Really...who would have ever thought?
Heaven is not going to have a detention hall....
Can We Really Exercise Free Will?
- Thread starter LifelongLearner
- Start date
-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
Heaven is not going to have a detention hall....
Yes the cross goes in both directions Gods relationship with you before the cross and after.
The choice you make is dependent on How well you've done when God was building your heart before the cross ,
God's sovereign will is not dependent upon man's. When God opens a door, no one can shut it; when He closes a door, no one can open it (Rev. 3:7). IOW, no one on this little green planet, even FWers with their "powerful, mighty, sovereign, sacred freewill", can thwart or frustrate God's plans or purposes (Isa 14:27). And the reason for this is that man's will is always in alignment with God's. All the actors on God's world stage willingly play the parts He has scripted for each of us.
No, it won't. Detention hall will be in the Lake of Fire wherein sin will be restrained forever.
He knows how to have His purpose fulfilled by whom He specifically calls, by knowing how they choose to think.
You are caught up in something bigger than yourself.
One that controls vulnerable men to resist God’s will.
Wow, we can make mundane choices in life, how so very gracious of the determinist camp to give us that freedom.
I wonder where the "extraordinary choices" begin to occur, surely there is more to life than putting on socks.
The contradictions of of Calvinism continue..... under Calvinism all men are born unable to rightly understand and receive the things of the Spirit.
Therefore, one must be regenerated to do so, yet having to be regenerated to do so, is itself a thing of the Spirit one cannot rightly understand and receive due to their depravity.
Make it make sense... nope, it cannot be done.
all this is true I agree
But can you agree he never decreed sin ?
Because you simply have to, otherwise you have to rewrite the entire bible.
So because he never decreed sin that mean he only decreed his will on the bases of knowing your future, and not as you put it decreeing every action you take.
The point of his enabling grace is to test the heart in his fire, to judge his works in you before being saved.
So Gods grace lights the way in your heart with a will to do his works,
If you don't do them works which has more than enough enabling will to enable you to choose, the. You dont pass go.
Obviously you have a short attention span, your salvation is dependent on how well your heart adapts to his enabling grace.
You obviously don't want to listen, neither will you except God built up all the hearts of the unsaved for 40 years the same as he did the saved before leaving the unsaved in the desert.
Somehow you choose to see him speaking directly in hearts can have no effect.
Sad
The mind of the flesh is death, but the mind of the Spirit is life and peace, because the mind of the flesh is hostile to God: It does not submit to God’s law, nor can it do so. Those controlled by the flesh cannot please God. Romans 8 v 6-8 This is what we speak, not in words taught us by human wisdom but in words taught by the Spirit, explaining spiritual realities with Spirit-taught words. The person without the Spirit does not accept the things that come from the Spirit of God but considers them foolishness, and cannot understand them because they are discerned only through the Spirit. 1 Corinthians 2 v 13-14
John 14 v 17a, Romans 8 v 6-9 ~ “Inability” in Bible. The world cannot receive the Spirit of truth. The mind of the flesh is death, but the mind of the Spirit is life and peace, because the mind of the flesh is hostile to God: It does not submit to God’s law, nor can it do so. Those controlled by the flesh cannot please God. You, however, are controlled not by the flesh, but by the Spirit, if the Spirit of God lives in you. And if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Christ. Praise be to God for calling me out of the world.
Now the Lord is the Spirit, and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is freedom (2 Cor ch 3 v 17). If anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Christ (Rom 8 v 9b). The world cannot receive the Spirit of truth, because it neither sees Him nor knows Him (from John 14 v 17). Those not in Christ are not free (see Heb 2 v 15). Praise God if He has rescued you from the dominion of darkness! (see Col 1 v 13)
“Whoever belongs to God hears the words of God. The reason you do not hear is that you do not belong to God.” “The knowledge of the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven has been given to you, but not to them.” The god of this age has blinded the minds of unbelievers, so they cannot see the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God. If anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Christ. John 8 v 47; Matthew 13 v 11; 2 Corinthians ch 4 v 4; Romans 8 v 9b
To continue with the theme I broached yesterday re God effectually and sovereignly restraining evil in this world, there are two great examples of this in the OT whereby God worked providentially to restrain evil through two of his agents. We have the account of Esther who interceded on behalf of Mordecai and all the other Jews with the pagan Persian king thereby preserving and protecting the Jews from wicked Haman who desired to exterminate all the Jews (Est 7:1-10).
In this second example, we have, yet, another beautiful and very wise woman who interceded on behalf of her wicked husband Nabal and king David. Abigail's godly wisdom persuaded David to turn away from the evil he had planned for Nabal (1Sam 25:26-37).
Of course, in the NT, under the New Covenant, the Church plays a huge role in restraining evil in this world since she is Light in the Lord (Mat 5:14-16; Eph 5:8) and, therefore, she shines her life and the Gospel Truth to the ends of the earth.
The Church is also salt in this world (Mat 5:13) thereby preserving God's precious Truth, while also mitigating the moral corruption and decay in this world. God's people have the important role of enhancing the flavor of life in this world in such a way as to make God's work of salvation stand out and to differ sharply from the wisdom and works of men.
