Genesis 3:16 He will rule over you.

[reneweddaybyday]

That approach is unusual. Many police officers are trained in the "Duluth Model" which teaches that women are never the abusers. The injustice resulting from that is profound.

I used to work for an attorney who practiced family law. We had one client who was in the military ... tall ... in shape. His wife beat him. I don't know how long he had withstood her physical assaults on him but he finally decided it was better for him to get a divorce from her because he was afraid that one time he would respond by hitting her back. I guess he finally had enough.

Tough, too, because they had kids. Sad for kids to be in situations like that ...

 

[kaylagrl]

Did Jesus accept the Gaul when He was on the cross?

Is this a serious question?!

 

[Diakonos]

Is this a serious question?!

No. In some cases like this, I just like to help people see the other points of view (when Scripture permits)

 

[kaylagrl]

No. In some cases like this, I just like to help people see the other points of view (when Scripture permits)

And which POV is that? Seemed a rather odd comment to what I said....

 

[presidente]

I have a lot of clover and I trim it halfway down with the weed wacker. It tends to grow in patches.

Clover mixed with just a bit of early spring dandelions taste great if stirfried with the proper seasoning.

 

[presidente]

Should a man get a vasectomy without anesthesia? You're the leaders after all.

Before the tubal ligation performed without anesthesia?

 

[Diakonos]

I haven't come to a conclusion about that yet. One one hand, Jesus refused the Gaul because He felt it necessary to experience all the wrath of God for our sins. If He accepted it, we would have called it "Gaulgotha" haha. Anyways....on the other hand, we are supposed to to "be sober-minded" and not be under the dominion of things that grow from the earth. So I'm still wrestling with it

 

[kaylagrl]

The Bible does teach wives submit to their husbands and to follow Sarah's example who obeyed Abraham calling him lord-- which implies a wife's submission should include obedience to her husband. The Bible tells wives to fear/reverence their husbands. The Bible commands husbands to love their wives as Christ loved the church, and to honor the wife as the weaker vessel that their prayers be not hindered.

The feminists have programmed people to associate Biblical teachings on wives submitting to their husbands with violence.

Well since you went there... It would be an opinion to say feminists have caused these issues. But, since I apparently like to pull the pin and see what happens in the BDF, I'd render a different opinion. My opinion is that many Christian men have a horrific misunderstanding of what "submit"means. And many women have suffered much abuse because of it.

Domestic violence is a problem for those who experience it, of course. But apparently, there is some data indicating that about 40% of it is female on male, and female on male violence is under reported because what man is going to call the police and tell them his wife is hitting him.

According to the National Domestic Hotline:
3 in 10 women (29%) and 1 in 10 men (10%) in the US have experienced rape, physical violence and/or stalking by a partner


1 in 4 women (24.3%) and 1 in 7 men (13.8%) aged 18 and older in the United States have been the victim of severe physical violence by an intimate partner in their lifetime.

Some of their models of domestic abuse include relatively normal male behaviors and even quoting scripture about the roles of wives in the home, as if it were immoral or abusive to do so.

Not sure what you'd consider normal male behavior. And it could be abusive mentally if submission is used in the wrong context.

The Bible does teach wives submit to their husbands and to follow Sarah's example who obeyed Abraham calling him lord-- which implies a wife's submission should include obedience to her husband. The Bible tells wives to fear/reverence their husbands. The Bible commands husbands to love their wives as Christ loved the church, and to honor the wife as the weaker vessel that their prayers be not hindered.

Again, it depends on the word submission and obedience. Fear? Not a word that should be used, there are better more appropriate translations than that.

 

[kaylagrl]

Before the tubal ligation performed without anesthesia?

Missing the point. If a woman is not suppose to take meds for suffering in childbirth then men should not use any equipment to do their jobs. We'll all go back to OT living before tractors, trucks and machines. That was the comparison I was making in a tongue in cheek way. But I've been jumped twice already. Which tells me something...

 

[Dino246]

I haven't come to a conclusion about that yet. One one hand, Jesus refused the Gaul because He felt it necessary to experience all the wrath of God for our sins. If He accepted it, we would have called it "Gaulgotha" haha. Anyways....on the other hand, we are supposed to to "be sober-minded" and not be under the dominion of things that grow from the earth. So I'm still wrestling with it

The word is "gall". Gaul is a region of West-central Europe in the time of the Roman empire.

 

[Lanolin]

"To the woman He said: “I will sharply increase your pain in childbirth; in pain you will bring forth children. Your desire will be for your husband, and he will rule over you.” (Genesis 3:16)

We are told that: "Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law" (Galations 3:13) Does this mean that the Husband and wife are to be equal partners in a marriage and that in a Christian marriage the husband does not "rule" over the wife? Or does the women still have to submit herself to her husband in the same way that we are to submit ourself to Christ.

I believe that Jesus went to Calvery to sacrifice Himself for His Bride. In the same way the Husband should die to self and sacrifice himself for his wife in the way that Jesus set an example for us to follow.

Should the women go through natural childbirth and not try to avoid the pain?

well Eve was already pregnant by then so she didnt really have much of a choice.

 

[Lanolin]

The interesting thing is Eve did not try to abort her first child but he actually ended up killing her second.

I think back then God helped with the childbirth but did warn that it would be painful. Every woman knows this. But women still do it. unfortunatley one cant say to anyone who is foolishly in love with someone that there are actually consequences to having sexual intercourse. when the pill was invented it seemed men thought wow women can all be prostitutes now. um no.

