Demons

[keepingthingsreal]

Btw, a quick thank you to everyone for keeping this conversation civil or free from contention.

 

[homwardbound]

With all these comments about demons from many different members I'm wondering if anyone has dealt with demons as in, like, casting them out.

To note: I have. Many times. Just wondering if it's more like a doctrinal position than a practical one for many here.

freed, getting, getting freed, comes from Father and Son only for me. And to me it is God that does it truthfully. Never temporarily as what people can only do, themselves.
To do that exercism of like in the Catholic Church, where it be the Priests getting all the Credit, I see a lot of Pride going on. I am not judging anyone. I am saying truth about being able to do things, others are not able to do. (If it is a public display, it probably is not of God, my view)
Watch out for the Leaven, it puffs people up. Yes, I see these are wise as a serpent, yet, cannot a serpent cast out a serpent? Acting harmless as doves, wolves in sheep clothing
Satan, (Evil) casting out Evil, can not stand according to Jesus in the Bible testament when the Disciples asked about others, kicking out evil saying they are of God, and are not. Hey Jesus cast fire down on them.
Jesus replied, leave them alone. Since preaching me, let it be. If whoever is preaching me and is not of me, then it will not stand.
What? Even Paul talks of this, those that were making fun of his being jailed. Said there are those that are sincere, and those that are not, I will glory in both! Why? Christ is Preached, I am. content in that alone
Amazing grace given us all to either believe it sincerely or not, thanks
God is the one and the only one that frees anyone

 

[homwardbound]

I have cast them out, in Jesus' name, as well.

My sincere question for you is this:

Did you cast demons out of believers or unbelievers?

Also, did Jesus cast demons out of believers or unbelievers? Take a moment before you answer this particular question.

Anyhow, in every instance where I have cast a demon out of someone, that person was a believer.

personally, I see in the testaments, only believers.
As he said it is your Faith (Belief) because of your Faith. without any belief it will not be
thanks good point

 

[homwardbound]

You probably did. That was just another failed attempt at humor on my part.

On a serious note, I have been contemplating canceling my account here all day long. Not only does my participation here (in the overall forums) seem so useless, but the sudden death of my niece last night has me reeling and thinking about the brevity of life. It's probably best if I just logoff for a bit before doing anything hasty.

Good night.

I am standing in trust to God for you to be comforted, somehow through this death.
death is not easy to face, as in reality it has happened to me, that started at age 14 and my sister that died was 18, then my Dad died at age 63, I was 17, then my eldest brother when I was 21, and he was 31 when it happened
there is a lot in there, I finally saw though it all.
I saw a waste of life, my sister, youngest one died on an overdose, my Dad at early age from stress over his daughter dying, in guilt from it happening. then my eldest brother died in the risen Christ, on Campus Crusade for Christ. They did 3 Autopsies in 1978 when that happened, and found no physical cause of death, they put that on his death certificate
His last saying I heard from my eldest sister, still alive, My brother said to her
"God just loves me" he went through life under Law trying to Get God to be pleased by his continued study and work. He saw, he could not do it, not perfect ever, therefore said "God just loves me" his last words to my eldest sister, before passing away, three days later. At 21, I gave my life over to God, to teach me truth. God has been teaching me truth of true Love from God ever since over all the rest going on in this world
I see to not be under Law too, as in Romans 7 tells me about that through Paul. To be in the new Law of Love given us through Son from Father (Hebrews 7)
Galatians is not easily understood, yet God reveals it to anyone who is sincere to know God's love, then one has love for all. ALL: over the few religion has, even ourselves that first born flesh nature to me I see now as dead, thanks to God, yet held alive as in Acts 17:28 tells me
trusting the best for you, hoping you do not go, onely if you called by Father to stay, thank you

 

[keepingthingsreal]

I am standing in trust to God for you to be comforted, somehow through this death.

This post that I recently made on another thread should give you some insight into what I am facing in relation to my niece's death.

https://christianchat.com/prayer-requests/a-death-in-the-family.217951/#post-5447106

 

[Aaron56]

I have cast them out, in Jesus' name, as well.

My sincere question for you is this:

Did you cast demons out of believers or unbelievers?

