Did God create people for Hell on purpose?

[PaulThomson]

1 Corinthians 2:14, it says (in the KJV) that the natural man can not know the things of God.

But, the Greek does not say "natural man.'
It says - psuchikos man = soulish man.

Meaning, a man having only a soul. Having no human spirit!

Or... meaning "operating according with the person's soul as the prime driver rather than the person's spirit. Can you prove me wrong?

 

[Genez]

Show us that in scripture.

Show you this?


God does not exist inside of time. He is eternal.
Time was a creation!
God was never created.

You question that?

 

[Genez]

Or... meaning "operating according with the person's soul as the prime driver rather than the person's spirit. Can you prove me wrong?

The soul's volition determines if it will have access to it's human spirit.
If he sins?
He becomes cut off from access.

Then we must resort to a law written in our hearts once we recognize the sin.
Which, should be... 1 John 1:9

 

[Genez]

Show us that in scripture.

Outside of time, the Greek tenses would reveal.
Not by reading some typical translation.

For example:

Translation: NKJV.

Philippians 2:6.

"Who, being in the form of God, did not consider it robbery to be equal with God, "​

Now, providing a more accurate feel and sense for what the Greek gives.

Who {Christ}, though He eternally existed in the essence of God,​

He did not think equalities {plural} with God​

a gain to be seized {means to violently take} and held.​

​

If you are really interested in learning this sort of thing in depth?
Look over this web page and see if you might want to order some messages.
The messages will include giving the Greek syntax and tense structure, which this format would not allow for.

https://www.rbthieme.org/index.html#tabs-3

​

 

[Genez]

All speculation and assertion with no biblical basis. All classical (based on Greek and Roman culture) metaphysics, not Hebraic biblical metaphysics.

So, that was the line you swallowed?

There is much more to be known than you realize.
But, you have to be willing to dedicate your time to real study.
I have already shown you a very good source to learn from.

In Christ ...............

 

[Genez]

God is not "just like me".
You keep on limiting God to being nothing like you. And yet He made you in His image.

Being in His image is having been modeled after his own way of function.
Not a clone.

Are you omniscient?

We can know many things.

 

[Genez]

Well, because animals also have souls per Gen. 1:20-24, I find it better to describe "soul" as body + life.
Yes, humans can have awareness of God or sense that God exists, which is what distinguishes them from animals.
God draws all unregenerate human souls until they are deemed to be undrawable (Rom. 2:4-8, Heb. 3:7-11).
The HS permanently indwells repentant humans, enabling them to reflect divine love (Rom. 5:5, Phil. 2:12-13).

The HS permanently indwells only the Church.
For we have become Temples of the Holy Spirit.

OT believers (very few) could be enabled and filled with the Spirit.
Christians will have the Holy Spirit always indwelling them, even if they lead terrible lives after being saved.
Indwelling is not the same thing as filling.

 

[GWH]

The HS permanently indwells only the Church.
For we have become Temples of the Holy Spirit.

OT believers (very few) could be enabled and filled with the Spirit.
Christians will have the Holy Spirit always indwelling them, even if they lead terrible lives after being saved.
Indwelling is not the same thing as filling.

Yes, the Church = repentant souls.
Indwelling, yes, but not filling when behaving terribly/sinning.

 

[sawdust]

My opinion is that each zygote begins with a consciousness. and develops a basic soul as it grows in the womb. And each baby begins with an intellect, emotions, senses (a basic soul) and grows and shapes its soul through further experiences and its responses to those experiences. Can you prove me wrong?

Can you prove from scripture that knowing all THINGS includes knowing all the future, including what each future soul will be, and all its future choices?If not, why should I believe you?

If God is not omniscient then neither is He fully righteous. If He has to guess, He has as much chance to be wrong as we are.

It is why our righteousness comes through faith in Him. His word is never wrong, nor can it ever be wrong ergo, when we trust His word is true, we become right.

 

[sawdust]

My memory is not very good, but I seem to remember learning the phrase "God-consciousness" as part
of what it means to have a human soul from RBT. Of course "moral conscience" comes from Gen. 3:22,
but it also references Rom. 2:9-16.
Ditto G&P!

RBT teaches the functions of the soul are as follows:

1. Awareness - of self and others (conciousness)
2. Mentality - Thinking in all it's forms: rational, imagination, problem solving etc.
3. Emotion
4. Volition (will)
5. Conscience

 

[Genez]

Nothing in there says God knew from the beginning of time that He was going to engineer this invasion from the east at this time.

Why should God have to say that?

 

[Genez]

The Hebrew says " I am God, making known an end from a beginning, and from the east things which have not been done, saying, My counsel shall stand and I will do all my pleasure. Calling a ravenous bird from the east, a man of my counsel from a far country: yea, I have spoken it, I will also bring it to pass; I have purposed it, I will also do it.

Nothing in there says God knew from the beginning of time that He was going to engineer this invasion from the east at this time.

What would happen to you if you found out your 'slant' was correct?
How would things change?