 

[garee]

The interesting thing is Eve did not try to abort her first child but he actually ended up killing her second.

I think back then God helped with the childbirth but did warn that it would be painful. Every woman knows this. But women still do it. unfortunatley one cant say to anyone who is foolishly in love with someone that there are actually consequences to having sexual intercourse. when the pill was invented it seemed men thought wow women can all be prostitutes now. um no.

I think the relief in pain of childbirth is the relief or rest we have in Christ. Yoked with him who dwells in the believer.

From the way I understand the name Cain a word meaning; "acquired possession". Named as a hope that Adam and Eve had been given. . . . away back into a relationship with God not seen. Abel a word that gives the idea of vanity seeing the vanity .God teaching them to walk by faith .

It would seem he uses first born that way throughout . And can be applied with the example of Paul and Timothy.

Galatians 4:19 My little children, of whom I travail in birth again until Christ be formed in you,

Same principle the suffering of faith

Revelation 12 King James Version (KJV) And there appeared a great wonder in heaven; a woman clothed with the sun, and the moon under her feet, and upon her head a crown of twelve stars: And she being with child cried, travailing in birth, and pained to be delivered.

 

[Diakonos]

The word is "gall". Gaul is a region of West-central Europe in the time of the Roman empire.

Thank you haha, that's what I meant

 

[Dino246]

Thank you haha, that's what I meant

I figured as much. You seem like a pretty smart cookie.

 

[Diakonos]

I figured as much. You seem like a pretty smart cookie.

The Lord is a smart cookie. I don't have to know all the answers, I just need to know the One who does, and what He has said
Believe it or not, I'm actually a horrible speller. I have to use spell check a lot time before I post comments. So if its not in the English dictionary...I'm on my own haha

 

[presidente]

According to the National Domestic Hotline:
3 in 10 women (29%) and 1 in 10 men (10%) in the US have experienced rape, physical violence and/or stalking by a partner

How many men are going to call a hotline and say, "My wife is beating me up?" That does not seem to be a good method for collecting data on this issue.

1 in 4 women (24.3%) and 1 in 7 men (13.8%) aged 18 and older in the United States have been the victim of severe physical violence by an intimate partner in their lifetime.

Is this from the same source? Men may not report abuse as much as women. Men may be less likely to report aggravated sodomy than women are with rape. Men do not like reporting their wives and girlfriends are hitting them. It may be perceived as unmanly, the police may not take them seriously, and there is a good chance if they report a domestic violence incident, the man will be taken off in handcuffs whether he is guilty or not and branded as an abuser.

Not sure what you'd consider normal male behavior. And it could be abusive mentally if submission is used in the wrong context.

No, of course not. I could not find the page with something I'd look up before, but I was about to find this post makes some interesting points about abuse models that are intertwined with radical feminist philosophy. https://dalrock.wordpress.com/2015/10/27/way-ahead-of-you/

Again, it depends on the word submission and obedience. Fear? Not a word that should be used, there are better more appropriate translations than that.

This is from a literal rendering of Ephesians 5:33. We are also to fear God.

The Bible does not teach husbands to be fearsome to their wives.

 

[presidente]

The interesting thing is Eve did not try to abort her first child but he actually ended up killing her second.

I think back then God helped with the childbirth but did warn that it would be painful. Every woman knows this. But women still do it. unfortunatley one cant say to anyone who is foolishly in love with someone that there are actually consequences to having sexual intercourse. when the pill was invented it seemed men thought wow women can all be prostitutes now. um no.

Some of the women seemed to think that, the type that do not accept any money. Some still do.

Porneia refers to prostitution or sex outside of marriage, among other things. In the world, a prostitute who accepted 25 cents per customer might be considered lower class than one who charged $500. What does that say of those who charge nothing at all? That's considered to be a normal thing these days.

 

[presidente]

Missing the point. If a woman is not suppose to take meds for suffering in childbirth then men should not use any equipment to do their jobs. We'll all go back to OT living before tractors, trucks and machines. That was the comparison I was making in a tongue in cheek way. But I've been jumped twice already. Which tells me something...

I am not anti-epidural. But childbirth is a natural thing the human body was designed to do (the female body at least). Getting spayed and neutered isn't.

 

[presidente]

I used to work for an attorney who practiced family law. We had one client who was in the military ... tall ... in shape. His wife beat him. I don't know how long he had withstood her physical assaults on him but he finally decided it was better for him to get a divorce from her because he was afraid that one time he would respond by hitting her back. I guess he finally had enough.

Tough, too, because they had kids. Sad for kids to be in situations like that ...

I read a post from a man on a men's forum whose ex-wife would slap him awake when he was asleep. There are violent men who abuse their wives. But there are violent women, too. Even if a man is bigger and stronger, he has to sleep sometime and there are knives in the kitchen. Our society takes violence against men as a joke. Back in the 1980's, there was a woman who cut her husband, John Wayne Bobbitt. The information the media told about him did not make him out to be a kind husband, but plenty of people treated that like a joke. But people would take women being mutilated that way much more seriously and it would be considered out of line to joke about such things. There are people who say that it is not possible for a woman to rape a man, too. I would imagine it is quite rare. I can understand women thinking that, but I don't get men thinking that unless they are very old and have poor memories.

But now I am participating in the violence discussion. The Bible tells wives to submit to their husbands. That verse should not make 'domestic violect' pop into our heads. The connection with the curse, the man ruling over her might be a bit more connected, but I don't think it meant that Adam was going to beat Eve since she'd eaten of the fruit and offered it to Adam.