Also, did Jesus cast demons out of believers or unbelievers? Take a moment before you answer this particular question.

Anyhow, in every instance where I have cast a demon out of someone, that person was a believer.

Both.

In my experience, the issue is more an oppression than a possession. And it's true that a believer cannot have a demon in their spirit. Demons do not affect the spirits of men, they affect their souls and ultimately their bodies: lies, deceptions, traditions are all things witnessed outwardly.

 

[keepingthingsreal]

Both.

In my experience, the issue is more an oppression than a possession. And it's true that a believer cannot have a demon in their spirit. Demons do not affect the spirits of men, they affect their souls and ultimately their bodies: lies, deceptions, traditions are all things witnessed outwardly.

If I am understanding you correctly, then you are saying that a Christian could have a demon in them which negatively affects their soul or body, but they cannot have one in their spirit. Is this correct? Regarding the spirits of men, why, in your estimation, did Paul write this to the Christians at Corinth?

2Co 7:1
Having therefore these promises, dearly beloved, let us cleanse ourselves from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit, perfecting holiness in the fear of God.

What was this filthiness of the spirit that these Christians were being admonished to cleanse themselves from while perfecting holiness in the fear of God?

Also, please notice how Paul placed himself in this same category via his use of the word "us."

 

[Aaron56]

If I am understanding you correctly, then you are saying that a Christian could have a demon in them which negatively affects their soul or body, but they cannot have one in their spirit. Is this correct? Regarding the spirits of men, why, in your estimation, did Paul write this to the Christians at Corinth?

2Co 7:1
Having therefore these promises, dearly beloved, let us cleanse ourselves from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit, perfecting holiness in the fear of God.

What was this filthiness of the spirit that these Christians were being admonished to cleanse themselves from while perfecting holiness in the fear of God?

Also, please notice how Paul placed himself in this same category via his use of the word "us."

Spirit or pneuma is one of those words with many meanings, like father, world, saved, etc.

In this case, because the spirits of men are clear when they are reconstituted into the Holy Spirit, this is the person's persona: how they affect the world. Life in the Holy Spirit and carnal life are juxtaposed in the previous chapter.

Today, we call liquor and other substances "spirits". It's understood to be the essence of something but not the thing entirely.

 

[keepingthingsreal]

Spirit or pneuma is one of those words with many meanings, like father, world, saved, etc.

In this case, because the spirits of men are clear when they are reconstituted into the Holy Spirit, this is the person's persona: how they affect the world. Life in the Holy Spirit and carnal life are juxtaposed in the previous chapter.

Today, we call liquor and other substances "spirits". It's understood to be the essence of something but not the thing entirely.

I get what you are saying, but, to be honest, I do not agree with your interpretation here.

Along similar lines, why do you suppose that Paul said the following to the Christians at Ephesus?

Eph 4:23
And be renewed in the spirit of your mind;

What's up with this SPIRIT of your mind thing?

I believe that I know the correct answer to this question...

 

[Aaron56]

I get what you are saying, but, to be honest, I do not agree with your interpretation here.

Along similar lines, why do you suppose that Paul said the following to the Christians at Ephesus?

Eph 4:23
And be renewed in the spirit of your mind;

What's up with this SPIRIT of your mind thing?

I believe that I know the correct answer to this question...

The answer is found in the following verses:

Therefore, putting away lying, “Let each one of you speak truth with his neighbor,” for we are members of one another. 26 “Be angry, and do not sin”:do not let the sun go down on your wrath, 27 nor give place to the devil. 28 Let him who stole steal no longer, but rather let him labor, working with his hands what is good, that he may have something to give him who has need. 29 Let no corrupt word proceed out of your mouth, but what is good for necessary edification, that it may impart grace to the hearers. 30 And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, by whom you were sealed for the day of redemption. 31 Let all bitterness, wrath, anger, clamor, and evil speaking be put away from you, with all malice. 32 And be kind to one another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God in Christ forgave you.