In this second example, we have, yet, another beautiful and very wise woman who interceded on behalf of her wicked husband Nabal and king David. Abigail's godly wisdom persuaded David to turn away from the evil he had planned for Nabal (1Sam 25:26-37).
Of course, in the NT, under the New Covenant, the Church plays a huge role in restraining evil in this world since she is Light in the Lord (Mat 5:14-16; Eph 5:8) and, therefore, she shines her life and the Gospel Truth to the ends of the earth.
The Church is also salt in this world (Mat 5:13) thereby preserving God's precious Truth, while also mitigating the moral corruption and decay in this world. God's people have the important role of enhancing the flavor of life in this world in such a way as to make God's work of salvation stand out and to differ sharply from the wisdom and works of men.
[QUOTE="Jordon, post: 5635682, member: 340597"]Obviously you have a short attention span, your salvation is dependent on how well your heart adapts to his enabling grace.
You obviously don't want to listen, neither will you except God built up all the hearts of the unsaved for 40 years the same as he did the saved before leaving the unsaved in the desert.
Somehow you choose to see him speaking directly in hearts can have no effect.
Sad [/QUOTE]
No, my Salvation is totally dependent on God's rescuing, enabling, empowering, efficacious grace by which God transformed my heart. There is no scripture that teaches God ultimately saves people contingent on their response. I will not listen to heresies that preach or teach that salvation is ultimately dependent of man's choices. If this were the case, Paul could never have written what he did to the Corinthians:
1 Cor 1:30-31
30 It is because of him that you are in Christ Jesus, who has become for us wisdom from God — that is, our righteousness, holiness and redemption. 31 Therefore, as it is written: "Let him who boasts boast in the Lord."
NIV
So, keep boasting in man's "freewill" that you believe is the ultimate determinant to God's salvation. May God have mercy on your soul!
You obviously don't want to listen, neither will you except God built up all the hearts of the unsaved for 40 years the same as he did the saved before leaving the unsaved in the desert.
Somehow you choose to see him speaking directly in hearts can have no effect.
Sad [/QUOTE]
No, my Salvation is totally dependent on God's rescuing, enabling, empowering, efficacious grace by which God transformed my heart. There is no scripture that teaches God ultimately saves people contingent on their response. I will not listen to heresies that preach or teach that salvation is ultimately dependent of man's choices. If this were the case, Paul could never have written what he did to the Corinthians:
1 Cor 1:30-31
30 It is because of him that you are in Christ Jesus, who has become for us wisdom from God — that is, our righteousness, holiness and redemption. 31 Therefore, as it is written: "Let him who boasts boast in the Lord."
NIV
So, keep boasting in man's "freewill" that you believe is the ultimate determinant to God's salvation. May God have mercy on your soul!
What did you ever do to deserve life? The wages of sin is death. All sin.A void it is.
They think it’s appropriate for reprobates to be judged for their innate condition given by god, who are born rejected by god, without any hope of salvation.
Do you think this makes God unfair? You already call Him unfair.
But then, you are a God-blasphemer after all.
Plus, my Bible says man is without excuse.
Does yours say something different???
Or do you just like to kvetch about God?
. Again you distort what I actually said, that's not what I said,
The question is do you believe God decreed sin.
Do you think you can answer ?
Wow, we can make mundane choices in life, how so very gracious of the determinist camp to give us that freedom.
I wonder where the "extraordinary choices" begin to occur, surely there is more to life than putting on socks.
The contradictions of of Calvinism continue..... under Calvinism all men are born unable to rightly understand and receive the things of the Spirit.
Therefore, one must be regenerated to do so, yet having to be regenerated to do so, is itself a thing of the Spirit one cannot rightly understand and receive due to their depravity.
Make it make sense... nope, it cannot be done.
They cling to their teaching involving total depravity because it helps them to avoid the feelings of guilt for how much they know they hated God.
They can not rightly divide the nature of man.
Flesh = depravity.
Soul = takes its lead from the flesh, but is not innately depraved like the flesh.
Grace separates the flesh's effect over the soul, from the soul.
Then, the soul is placed in a position to consider what God has to show the soul for it's consideration.
No man needs to be regenerated first to know he is a sinner.
For knowing one is a sinner is not a spiritual matter.
God looks to see what is in that soul when the Gospel is presented while grace is being given.
Then? While someone is placed in such a position to choose?
The soul either wishes the Cross were true (can not yet believe it is true).
Or, wants nothing to do with the Cross.
That is what determined who God will make their wish into a reality by grace and faith...
Or, discontinue drawing that negative soul.
God is a gentleman.
Whoever belongs to God hears the words of God.
It does not say...
Whoever belongs to God obeys the words of God.
Adam belonged to God.
Adam heard the words of God.
..................
Indeed, my bible too says the same thing -- in the context, yet, of Natural Revelation! How much more is man w/o excuse in Intuitive Revelation?
Sadly, this extremely superficial, insulting view of the Creator is all you think He is. I have often said that you FWers have a very low view of God and sin, which lead to you an inordinately and unjustifiably high opinion of yourselves!