Can We Really Exercise Free Will?

[Jordon]

John 3:16
“For God so loved the world, that He gave His only Son, so that everyone who believes in Him will not perish, but have eternal life.

1 John 2:2
and He Himself is the propitiation for our sins; and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.

2 Cor 5:15
and He died for all, so that those who live would no longer live for themselves, but for Him who died and rose on their behalf.

Mark 16:15
And He said to them, “Go into all the world and preach the gospel to all creation.

Acts 17:31
because He has set a day on which He will judge the world in righteousness through a Man whom He has appointed, having furnished proof to all people by raising Him from the dead.”


Acts 16:31
They said, “Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved, you and your household.”

yep if you believe you will be saved

 

[Kroogz]

The point that you should take from them is that since not everyone comes to a true belief/trust in Christ as Savior, they obviously weren't given that faith and belief as have those with it. The next logical question you should ask is how did the "who" become the "who"?

What is obvious is the fact that you reject a choice. So that bias is in and behind your question.

Not everyone believes /trusts in Christ because they suppress the Truth(He will convict/convince the world. )The Who became the who by Acts 16:31

[Phl 1:29 KJV] 29 For unto you it is given in the behalf of Christ, not only to believe on him, but also to suffer for his sake;
[Jhn 6:29 KJV] 29 Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent.

The salvation plan is all God. He made the rules and stipulations. It is all given by Him.

And we can make a shipwreck of it or take hold of it.

 

[rogerg]

John 3:16
“For God so loved the world, that He gave His only Son, so that everyone who believes in Him will not perish, but have eternal life.

Okay, I'm going to take another try at this too, but I'm not hopeful.

John 3:16 and 1 John 2:2
The "world" that God so loved isn't this world but the world to come. Life eternal is found there alone not in this world. Observe:

[Luk 18:30 KJV] 30 Who shall not receive manifold more in this present time, and in the world to come life everlasting.

Jesus tells us that His kingdom is NOT of this world"

[Jhn 18:36 KJV] 36 Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.

If God "so loved this world", and if Jesus was its Savior, God wouldn't and couldn't destroy it:

[Mat 24:35 KJV] 35 Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.

[2Pe 3:10 KJV] 10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.

The Father told us not to love this world. If He told not to, then neither can it be the world He loves.

[1Jo 2:15 KJV] 15 Love not the world, neither the things [that are] in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him.

2 Cor 5:15
You, based upon your understanding, define who the "all" are: Instead, we should turn to Scripture and let it define its own words. The "all" are all that the Father gave to Jesus, not everyone.

[Jhn 6:37 KJV] 37 All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.

[Jhn 17:2 KJV] 2 As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.

Acts 17:31

Mark 16:15
Preaching the word to those who hear it yet not moved by it, testifies to the judgment against them

[2Co 2:15-16 KJV]
15 For we are unto God a sweet savour of Christ, in them that are saved, and in them that perish:
16 To the one [we are] the savour of death unto death; and to the other the savour of life unto life. And who [is] sufficient for these things?

Acts 17:31

Nevertheless, some ignore and disbelieve those assurances. Why?

 

[rogerg]

What is obvious is the fact that you reject a choice. So that bias is in and behind your question.

Yes, I absolutely reject it, no secret there. No "choice" is available to the spiritually dead. Otherwise, should someone be saved because of their choice, they, without question, would have saved themselves.

 

[cv5]

Yes I have noticed how some are more adept at how they phrase things, but they always seem the same.

This post exemplifies if perfectl.....
This is conditioning.

Which is effective only if the victim doesn't truly seek, doesn't ask, and doesn't much care. Manifestly evident when they turn up their nose at high grade Bible exigetical treatments offered on a silver platter.

Instead......fake religious zealotry ego tripping, chanting Bible tweet mantras, and interpreting every passage wrongly.

 

[Kroogz]

Okay, I'm going to take another try at this too, but I'm not hopeful.

John 3:16 and 1 John 2:2
The "world" that God so loved isn't this world but the world to come. Life eternal is found there alone not in this world. Observe:

[Luk 18:30 KJV] 30 Who shall not receive manifold more in this present time, and in the world to come life everlasting.

Jesus tells us that His kingdom is NOT of this world"

[Jhn 18:36 KJV] 36 Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.

If God "so loved this world", and if Jesus was its Savior, God wouldn't and couldn't destroy it:

[Mat 24:35 KJV] 35 Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.

[2Pe 3:10 KJV] 10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.

The Father told us not to love this world. If He told not to, then neither can it be the world He loves.

[1Jo 2:15 KJV] 15 Love not the world, neither the things [that are] in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him.

2 Cor 5:15
You, based upon your understanding, define who the "all" are: Instead, we should turn to Scripture and let it define its own words. The "all" are all that the Father gave to Jesus, not everyone.

[Jhn 6:37 KJV] 37 All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.

[Jhn 17:2 KJV] 2 As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.

Acts 17:31

Mark 16:15
Preaching the word to those who hear it yet not moved by it, testifies to the judgment against them

[2Co 2:15-16 KJV]
15 For we are unto God a sweet savour of Christ, in them that are saved, and in them that perish:
16 To the one [we are] the savour of death unto death; and to the other the savour of life unto life. And who [is] sufficient for these things?

Acts 17:31

Nevertheless, some ignore and disbelieve those assurances. Why?

1 John 5:13~~These things I have written to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, so that you may know that you have eternal life.

