Can We Really Exercise Free Will?
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God does not unable anyone. . . . they are unable because they are in Adam. However, He does enable those who belong to Him and places them in Christ.
When a Christian cries out “God be gracious to me”, he does so knowing that his only hope is in God. And, without His grace and mercy, he would be undone.
How so? God has always said "choose life" or suffer the consequences. Just because you don't won't to take responsibility for your decisions doesn't mean God will excuse you.
It was a good time for him... Loved the concurrent double LP he did as Derek and the Dominos.
Duane Allman came up with the guitar riff for Layla- not Eric Clapton, which in turn was him tweaking
a line from "As the Years Go Passing By" from Albert King's Born Under a Bad Sign album.
but those who hope in the lord they will renew there strength, they will run and not grow weary, they will not grow faint.
So it isn't your will or your choice that gets anywhere, it is hope.
Hope as in a silent quiet time in your heart, that waits patiently, where as a choice is but a moment, and a will is but a moment of desire.
The flesh is broken full of scars in the unsaved waiting to be filled , and like a winter cold the heart is stone, the mind is fueled by lies, in the unsaved waiting to be filled by the spirit , there own comfort becomes there chains where as hope can reach out to God to heal those broken wings.
It's not will it's not choice it's hope. And for those who walk in darkness there is still hope, the fathers will is still there for his remnant and before being filled with the spirit they to can walk in a lost way , and the remnant are those whom he those will be saved.
For it is living hope you are saved and his living hope also provides his hope in your heart
The devine nature of the father goes to work at first and along the ways there is scars, then the devine nature of the son and holy spirit, where the battle is complete
Yes, they understood. He claimed to be God which is why they wanted to stone Him. If God can raise a person from the dead (and He can) then why do you find it so hard to believe He can make a dead person understand what needs to be understood? The fact remains the (antagonistic) Pharisees understood what needed to be understood and rejected the Christ.
That is speaking of Christ's mission, not His person. If Satan and his cohorts had understood the world of men would be reconciled to God through the death of Christ, they would have done all in their power to prevent it from happening.
You need to stop taking verses out of context and throwing them at people as if they are darts to win a competition.
We do not come into the world with depraved hearts. You are are accusing God of creating evil when you say that. Plus I said we come into this world with neither the truth of God nor the lies of Satan. Good and evil must be learned! It is how we build character or the lack of it. That we sin is a given because of the sin nature in the body and our ignorance of truth, not because of any perceived depraved heart on your part. God makes the truth known to us and it is our rejection of that truth that makes the heart evil. The sin nature in the flesh deceives the mind due to our ignorance but God shines His light (truth) by means of grace (power) to overcome the problem of the sin nature and our ignorance. If though, we are of a type that prefer the dark, we will consistently reject God's drawing and the Lord will eventually hand us over to our sinful nature.
Just once it would be nice if you could hear what I actually say.
For someone who decries people like myself for not (supposedly) considering the sovereignty of God, you sure do like to push man's depravity as if it is a problem for the Lord GOD of Hosts to overcome.
as I've already said appealing to compassion will not get you anywhereWe do not come into the world with depraved hearts. You are are accusing God of creating evil when you say that. Plus I said we come into this world with neither the truth of God or the lies of Satan. Good and evil must be learned! It is how we build character or the lack of it. That we sin is a given because of the sin nature in the body and our ignorance of truth, not because of any perceived depraved heart on your part. God makes the truth known to us and it is our rejection of that truth that makes the heart evil. The sin nature in the flesh deceives the mind due to our ignorance but God shines His light (truth) by means of grace (power) to overcome the problem of the sin nature and our ignorance. If though, we are of a type that prefer the dark, we will consistently reject God's drawing and the Lord will eventually hand us over to our sinful nature.
Just once it would be nice if you could hear what I actually say.
For someone who decries people like myself for not (supposedly) considering the sovereignty of God, you sure do like to push man's depravity as if it is a problem for the Lord GOD of Hosts to overcome.
Justice comes first, compassion comes in the form of his judgment before the compassion you want to have.
If so, why are the words "mine, mine, mine" among the first words that a child learns to say?
And once again your response has nothing to do with what I said.