 

[keepingthingsreal]

The answer is found in the following verses:

Therefore, putting away lying, “Let each one of you speak truth with his neighbor,” for we are members of one another. 26 “Be angry, and do not sin”:do not let the sun go down on your wrath, 27 nor give place to the devil. 28 Let him who stole steal no longer, but rather let him labor, working with his hands what is good, that he may have something to give him who has need. 29 Let no corrupt word proceed out of your mouth, but what is good for necessary edification, that it may impart grace to the hearers. 30 And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, by whom you were sealed for the day of redemption. 31 Let all bitterness, wrath, anger, clamor, and evil speaking be put away from you, with all malice. 32 And be kind to one another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God in Christ forgave you.

I do believe that there is a correlation there, but could you please elaborate on exactly what you mean?

Thank you.

 

[Aaron56]

I do believe that there is a correlation there, but could you please elaborate on exactly what you mean?

Thank you.

You will notice that all things mentioned have something in common.

1.Therefore, putting away lying, “Let each one of you speak truth with his neighbor,”
2.“Be angry, and do not sin”:do not let the sun go down on your wrath,
nor give place to the devil.
3.Let him who stole steal no longer, but rather let him labor, working with his hands what is good, that he may have something to give him who has need.
4.Let no corrupt word proceed out of your mouth, but what is good for necessary edification, that it may impart grace to the hearers.
5.Let all bitterness, wrath, anger, clamor, and evil speaking be put away from you, with all malice.
6.And be kind to one another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God in Christ forgave you.

They are all outward behaviors of the person. These are the characteristics of a renewed mind: the pneuma is what is seen. It is the essence.

Notably, all may be considered ways in which a person "resists the devil". This done successfully results in him "fleeing from" the person.

 

[Blain]

You will notice that all things mentioned have something in common.

1.Therefore, putting away lying, “Let each one of you speak truth with his neighbor,”
2.“Be angry, and do not sin”:do not let the sun go down on your wrath,
nor give place to the devil.
3.Let him who stole steal no longer, but rather let him labor, working with his hands what is good, that he may have something to give him who has need.
4.Let no corrupt word proceed out of your mouth, but what is good for necessary edification, that it may impart grace to the hearers.
5.Let all bitterness, wrath, anger, clamor, and evil speaking be put away from you, with all malice.
6.And be kind to one another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God in Christ forgave you.

They are all outward behaviors of the person. These are the characteristics of a renewed mind: the pneuma is what is seen. It is the essence.

Notably, all may be considered ways in which a person "resists the devil". This done successfully results in him "fleeing from" the person.

you make some really good points here

 

[keepingthingsreal]

You will notice that all things mentioned have something in common.

1.Therefore, putting away lying, “Let each one of you speak truth with his neighbor,”
2.“Be angry, and do not sin”:do not let the sun go down on your wrath,
nor give place to the devil.
3.Let him who stole steal no longer, but rather let him labor, working with his hands what is good, that he may have something to give him who has need.
4.Let no corrupt word proceed out of your mouth, but what is good for necessary edification, that it may impart grace to the hearers.
5.Let all bitterness, wrath, anger, clamor, and evil speaking be put away from you, with all malice.
6.And be kind to one another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God in Christ forgave you.

They are all outward behaviors of the person. These are the characteristics of a renewed mind: the pneuma is what is seen. It is the essence.

Notably, all may be considered ways in which a person "resists the devil". This done successfully results in him "fleeing from" the person.

Would you agree that, on the other hand, and as is stated in the text, a failure to do gives place to the devil? If so, then where is this place? Is it merely outward, or is it inward? Again, why the need to be renewed in the spirit of one's mind? How does one's mind have a spirit? I believe that the Bible accurately answers this question elsewhere, and in more places than just one.

 

[Aaron56]

Would you agree that, on the other hand, and as is stated in the text, a failure to do gives place to the devil? If so, then where is this place? Is it merely outward, or is it inward? Again, why the need to be renewed in the spirit of one's mind? How does one's mind have a spirit? I believe that the Bible accurately answers this question elsewhere, and in more places than just one.

This is merely an outline.

We are comprised of body, soul, and spirit. Each part has a corresponding mind.

I see them as concentric circles with body on the outside, then soul, then spirit, with the spirit of man being central. Every man has a spirit but, apart from Christ, his spirit is dead. In Christ, his spirit is reconstituted back into the Holy Spirit.

