Doctrine of Unconditional Election

[rogerg]

The above text simply demands faith on Him to life(born again/ regeneration).

So do you believe that Christ is the Savior? Yes or no? Please answer

Belief : from Christ to us through the Holy Spirit , from us back to Christ

 

[Icedaisey]

100 Bible Verses about God Predetermined Whom He Would Save

 

[Icedaisey]

Yep, if we "Repent" and are forgiven in Christ.

Just to save time. Yes, or no. You will continue to reject the scriptures that tell us God predestined whom he would bring to His Salvation? His Elect.

 

[rogerg]

Salvation is a gift. Amen!, It is through Christ alone. Amen! the point is how are we saved through Christ alone Romans 6:23, the equation fits.

According to Rom 6:23, and with which I completely agree, we saved by God, aren't we?
As Paul tells us:

[Rom 8:2 KJV] 2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.

The law of the Spirit of Life, alone in Christ Jesus does it.

 

[fredoheaven]

1 Timothy is an epistle (letter) credited to the Apostle Paul. Paul would have to be consistent in order to be believed. And he is.

Ephesians 1:5 He predestined us for adoption as sons through Jesus Christ, according to the purpose of his will,

If you read all of 1 Timothy 1 for context you'll see this. What a perfect chapter.

Greeting

1Paul, an apostle of Christ Jesus by command of God our Savior and of Christ Jesus our hope,


2To Timothy, my true child in the faith:

Grace, mercy, and peace from God the Father and Christ Jesus our Lord.


Warning Against False Teachers
1 Timothy 1
Greeting

1Paul, an apostle of Christ Jesus by command of God our Savior and of Christ Jesus our hope,


2To Timothy, my true child in the faith:

Grace, mercy, and peace from God the Father and Christ Jesus our Lord.


3As I urged you when I was going to Macedonia, remain at Ephesus so that you may charge certain persons not to teach any different doctrine, 4nor to devote themselves to myths and endless genealogies, which promote speculations rather than the stewardshipa from God that is by faith. 5The aim of our charge is love that issues from a pure heart and a good conscience and a sincere faith. 6Certain persons, by swerving from these, have wandered away into vain discussion, 7desiring to be teachers of the law, without understanding either what they are saying or the things about which they make confident assertions.


8Now we know that the law is good, if one uses it lawfully, 9understanding this, that the law is not laid down for the just but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and sinners, for the unholy and profane, for those who strike their fathers and mothers, for murderers, 10the sexually immoral, men who practice homosexuality, enslavers,b liars, perjurers, and whatever else is contrary to soundc doctrine, 11in accordance with the gospel of the glory of the blessed God with which I have been entrusted.


Christ Jesus Came to Save Sinners

12I thank him who has given me strength, Christ Jesus our Lord, because he judged me faithful, appointing me to his service, 13though formerly I was a blasphemer, persecutor, and insolent opponent. But I received mercy because I had acted ignorantly in unbelief, 14and the grace of our Lord overflowed for me with the faith and love that are in Christ Jesus. 15The saying is trustworthy and deserving of full acceptance, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners, of whom I am the foremost. 16But I received mercy for this reason, that in me, as the foremost, Jesus Christ might display his perfect patience as an example to those who were to believe in him for eternal life. 17To the King of the ages, immortal, invisible, the only God, be honor and glory forever and ever.d Amen.


18This charge I entrust to you, Timothy, my child, in accordance with the prophecies previously made about you, that by them you may wage the good warfare, 19holding faith and a good conscience. By rejecting this, some have made shipwreck of their faith, 20among whom are Hymenaeus and Alexander, whom I have handed over to Satan that they may learn not to blaspheme.

Footnotes:
a 4 Or good order
b 10 That is, those who take someone captive in order to sell him into slavery
c 10 Or healthy
d 17 Greek to the ages of ages

Once can only reject what was given because as we glean from Paul's letter, those to whom he refers were already considered to hold faith and good conscience.


Acts 13:48 And when the Gentiles heard this, they began rejoicing and glorifying the word of the Lord, and as many as were appointed to eternal life believed.

It so happened Eph.1 stating predestination and the Act 13 refers to being" ordained not pre-ordained or pre-appointment. Seems inconsistent. Well, the appointment is to order the many that belief is the way to owning eternal life, consistent with 1 Timothy 1:16

 

[rogerg]

Salvation is a gift. Amen!, It is through Christ alone. Amen! the point is how are we saved through Christ alone Romans 6:23, the equation fits.

More precisely, only those names that were written into the book of life from the foundation of the world, will be saved. No
one can add to it or remove from it

[Rev 20:15 KJV] 15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

[Rev 17:8 KJV] 8 The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is.

 

[fredoheaven]

Just to save time. Yes, or no. You will continue to reject the scriptures that tell us God predestined whom he would bring to His Salvation? His Elect.

NO in rejecting the scripture of truth. Can this be said of you? Are you going to reject plain scripture with mere logic?

 

[Icedaisey]

It so happened Eph.1 stating predestination and the Act 13 refers to being" ordained not pre-ordained or pre-appointment. Seems inconsistent. Well, the appointment is to order the many that belief is the way to owning eternal life, consistent with 1 Timothy 1:16

That's a "no", to my prior question then?

 

[Icedaisey]

NO in rejecting the scripture of truth. Can this be said of you? Are you going to reject plain scripture with mere logic?