Nothing to do with justice or compassion simply explaining how we enter into evil.
You should have kept reading.
Usually the first word a child learns is mum ..... then no.
Well it looked like you where using your own compassion to say Rufus was at fault for people being born with a depraved heart was evil, on his part to me. Sad that you would just look at depraved as something to be his fault, even sadder that you don't see the real intension of people here, and see yours as more fitting.
In reality I've never known a child that doesn't display selfishness, am I mean to say that about children ?
Well i don't think so because if couldn't see there selfishness I couldn't fix it.
Yesterday, in a conversation I had with Sawdust, I asked her a few questions about the maternal relationship she has/had with her three children when/while they are/were growing up. For example, I wanted to know that as a mother, if she views or viewed her young children as being self-sustaining, self-reliant, self-sufficient beings -- capable of making all decisions on their own terms. I also asked her if she ever imposed her will upon any of her children. As far as I can tell, Ms. Sawdust has not replied. I guess she doesn't get the Mommy of the Year award. How could she? If she always gave her sinful children their way, what would that say about her and her children? On the other hand if she answered that she often, in love presumably, imposed her will upon her weak, frail, vulnerable, immature, helpless, rebellious children for their own good, then that kind of answer would betray a very serious flaw in her soteriological belief system, since God is very often represented in scripture as the FATHER of His children. She evidently would feel that, as a parent, she has every right/authority to [presumably] raise her children in the fear and admonition of the Lord, since all forms of human government, including the most fundamental of them all which is the Family Unit, were duly ordained by God. Well, since this is true, then how doesn't God, in his paternal relationship with His children, also have the authority to impose his perfect, holy, righteous and good will upon those He loves dearly since He also desires their Good?
The first definition of "impose" in the M-W Collegiate Dictionary is: "to establish or apply by authority". Interestingly, part "b" to this primary definition is: "to establish or bring about as if by force".
Jesus said, regarding this issue of authority:
John 17:2
2 For you granted him authority over all people that he might give eternal life to all those you have given him
NIV
Jesus' governing authority is so complete, so absolute, so eternal that He was authorized in eternity to give life to all those the Father has given to Him. But did the Father give to His Son the entire world in the distributive sense? Not hardly! If the Father had, would not have Jesus prayed for the entire world instead of explicitly omitting the "kosmos" (17:9)? And what kind of people, specifically, did the Father given to the Son?
Heb 2:13
13 And again,
"I will put my trust in him."
And again he says,
"Here am I, and the children God has given me."
NIV
And when did the Father give all His children to his Son: In eternity, of course (Eph 1:3-5), just as he promised the Son in eternity (Tit 1:2). And who are these children of God? Who else but the two flocks of sheep for whom Jesus prayed in Jn 17?
But FWers deny these great truths and like ignorant, rebellious, foolish, stupid children put themselves at grave risk when they categorically reject God's authority over ALL mankind. This kind of rebellion was so serious under the Law of Moses that incorrigible, obstinate, stiff-necked children who persisted in rejecting their parents' will in favor of their own were to be judged by the authorities and when found guilty stoned to death (Deut 21:18-21). Such children were "cut off" from the land of the living. And Jesus taught that unless the kingdom of God is received by someone as a little child, they would never enter the kingdom (Lk 18:16-17)!
So...not only do FWers never see themselves as helpless, vulnerable, weak, frail, immature moral beings compared to Almighty God, they do not even see themselves as little children who need to depend entirely upon His love, faithfulness and goodness! For if they were truly God's children, they would have humble attitudes and praise their LOVING Father and glorify Him for imposing His good, holy, perfect and righteous will upon ignorant, foolish, stupid people instead of blaspheming Him with all kind of vile, wicked accusations. They would know in their heart of hearts that their heavenly Father in eternity always had their best interests at heart because He graciously rescued them from their worst enemy: THEMSELVES because of indwelling sin!. But instead, they see God the Father as a moral monster and tyrannical dictator who forces himself upon people if He audaciously dares to impose his perfect and holy will upon them. Since there is little or no humility in the FWers in this thread, it's no wonder at all that they vehemently rail against God's Sovereignty. They think they are at least as wise and smart as the Creator.
