Can We Really Exercise Free Will?

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
BillyBob said:
A man’s believing does not prompt salvation, for saving faith is given, it comes by the grace of God according
to the will of God by which a man is saved. Believing comes in the package marked SALVATION BY GRACE.
...Moreno Dal Bello... ​
Click to expand...
Ephesians2-1-3-1-Peter4-3b.png

Ephesians 2 v 1-3, 1 Peter 4 v 3b ~ You were dead in your trespasses and sins, in which you used to walk when you conformed to the ways of this world and of the ruler of the power of the air, the spirit who is now at work in the sons of disobedience. All of us also lived among them at one time, fulfilling the cravings of our flesh and indulging its desires and thoughts. Like the rest, we were by nature children of wrath.... living in debauchery, lust, drunkenness, orgies, carousing, and detestable idolatry.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Cameron143
Kroogz said:
For unto you it is graciously granted for the sake of Christ, not only to believe upon him, but also to suffer for the sake of Christ.

The true intention and teaching of this verse gets completely lost in order to establish a "proof'" text for reformed theology.

Suffering for the sake of Christ is graciously granted to the BELIEVER. Suffering for the sake of Christ grows and matures the believer.....And it is a GIFT. Not a gift that gets taught much in this day and age!

The calvies are partially to blame for hiding this gift of suffering....They just use it as a proof text for their FALSE doctrine.

Philippians 1:12
12 Now I want you to know, brethren, that my circumstances have turned out for the greater progress of the gospel,
Click to expand...
How can you read the verse and accept that suffering is given but not also believing?
 
reneweddaybyday said:
we all know the conversation so quit rationalizing ... my clarifying that faith is not works ... nor is it meritorious ... is not "lying" ... just believe what is written in Romans 4.
.
Click to expand...

I completely understood your responses as further clarifying the post and nothing to do with bearing false witness.

This "doctrine" does something to people or they adopt / are drawn to it because of something in them ... either way discussions generally end in the same strange place.
 
reneweddaybyday said:
do you believe faith is some sort of "work" on the part of mankind?
.
Click to expand...

I am not sure about that particular person but generally speaking they do, that is why they are so insistent that regeneration precede belief/faith and particular individual saving faith is gifted.
 
BillyBob said:
A man’s believing does not prompt salvation, for saving faith is given, it comes by the grace of God according to the will of God by which a man is saved. Believing comes in the package marked SALVATION BY GRACE.
...Moreno Dal Bello... ​
Click to expand...
My name is Moreno Dal Bello and I am 63 years of age.

I was born into a Roman Catholic family, and for many years attended Mass with my mother, and, on occasion, my father joined us. For years I was convinced that Roman Catholicism was Christianity. At the age of 24 I started to read the Bible regularly, and eventually began attending a local Baptist church. Several years of visiting and attending churches of various denominations followed, until I became disillusioned with 'churchianity', and the increasing number of doctrine-less 'sermons' I was hearing.

Later on I was told of Calvinism, and was asked if I believed it's doctrines. I found that I did ...

Edited to add link: About | godsonlygospel


men following men ...

1 Corinthians 3:3-4 For ye are yet carnal: for whereas there is among you envying, and strife, and divisions, are ye not carnal, and walk as men? For while one saith, I am of Paul; and another, I am of Apollos; are ye not carnal?
.
 
Cameron143 said:
How can you read the verse and accept that suffering is given but not also believing?
Click to expand...
He must also believe that Lazarus raised himself from the dead, which he could never do for himself! However, this is exactly what the Spirit must do for all God's chosen.
 
Kroogz said:
How can you read that verse and believe that it is only you and a few others that will be granted belief?
Click to expand...
I don't believe it's only me and a few. Now back to the question: how can it mean it was given to suffer but not given to believe?
 
BillyBob said:
He must also believe that Lazarus raised himself from the dead, which he could never do for himself!
Click to expand...

Believing in the Lord Jesus Christ is not raising ourselves from the dead.

Faith has no merit. The Lord Jesus Christ does the saving.

Again....You believe, I believe. There is no merit in believing.
 