The Father gave all things to the Lord Jesus Christ. They will come to Him.

and him(mankind) that comes(acts 16:31) to Him.....He will never cast out(eternal security.)

 

[rogerg]

Calvinism is a false answer to "who comes to belief?"

The Bible tells people they should and can.

So just to be clear, you reject and set to naught the verses I included from Scripture - not being from Calvinism - in favor of your personal opinion, correct?

 

[Kroogz]

Yes, I absolutely reject it, no secret there. No "choice" is available to the spiritually dead. Otherwise, should someone be saved because of their choice, they, without question, would have saved themselves.

Circle back to the starting line then. And It is why my question comes first and not the questions you posed.

Do you have personal faith in the Lord Jesus Christ for your salvation?

 

[rogerg]

1 John 5:13~~These things I have written to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, so that you may know that you have eternal life.

The Father gave all things to the Lord Jesus Christ. They will come to Him.

and him(mankind) that comes(acts 16:31) to Him.....He will never cast out(eternal security.)

You do realize, that in Jhn 5:13 He addressed the saved, not everyone, don't you?

[1Jo 4:4 KJV] 4 Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

 

[rogerg]

Circle back to the starting line then. And It is why my question comes first and not the questions you posed.

Do you have personal faith in the Lord Jesus Christ for your salvation?

It's amazing you could even ask me that question. OF COURSE I DO but it is a faith given to me by God not man.

 

[Kroogz]

You do realize, that in Jhn 5:13 He addressed the saved, not everyone, don't you?

[1Jo 4:4 KJV] 4 Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

Yes. We have eternal life NOW. So your reasoning that The Lord Jesus Christ died for the world to come is silly.

 

[Kroogz]

Kroogz said:

Do you have personal faith in the Lord Jesus Christ for your salvation?

OF COURSE I DO

rogerg said:
Yes, I absolutely reject it, no secret there. No "choice" is available to the spiritually dead. Otherwise, should someone be saved because of their choice, they, without question, would have saved themselves.

 

[Jordon]

Circle back to the starting line then. And It is why my question comes first and not the questions you posed.

Do you have personal faith in the Lord Jesus Christ for your salvation?

the true Calvies teach here how you know your saved

https://www.youtube.com/live/59BvX5No7sE?si=vpRvKMqvJ7ol0mRS

 

[rogerg]

Yes. We have eternal life NOW. So your reasoning that The Lord Jesus Christ died for the world to come is silly.

Only those with eternal life will or can occupy the world to come, not this world. This world will be destroyed by God.

 

[Kroogz]

the true Calvies teach here how you know your saved

https://www.youtube.com/live/59BvX5No7sE?si=vpRvKMqvJ7ol0mRS

John 3:16
“For God so loved the world, that He gave His only Son, so that everyone who believes in Him will not perish, but have eternal life.

1 John 2:2
and He Himself is the propitiation for our sins; and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.

2 Cor 5:15
and He died for all, so that those who live would no longer live for themselves, but for Him who died and rose on their behalf.

Mark 16:15
And He said to them, “Go into all the world and preach the gospel to all creation.

Acts 17:31
because He has set a day on which He will judge the world in righteousness through a Man whom He has appointed, having furnished proof to all people by raising Him from the dead.”


Acts 16:31
They said, “Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved, you and your household.”

 

[rogerg]

Kroogz said:

Do you have personal faith in the Lord Jesus Christ for your salvation?




rogerg said:
Yes, I absolutely reject it, no secret there. No "choice" is available to the spiritually dead. Otherwise, should someone be saved because of their choice, they, without question, would have saved themselves.

Yep, that's what I posted, for sure.

 

[Jordon]

John 3:16
“For God so loved the world, that He gave His only Son, so that everyone who believes in Him will not perish, but have eternal life.

1 John 2:2
and He Himself is the propitiation for our sins; and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.

2 Cor 5:15
and He died for all, so that those who live would no longer live for themselves, but for Him who died and rose on their behalf.

Mark 16:15
And He said to them, “Go into all the world and preach the gospel to all creation.

Acts 17:31
because He has set a day on which He will judge the world in righteousness through a Man whom He has appointed, having furnished proof to all people by raising Him from the dead.”


Acts 16:31
They said, “Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved, you and your household.”

yep the true Calvies teach if you believe you will be saved

 

[rogerg]

Acts 16:31
They said, “Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved, you and your household.”

I may have missed this one in my prior post but what I said that true faith/belief must originate from/with God not man applies.
The "will be" or "shalt be" (KJV), is in the future, not present, tense. Makes a big difference to its meaning.

 

[Solitude]

Why do you keep offering secular solutions?

The Stoics failed.

Yet, Paul took some of their vocabulary and showed them how God's grace and Truth could give them what they only longed for and could not have.

You will sometimes find Stoic terms in Paul's writings in the Greek.
Some claim that Paul was copying them.
Nothing could be further from the truth.
Paul was showing them that in God, they can achieve what they wanted to achieve in the energy of their flesh, but kept failing.

......

 

[Kroogz]

Which is effective only if the victim doesn't truly seek, doesn't ask, and doesn't much care. Manifestly evident when they turn up their nose at high grade Bible exigetical treatments offered on a silver platter.

Instead......fake religious zealotry ego tripping, chanting Bible tweet mantras, and interpreting every passage wrongly.

The above bolded. One doesn't seek. One doesn't ask if they don't care much. Take the calvie theory out to the bitter end and only a few die hards would stay in that nonsense.

As long as we have smoke machines, nice music and a potluck once a month.....Most of us are content.