Another important observation: This is what happens when metaphors are ignored. Ignored metaphors pervert the entire Word of God! FWers seem to have much more in common with their true spiritual father who hates God and his Truth. Also this "child" metaphor goes a long way in helping Christians to understand the truth that man's ways are NOT in himself and that God directs the steps of all men.
Finally, we can see once again how Natural revelation MUST be consistent with Divine revelation. Yet, FWT will not allow this. Human parents, who truly love their children, know they must impose their will upon their little ones, as needed, for their own good; yet, not so much not much when it comes to the Father's parental authority over His own children. This exposes the depth of FWers' self-deceitfulness. Human parents are good when they impose their will upon their children for their own good; Yet the Heavenly Father is evil if He should do that! Let God be true and every man a liar (Rom 3:4)!
The first definition of "impose" in the M-W Collegiate Dictionary is: "to establish or apply by authority". Interestingly, part "b" to this primary definition is: "to establish or bring about as if by force".
Jesus said, regarding this issue of authority:
John 17:2
2 For you granted him authority over all people that he might give eternal life to all those you have given him
NIV
Jesus' governing authority is so complete, so absolute, so eternal that He was authorized in eternity to give life to all those the Father has given to Him. But did the Father give to His Son the entire world in the distributive sense? Not hardly! If the Father had, would not have Jesus prayed for the entire world instead of explicitly omitting the "kosmos" (17:9)? And what kind of people, specifically, did the Father given to the Son?
Heb 2:13
13 And again,
"I will put my trust in him."
And again he says,
"Here am I, and the children God has given me."
NIV
And when did the Father give all His children to his Son: In eternity, of course (Eph 1:3-5), just as he promised the Son in eternity (Tit 1:2). And who are these children of God? Who else but the two flocks of sheep for whom Jesus prayed in Jn 17?
But FWers deny these great truths and like ignorant, rebellious, foolish, stupid children put themselves at grave risk when they categorically reject God's authority over ALL mankind. This kind of rebellion was so serious under the Law of Moses that incorrigible, obstinate, stiff-necked children who persisted in rejecting their parents' will in favor of their own were to be judged by the authorities and when found guilty stoned to death (Deut 21:18-21). Such children were "cut off" from the land of the living. And Jesus taught that unless the kingdom of God is received by someone as a little child, they would never enter the kingdom (Lk 18:16-17)!
So...not only do FWers never see themselves as helpless, vulnerable, weak, frail, immature moral beings compared to Almighty God, they do not even see themselves as little children who need to depend entirely upon His love, faithfulness and goodness! For if they were truly God's children, they would have humble attitudes and praise their LOVING Father and glorify Him for imposing His good, holy, perfect and righteous will upon ignorant, foolish, stupid people instead of blaspheming Him with all kind of vile, wicked accusations. They would know in their heart of hearts that their heavenly Father in eternity always had their best interests at heart because He graciously rescued them from their worst enemy: THEMSELVES because of indwelling sin!. But instead, they see God the Father as a moral monster and tyrannical dictator who forces himself upon people if He audaciously dares to impose his perfect and holy will upon them. Since there is little or no humility in the FWers in this thread, it's no wonder at all that they vehemently rail against God's Sovereignty. They think they are at least as wise and smart as the Creator.
Another important observation: This is what happens when metaphors are ignored. Ignored metaphors pervert the entire Word of God! FWers seem to have much more in common with their true spiritual father who hates God and his Truth. Also this "child" metaphor goes a long way in helping Christians to understand the truth that man's ways are NOT in himself and that God directs the steps of all men.
Finally, we can see once again how Natural revelation MUST be consistent with Divine revelation. Yet, FWT will not allow this. Human parents, who truly love their children, know they must impose their will upon their little ones, as needed, for their own good; yet, not so much not much when it comes to the Father's parental authority over His own children. This exposes the depth of FWers' self-deceitfulness. Human parents are good when they impose their will upon their children for their own good; Yet the Heavenly Father is evil if He should do that! Let God be true and every man a liar (Rom 3:4)!
yep I had the same issue with genez who couldn't see that unless you treat your father as your father you can't be seen as his little children,
He then went onto calling me a witch, he's obviously lost his dummy I think