Cameron143 said:
How can you read the verse and accept that suffering is given but not also believing?
Click to expand...


Kroogz said:
How can you read that verse and believe that it is only you and a few others that will be granted belief?
Click to expand...


Philippians 1:29 is not speaking of believing unto salvation. Paul wrote to all the saints in Christ Jesus which are at Philippi ... so already born again believers. Philippians 1:29 is speaking of the unceasing grace which God bestows upon the born again one so that he or she is enabled to continue on in faith in the Lord Jesus Christ as he or she faces the suffering for His sake.

Philippians 1:29 For unto you it is given in the behalf of Christ, not only to believe on him, but also to suffer for his sake

God continues to pour out His grace upon the born again believer throughout his or her lifetime so that the believer is able to stand firm in the face of our adversaries ... not terrified by them, but firmly confident in God's provision for each one of us in the Lord Jesus Christ. It is only in Him that we are victorious over any adversity we face ... without Him we can do nothing.

Philippians 1:29 reminds me of what is written in Rom 1:17 ... the just shall live by faith ... the life of the believer is begun in faith and continues in faith.
.
 
reneweddaybyday said:
Philippians 1:29 is not speaking of believing unto salvation. Paul wrote to all the saints in Christ Jesus which are at Philippi ... so already born again believers. Philippians 1:29 is speaking of the unceasing grace which God bestows upon the born again one so that he or she is enabled to continue on in faith in the Lord Jesus Christ as he or she faces the suffering for His sake.

Philippians 1:29 For unto you it is given in the behalf of Christ, not only to believe on him, but also to suffer for his sake

God continues to pour out His grace upon the born again believer throughout his or her lifetime so that the believer is able to stand firm in the face of our adversaries ... not terrified by them, but firmly confident in God's provision for each one of us in the Lord Jesus Christ. It is only in Him that we are victorious over any adversity we face ... without Him we can do nothing.

Philippians 1:29 reminds me of what is written in Rom 1:17 ... the just shall live by faith ... the life of the believer is begun in faith and continues in faith.
.
Click to expand...
Believe on Him is definitely about salvation.
 
Cameron143 said:
I don't believe it's only me and a few. Now back to the question: how can it mean it was given to suffer but not given to believe?
Click to expand...
I never said I didn't. This is simple @Cameron143.

Believing in the Lord Jesus Christ for our salvation is His plan for mankind. He rented the veil in the temple and was put on display for the WHOLE WORLD.(His Cross.) The Holy Spirit will convict and convince the WORLD.......Every person has been GRANTED/GIVEN the ability to believe His Gospel.

What we see is some rejecting it.
 
Cameron143 said:
Believe on Him is definitely about salvation.
Click to expand...
they were already born again ...

Philippians 1:1 Paul and Timotheus, the servants of Jesus Christ, to all the saints in Christ Jesus which are at Philippi, with the bishops and deacons

Paul wrote to the saints in Christ Jesus ... these are born again believers.


Philippians 1:3-6 I thank my God upon every remembrance of you, Always in every prayer of mine for you all making request with joy, For your fellowship in the gospel from the first day until now; Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ

Paul prayed for their fellowship in the gospel ... unbelievers do not fellowship in the gospel ...


Philippians 1:11 Being filled with the fruits of righteousness, which are by Jesus Christ, unto the glory and praise of God.

unbelievers are not filled with the fruits of righteousness


Philippians 1:27-28 Only let your conversation be as it becometh the gospel of Christ: that whether I come and see you, or else be absent, I may hear of your affairs, that ye stand fast in one spirit, with one mind striving together for the faith of the gospel; And in nothing terrified by your adversaries: which is to them an evident token of perdition, but to you of salvation, and that of God.

unbelievers do not stand fast in one spirit, with one mind, striving together for the faith of the gospel


Philippians 1:29 For unto you it is given in the behalf of Christ, not only to believe on him, but also to suffer for his sake


How many times must a person be born again before he or she is really, really, really, truly, scouts honor born again?

Edited to add: the point is that the born again believer is to continue believing in Him Who succours us through the trying times we face ...
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top Bottom
Back