Can We Really Exercise Free Will?
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And you know why they entered? God decreed it!While others of us rightly understand Freedom to be a two-sided coin -- freedom FROM and freedom TO.
I see, well it appears to me that there is several different layers to this discussion and that there are opposing views that both sides can go at each other all day but unless one person is willing to see from the other persons perspective it is just going to be an endless debate
The whole argument in this thread is whether or not the fallen natural man can come to faith on his own, or whether God must first act to enable faith to be produced. Lots of arguments have been offered. The latest is whether God commands of people things they are incapable of performing. The answer is clearly yes, even though this in and of itself doesn't provide definitive proof either way. But it does reveal the lengths some will go to make a point.
Where are you getting your mantra from?
They were not forced into believing.
They were forced into a position of being able to choose.
They chose as their flesh squirmed remained crushed by grace, so the soul could make a decsion.
And, again?
You appear to have an unjust God in your thinking,
For it is God's will that all believe.
Yet, not all get saved by forcing them to believe.
And, God get's what He wants = sovereignty.
For my Father’s will is that everyone who looks to the Son and believes in him
shall have eternal life, and I will raise them up at the last day.” John 6:40
God is not a gang leader.
Not a macho God.
You appear to think He is.
"What the Boss wants?
The Boss gets!"
If one wants to discuss philosophical concepts, the Bible Discussion Forum may not be the place for it.
Man's will according to a multitude of Scriptures is not free, and there are no verses claiming it is.
So we must start with what the Bible says, agreed? Yet these people start with what they think,
then contradict and outright deny what the Bible says because it disagrees with their thinking.
Their thinking which happens to deny also that faith is a gift, or even something good.
Evidently faith is the antithesis of boasting......
Rom 3:27
Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works? Nay: but by the law of faith.
Well if people would stop trying to be right all the time then maybe they wouldn't have to go that far to prove their point. I learn a lot more from being wrong than being right but this is why we have debates such as this and why confusion seems to be well and alive in it
And this wouldn't be such an issue if people would just have the humility to admit they may be wrong instead trying to find loopholes
I haven't seen any scripture that states our will is free at least not in the natural sense like how the natural man cannot percieve the things of the spirit and by default cannot choose salvation on their own without first being drawn to God because the flesh has to die in order to be reborn
Because no one understands spiritual truth nor can anyone know God apart from His saving grace. Dead men are separated from the Life of God! Plus only those KNOWN by God can know Him!
It even goes deeper than that, because the free will claim is that the incurably wicked heart of the bad tree
that cannot bring forth good fruit (it is impossible according to Jesus) will choose to believe what he hears
as foolishness concerning a God he hates while under the power and influence of the devil who has taken
him captive to do his will, and while he is opposed to the spiritual things of God which he can neither
receive nor comprehend because they are perceived with the Spirit, and that person is as yet dead in their
sins because they are not indwelt with the Holy Spirit of God and so they are operating solely by the flesh,
within which no good thing dwells and which serves the law of sin rendering fruit unto death, not life.
They claim the natural/unregenerated man is able while Scripture says the unregenerated man is not able.
The egregiously erroneous claims they make form a very long list, indeed.
The world cannot receive the Spirit of truth, because it neither sees Him nor knows Him. The world does not recognize Him. No one knows the Father except the Son and those to whom the Son chooses to reveal Him. The one who loves God is known by God. If anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Christ. The natural man does not accept the things that come from the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him, and he cannot understand them, because they are spiritually discerned. The mind that is set on the flesh is hostile toward God; it does not submit to God's law, nor can it. Whoever is not from God does not listen to us. from John 14 v 17, John 1 v 10, Matthew 11 v 27 & Luke 10 v 22, 1 Corinthians 8 v 3, Romans 8 v 9, 1 Corinthians 2 v 14, Romans 8 v 7, 1 John 4 v 6
You mean like Israel was commanded to obey the Law of Moses all the time under all circumstances? Where in scripture does it say that men have the innate ability to do that?
Sounds like that fallen natural man sure could use some help.It even goes deeper than that, because the free will claim is that the incurably wicked heart of the bad tree
that cannot bring forth good fruit (it is impossible according to Jesus) will choose to believe what he hears
as foolishness concerning a God he hates while under the power and influence of the devil who has taken
him captive to do his will, and while he is opposed to the spiritual things of God which he can neither
receive nor comprehend because they are perceived with the Spirit, and that person is as yet dead in their
sins because they are not indwelt with the Holy Spirit of God and so they are operating solely by the flesh,
within which no good thing dwells and which serves the law of sin rendering fruit unto death, not life.
They claim the natural/unregenerated man is able while Scripture says the unregenerated man is not able.
The world cannot receive the Spirit of truth, because it neither sees Him nor knows Him. The world does not recognize Him. No one knows the Father except the Son and those to whom the Son chooses to reveal Him. The one who loves God is known by God. If anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Christ. The natural man does not accept the things that come from the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him, and he cannot understand them, because they are spiritually discerned. The mind that is set on the flesh is hostile toward God; it does not submit to God's law, nor can it. Whoever is not from God does not listen to us. from John 14 v 17, John 1 v 10, Matthew 11 v 27 & Luke 10 v 22, 1 Corinthians 8 v 3, Romans 8 v 9, 1 Corinthians 2 v 14, Romans 8 v 7, 1 John 4 v 6
Seeing as you failed to grasp the necessary work of the Holy Ghost in the world of men for deliverance and salvation, let us
next proceed to how God deals with those MEN who WILLINGLY COMPLY to His will as candidates and volunteers.
1) eternal remembrance
Mat 26:13
Verily I say unto you, Wheresoever this gospel shall be preached in the whole world, there shall also this, that this woman hath done, be told for a memorial of her.
Rev 21:14
And the wall of the city had twelve foundations, and in them the names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb.
[Mal 3:16 KJV]
Then they that feared the LORD spake often one to another: and the LORD hearkened, and heard [it], and a book of remembrance was written before him for them that feared the LORD, and that thought upon his name.
2) eternal reward
Gen 15:1
After these things the word of the LORD came unto Abram in a vision, saying, Fear not, Abram: I am thy shield, and thy exceeding great reward.
Heb 11:6
But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.
3) eternal glorification
Rom 8:17
And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.
Rom 8:30
Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.
amen ...
Galatians 3:24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
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really? ... hmmm
Hebrews 11:32-33 And what shall I more say? for the time would fail me to tell of Gedeon, and of Barak, and of Samson, and of Jephthae; of David also, and Samuel, and of the prophets: Who through faith subdued kingdoms, wrought righteousness, obtained promises, stopped the mouths of lions
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nope ... rolling eyes were the response to this post submitted by your bosom buddy ... and your heart-heart emoji:
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