claim?
you think God, who created and called Moses against Moses's will, was surprised Moses did this?
You will have to show me in scripture where it was mans will That God created us
God changes things for you for your benefit you can't edify him, by his means already provided, nothing you can say can change what he already knows and has planed by his all knowing knowledge, for you to be able to change what he's already planned by his means would mean he hasn't thought of something,. And you have, and that you know something he doesn't, that's why prayer is about trusting in his will.
Which is what is meant by James 4:15
And James 4:15 should be included in James 1:4-5
Yes Gods changes things
Yes God's will has already been ordained
Within Gods will, that has already been ordained is his means by which can change you.
That's what changes, is you if trust in his means that has already ordained,
.where as God doesn't need to change his will or his mind.
So once again in scripture where it looks as if he's changed his mind he hasn't.
For instance moses saying lord remember your promise before you kill them, do you think God had forgot that, noooooo. That was mans human nature being silly with God thinking God could forget or not knowing whether he had, or thinking and believing his plea for mercy was not as important as his plea to bargain with God and step In front of God
It was the plea for mercy that changed the outcome of the Israelites people, and a plea for mercy is a means which the lord has already provided. But was the lord decision only delayed ?
You don't change Gods plan by telling him to remember his promise.
Remember 600.000 men where left in the wilderness, where they the same 6000.000 men who worshipping the golden calf too, maybe there was less than that worshipping the calf within the 600.000 maybe when they where worshiping the calf, maybe they never stopped worshipping idols even tho moses helped there outcome, they carried on with there babblings, even tho God was providing his means.
The point is within the promise he made to them, where conditions they obeyed whilst he led them, so moses saying remember your promise means nothing.
So what do you think change there outcome, the plea for forgiveness or the Moses bargain the lord has forgot his promise ?
let me ask you in this way Do you think Moses attempted to become God's guidance counselor ?
Do you think it's possible a man can be Gods guidance counselor
are you saying you need proof that God knows what your going to pray before you pray it,
And again what does how soon he knows have anything to do with it ?
in one way moses was yes but he was transformed by God.
It's believe he underwent a spiritual change on the mountain and was transformed by God so much so that his face was shinning with radiance when he came down,
But the question still stands, does being transformed by God mean you can become God's guidance counsellor meaning you can Guide God himself
Tell me, what does everyone owe God? How does one pay this? Does payment differ depending on the desired change in path as you say? Can you pay too little and receive half a path change, or pay too much and receive two paths?