Your point isn't truth when you abrogate the scriptures and talk in circles in an effort to dismiss the actual words of God.

You answer then, and by your posting, is No. Rejecting the scripture that informs all things are predestined by God according to his purpose and will. Especially, as pertains to my question, because God doesn't predestine all things and then say, ohhhh yeah, except for Salvation! Just ignore those verses where I included that part about predestination of Salvation. (Hence the term, "Elect" OF God. Notice, it's not "Elect who chose God".)

You also reject those scriptures that inform us, in both Old and New Testaments, that God predestined whom he would save before the foundation of the world.

OK. Good to know. No use beating our heads against a wall trying to reason with someone that circles back to abrogating scripture and apostasy.

Thanks for your time.
Roger, now you know what you're up against.

 

[fredoheaven]

According to Rom 6:23, and with which I completely agree, we saved by God, aren't we?
As Paul tells us:

[Rom 8:2 KJV] 2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.

The law of the Spirit of Life, alone in Christ Jesus does it.

Yep, those who are are already IN ChristJesus Romans 8:1 To be IN Christ Jesus takes faith or believing on him.

 

[John146]

Its pretty hard to quantify that.

Lost people have their own understanding. Its the incorrect understanding, but they will never know it.

Romans 1
18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness;
19 Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.
20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:
21 Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.

 

[FreeGrace2]

1 Corinthians 2:18 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

Man has no capacity to do the things you think he does.

You just don't understand 1 Cor 2:14. It cannot be referring to understanding the gospel, because there are many examples of unbelievers who can very accurately describe what the gospel is, all the while rejecting it as truth.

In fact, v.6 and 10 speak of "wisdom for the mature" and the "deep things of God". These are the things that unbelievers cannot understand because it is these advanced doctrines that are for spiritual maturity, and that is irrelevant for unbelievers.

They can understand the gospel. Titus 2:11 makes that clear: For the grace of God has appeared that offers salvation to all people.

 

[rogerg]

It so happened Eph.1 stating predestination and the Act 13 refers to being" ordained not pre-ordained or pre-appointment. Seems inconsistent. Well, the appointment is to order the many that belief is the way to owning eternal life, consistent with 1 Timothy 1:16

[2Th 2:13 KJV] 13 But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:

 

[FreeGrace2]

Matthew 11:28 + Galatians 3:23

Please quote the verses so I know what translation you are using.

 

[FreeGrace2]

100 Bible Verses about God Predetermined Whom He Would Save

Of course He does. It is His plan. However, He has predetermined to save those who believe, as 1 Cor 1:21 very clearly says:

For since in the wisdom of God the world through its wisdom did not know him, God was pleased through the foolishness of what was preached to save those who believe.

What God DOESN'T do is cause anyone to believe. There are NO verses that say that.

 

[rogerg]

Yep, those who are are already IN ChristJesus Romans 8:1 To be IN Christ Jesus takes faith or believing on him.

Nope. It says the LAW of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus caused it, nothing Paul did, nor that anyone can do. Look at my post
regarding the book of life from the foundation of the world #1386. That book cannot be altered

 

[FreeGrace2]

[2Th 2:13 KJV] 13 But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:

This verse tells us the mechanism for being saved; which is by sanctification of the Spriit and BELIEF of the truth.

What it doesn't say is that God elects who will believe. And the word "chosen" here isn't the Greek word frequently translated "elect".

 

[fredoheaven]

You also reject those scriptures that inform us, in both Old and New Testaments, that God predestined whom he would save before the foundation of the world.

OK. Good to know. No use beating our heads against a wall trying to reason with someone that circles back to abrogating scripture and apostasy.

Thanks for your time.
Roger, now you know what you're up against.

The scripture of truth will not lie. I made this observation, that it seems you keep repeating your point but when it is being put to the test you accuse. For me, it is just simple to accuse you too or rejecting the scripture of truth as well. That would mean a stalemate? Nop. I simply reason out of the scripture.

Daniel 10:21
But I will shew thee that which is noted in the scripture of truth:

 

[rogerg]

The scripture of truth will not lie. I made this observation, that it seems you keep repeating your point but when it is being put to the test you accuse. For me, it is just simple to accuse you too or rejecting the scripture of truth as well. That would mean a stalemate? Nop. I simply reason out of the scripture.

If you don't believe in election, then explain these verses. God wrote the names of all those to become saved into the book of life from the foundation of the world. So, this book is a substantiation of the doctrine of election. Regardless of what someone may do or not do in this life, those who will become saved have already been determined.

Rev 17:8 KJV] 8 The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is.

[Rev 20:15 KJV] 15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

 

[fredoheaven]

More precisely, only those names that were written into the book of life from the foundation of the world, will be saved. No
one can add to it or remove from it

[Rev 20:15 KJV] 15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

[Rev 17:8 KJV] 8 The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is.

Yes, those "whosoever" not found. The "whosoever" are those who rejected Christ. The event is the Great White Throne judgment and is obvious that this judgment is to the unsaved dead. and yes, Rev. 17 speaks of the coming world event of the Mystery, Babylon the great. where she had drunk with the blood of the saints and martyrs of Jesus. The people who believed the beast "were not written in the book of life" from the very beginning of the Great Tribulation period. It is noted that the scripture speaks of "from" and not eternity.