Man lives from the inside out, either informed by the Holy Spirit unto righteousness or informed by the mind of his soul, which may or may not be informed directly by demons. Many cultural traditions are schemes of the demonic so direct intervention by them is not necessary to corrupt a man. It could be just the way he was raised.

A believer, sealed by the Holy Spirit, may maintain demonic influences due to cultural influences and/or beliefs. These take place in the mind of the believer's soul. As the believer matures in Christ by following the Holy Spirit, he will become aware of the futility of the mind of his soul. Repentance is God's prescription for this: turn from evil to the truth.

Sometimes there is more than just faulty thinking. Sometimes, strongholds of the enemy are present because of parental influence, religion, the occult, etc. The same thing is required, repentance (Gates of Hell keep people trapped inside Hell but they cannot stand against the government of Christ). Then, because demons cannot read minds, public or outward rejection of their influence is required. This serves to set things in order in the life of the one being helped.

 

[keepingthingsreal]

This is merely an outline.

We are comprised of body, soul, and spirit. Each part has a corresponding mind.

I see them as concentric circles with body on the outside, then soul, then spirit, with the spirit of man being central. Every man has a spirit but, apart from Christ, his spirit is dead. In Christ, his spirit is reconstituted back into the Holy Spirit.

Man lives from the inside out, either informed by the Holy Spirit unto righteousness or informed by the mind of his soul, which may or may not be informed directly by demons. Many cultural traditions are schemes of the demonic so direct intervention by them is not necessary to corrupt a man. It could be just the way he was raised.

A believer, sealed by the Holy Spirit, may maintain demonic influences due to cultural influences and/or beliefs. These take place in the mind of the believer's soul. As the believer matures in Christ by following the Holy Spirit, he will become aware of the futility of the mind of his soul. Repentance is God's prescription for this: turn from evil to the truth.

Sometimes there is more than just faulty thinking. Sometimes, strongholds of the enemy are present because of parental influence, religion, the occult, etc. The same thing is required, repentance (Gates of Hell keep people trapped inside Hell but they cannot stand against the government of Christ). Then, because demons cannot read minds, public or outward rejection of their influence is required. This serves to set things in order in the life of the one being helped.

I am confused. Do you believe that a Christian can have a demon INSIDE OF THEM that is affecting their mind or not? Earlier, you said that you have cast demons OUT OF Christians. Again, do you believe that a Christian can have a demon INSIDE OF THEM that is affecting their mind or not? I truly am confused as to what your position is. Thank you.

At my end, I definitely believe that a Christian can have a demon INSIDE OF THEM that is affecting their mind.

 

[Aaron56]

I am confused. Do you believe that a Christian can have a demon INSIDE OF THEM that is affecting their mind or not? Earlier, you said that you have cast demons OUT OF Christians. Again, do you believe that a Christian can have a demon INSIDE OF THEM that is affecting their mind or not? I truly am confused as to what your position is. Thank you.

At my end, I definitely believe that a Christian can have a demon INSIDE OF THEM that is affecting their mind.

Yes. But not in the place of the spirit of believers. The Holy Spirit resides in their spirit.

When afflicted, demons reside in the souls of believers. I apologize for the confusion. I should have read more carefully.

 

[Kroogz]

At my end, I definitely believe that a Christian can have a demon INSIDE OF THEM that is affecting their mind.

This is another very pertinent point. How do we determine that a demon is in fact INSIDE OF THEM? This is very debatable. The Criteria has changed many times throughout history.

 

[keepingthingsreal]

Yes. But not in the place of the spirit of believers. The Holy Spirit resides in their spirit.

When afflicted, demons reside in the souls of believers. I apologize for the confusion. I should have read more carefully.

No worries, and thanks for the clarification. Seeing how we both agree that Christians can have a demon inside of them which affects their minds, I will probably give some other verses which potentially relate to this later on. Right now, I kind of have a lot of things on my plate, and I am trying to juggle them all at the same time.

 

[keepingthingsreal]

This is another very pertinent point. How do we determine that a demon is in fact INSIDE OF THEM? This is very debatable. The Criteria has changed many times throughout history.

You are right. This is a very pertinent point, and we need to be able to properly determine whether or not a demon's influence is external or internal.

I have to head out for a bit now, but I will address this later (Lord willing).