 

[GWH]

RBT teaches the functions of the soul are as follows:

1. Awareness - of self and others (conciousness)
2. Mentality - Thinking in all it's forms: rational, imagination, problem solving etc.
3. Emotion
4. Volition (will)
5. Conscience

Okay, thanks. What I am remembering is: 1. awareness of God, and 5. moral conscience.
Of course, I affirm the others also, but I just don't associate them with what I learned from RBT back in c. 1975.

 

[cv5]

21Unto Adam also and to his wife did the LORD God make coats of skins, and clothed them.
22And the LORD God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever: 23Therefore the LORD God sent him forth from the garden of Eden,

I'm reminded of a movie clip where George C. Scott explains the "Tulip" theology to a prostitute.....a prostitute.
I won't repeat her reply to his exsplanantion but, it was perfectly clear that she considered "Tulip" theology to be evil. I know she was an actor and not a real prostitute but, from what she said, I don't think she was a Christian either; just another immoral Hollywood actor. But what I want you to see, from this, is that even LOST people can and do discern good from evil, like the Bible says Adam could, and they can apparently discern that any god(little g) who would create people for the express purpose if sending them to Hell, would be an EVIL sadistic NARCISSIST of the worst kind.

All I can understand from that is that "Calvinists" are either fools "thinking themselves to be wise" or they are just full of the devil and more deceived than an ordinary lost person.....IF they are even saved at all.

All I can understand from that is that "Calvinists" are either fools "thinking themselves to be wise" or they are just full of the devil and more deceived than an ordinary lost person.....IF they are even saved at all.

Scary alright. Very much so. And the ideology is unbiblical and very easily proven so.
But what is scarier is that they cannot see the truth of the matter when presented on a silver platter.

 

[Kroogz]

If God is not omniscient then neither is He fully righteous. If He has to guess, He has as much chance to be wrong as we are.

It is why our righteousness comes through faith in Him. His word is never wrong, nor can it ever be wrong ergo, when we trust His word is true, we become right.

True.
Righteousness/justice has to know all.

 

[Genez]

All I can understand from that is that "Calvinists" are either fools "thinking themselves to be wise" or they are just full of the devil and more deceived than an ordinary lost person.....IF they are even saved at all.

Scary alright. Very much so. And the ideology is unbiblical and very easily proven so.
But what is scarier is that they cannot see the truth of the matter when presented on a silver platter.

Satan had already made a successful major offensive on the Catholic Church, drawing believers away from Biblical Christianity.
Now, seeing all were not happy with it, he needed some other form of counter apostasy to get everyone confused about Christianity to build up more whirlwind.

Getting one apostasy fighting a different apostasy... "Perpetual motion."

Years later?
Many do not know what Biblical living Christianity is anymore.

 

[Kroogz]

Many do not know what Biblical living Christianity is anymore.

Years of the dog and pony show and cleaning up the flesh........WASTE of time.

The Spiritual life.........FREEDOM.

And it is simple. But it requires a humble heart, undivided attention, your right pastor teacher and TIME.

 

[Kroogz]

Satan had already made a successful major offensive on the Catholic Church, drawing believers away from Biblical Christianity.
Now, seeing all were not happy with it, he needed some other form of counter apostasy to get everyone confused about Christianity to build up more whirlwind.

Getting one apostasy fighting a different apostasy... "Perpetual motion.

Religion is Satan's ace trump.

While we are all fighting "not really saved" or " loss of salvation".........The unbeliever doesn't hear the Gospel. Perfect according to Satan.

 

[PaulThomson]

Outside of time, the Greek tenses would reveal.
Not by reading some typical translation.

For example:

Translation: NKJV.

Philippians 2:6.

"Who, being in the form of God, did not consider it robbery to be equal with God, "​

Now, providing a more accurate feel and sense for what the Greek gives.

Who {Christ}, though He eternally existed in the essence of God,​

He did not think equalities {plural} with God​

a gain to be seized {means to violently take} and held.​

​

If you are really interested in learning this sort of thing in depth?
Look over this web page and see if you might want to order some messages.
The messages will include giving the Greek syntax and tense structure, which this format would not allow for.

https://www.rbthieme.org/index.html#tabs-3

​

HuparchOn does not mean eternally existing. If you look at the uses of huparchOn in scripture it seems to be an emphatic form of to exist as or to be, meaning what we mean by "to be actually" "To be basically" "to be foundationally" " to be essentially"
Luk 8:41
And, behold, there came a man named Jairus, and he was G5225 (huparchOn) a ruler of the synagogue: and he fell down at Jesus' feet, and besought him that he would come into his house:

Was this man eternally existing as a ruler of the synagogue?

And, behold, there came a man named Jairus, and he was actually (hupErchen, imperfect active indicative) a ruler of the synagogue: and he fell down at Jesus' feet, and besought him that he would come into his house:

And

Who {Christ}, though being actually (huparchOn, present participle) in the form of God,​

He did not think equalities {plural} with God​

a gain to be seized {means to violently take} and held.​

 

[PaulThomson]

What would happen to you if you found out your 'slant' was correct?
How would things change?

I don't know? How do you think things would change?