Can We Really Exercise Free Will?

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Magenta said:
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2 Corinthians 4 v 4 The god of this age has blinded the minds of unbelievers, so they cannot see the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God.
:)
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I had this discussion with someone m he seems to think there was no active will to death.

I know it's blunt and all but ow else can you get the message across
 
Magenta said:
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Man is born in transgression and sin (Psalm 51 verse 5, 58 verse 3), dead in transgressions (Ephesians 2 verse 5), his heart is deceitful above all things and beyond cure (Jeremiah 17 verse 9), held captive by a love for sin (John 3 verse 19; John 8 verse 34), so that he will not seek God (Romans 3 verses 10-11), because he loves the darkness (John 3 verse 19), and does not understand the things of God (1 Corinthians 2 verse 14), nor can he change himself (Jeremiah 13 verse 23). He suppresses the truth of God in unrighteousness (Romans 1 verse 18) and continues to willfully live in sin because he is totally depraved; this sinful lifestyle seems right to men (Proverbs 14 verse 12); they reject the gospel of Christ as foolishness (1 Corinthians 1 verse 18), and their mind is hostile to God; it does not submit to God’s law, nor can it do so. (Romans 8 verse 7).
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Not a single verse teaches what you believe. Not a single one.

Is God sovereign enough to make man with free will? Does giving us free will somehow “empty” God of His sovereignty? And if we don’t have free will, then how did we conclude that we do?
 
Believer08 said:
@Magenta, Why do we not have free will? And how do you know we do not? Is it possible we have free will, and you’re using your free will to say we do not have free will? Did God decide not to give us free will?
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The Bible says the natural (unregenerated) man is a slave to sin. Have you not read this?

We are further informed that nobody can just up and decide to come to God. God must act first.

Free willers here deny this. They claim God does not act unilaterally in matters pertaining to salvation, etc.

They say that for God to do so makes Him an unjust tyrannical monster kidnapping people against their free will.
So perhaps you can see that believing in this philosophical idea of free will causes people to say the most despicable
things about God, and that is not even the worst of it, since they would rather blaspheme God than admit they were wrong.

Also, unregenerated, man is explicitly said to be unable to submit to or obey God.

Man is opposed to the spiritual things of God, hostile in his mind toward God, the gospel is heard as foolishness.

It is silly for you to say, 'not a single verse teaches what you believe.' It is all in the Bible.

I hope you read it some day.
 
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Believer08 said:
Magenta, you are free to believe that.
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Jesus, Himself, had free will and revealed it in Luke 22:42 " Saying, Father, if Thou be WILLING, remove this cup from Me: nevertheless not My WILL, but Thine be done." He had to choose to submit His will to the Father's, just as we. In Luke 9:23 Jesus said " And He said to them all, If any man WILL come after Me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, DAILY, and follow Me." It's all a matter of submitting our FREE will to Him, daily.
 
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Believer08 said:
Not a single verse teaches what you believe. Not a single one.

Is God sovereign enough to make man with free will? Does giving us free will somehow “empty” God of His sovereignty? And if we don’t have free will, then how did we conclude that we do?
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If God had created man with free will how he could he judge them m 😭
 
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The LORD of Hosts has sworn: “Surely, as I have planned, so will it be; as I have purposed, so will it stand.” Isaiah 14 verse 24 The counsel of the LORD stands forever, the purposes of His heart to all generations. Psalm 33 verse 11 Our God is in heaven; He does as He pleases. Psalm 115 verse 3 Many plans are in a man’s heart, but the purpose of the LORD will prevail. Proverbs 19 verse 21 In Him we were also chosen as God’s own, having been predestined according to the plan of Him who works out everything by the counsel of His will. Ephesians 1 verse 11 And we know that God works all things together for the good of those who love Him, who are called according to His purpose. For those God foreknew, He also predestined to be conformed to the image of His Son, so that He would be the firstborn among many brothers. And those He predestined, He also called; those He called, He also justified; those He justified, He also glorified. Romans 8 verses 28-30 For He chose us in Him before the foundation of the world to be holy and blameless in His presence. In love He predestined us for adoption as His sons through Jesus Christ, according to the good pleasure of His will. Ephesians 1 verses 4-5
 
Bible_Highlighter said:
I never said you were John Calvin. That would be a pretty ridiculous claim to make. It is not possible for John Calvin to be alive today.

All I am saying is that if your belief aligns with one that did not exist before John Calvin, Beza, and the systematic clarification of those teachings in the Canons of Dort, then it is not technically wrong or incorrect for me to say you believe in Calvinism if your belief aligns with the five points of TULIP. It doesn’t really matter if you are a self-identifying 4-point Calvinist, 3-point Calvinist, or anything in between. The labeling simply follows what your beliefs line up with. If you prefer not to be called a Calvinist, then that’s great. It still does not change the perception of how I and most of Christianity would view your belief.

I can say that I am mostly Arminian, but I do not agree with Total Depravity. I believe in Partial Depravity, and I believe that the term "Prevenient Grace" should be called “Temporary Enablement or Enlightenment.” I am not afraid to agree with any labels that came before me if those labels fit and are biblical. For example, I am not ashamed to say I am a Trinitarian. Trinity means three in one, which is exactly what 1 John 5:7 KJV is saying.

If you are not a Calvinist, then the burden of proof is on you to show us why you think you are not one.



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No the burden isn't on me. You just prefer to lie about me. Grace and Peace.
 
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Magenta said:
The Bible says the natural (unregenerated) man is a slave to sin. Have you not read this?

We are further informed that nobody can just up and decide to come to God. God must act first.

Free willers here deny this. They claim God does not act unilaterally in matters pertaining to salvation, etc.

They say that for God to do so makes Him an unjust tyrannical monster kidnapping people against their free will.
So perhaps you can see that believing in this philosophical idea of free will causes people to say the most despicable
things about God, and that is not even the worst of it, since they would rather blaspheme God than admit they were wrong.

Also, unregenerated, man is explicitly said to be unable to submit to or obey God.

Man is opposed to the spiritual things of God, hostile in his mind toward God, the gospel is heard as foolishness.

It is silly for you to say, 'not a single verse teaches what you believe.' It is all in the Bible.

I hope you read it some day.
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Pure Calvinism.
 
bytheblood said:
Jesus, Himself, had free will and revealed it in Luke 22:42 " Saying, Father, if Thou be WILLING, remove this cup from Me: nevertheless not My WILL, but Thine be done." He had to choose to submit His will to the Father's, just as we. In Luke 9:23 Jesus said " And He said to them all, If any man WILL come after Me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, DAILY, and follow Me." It's all a matter of submitting our FREE will to Him, daily.
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Jesus had faith 😭 which has will
 
Believer08 said:
Pure Calvinism.
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Calvin did not write the Bible. Come up with something better, please.

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The mind of the flesh is death, but the mind of the Spirit is life and peace, because the mind of the flesh is hostile to God: It does not submit to God’s law, nor can it do so. Those controlled by the flesh cannot please God. Romans 8 v 6-8 This is what we speak, not in words taught us by human wisdom but in words taught by the Spirit, explaining spiritual realities with Spirit-taught words. The person without the Spirit does not accept the things that come from the Spirit of God but considers them foolishness, and cannot understand them because they are discerned only through the Spirit. 1 Corinthians 2 v 13-14
 
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From Romans 7 verses 18-19 Journey from Inability to Ability I know that good itself does not dwell in me, that is, in my sinful nature. For I have the desire to do what is good, but I cannot carry it out... I keep on doing the evil I do not want to do. Praise be to God for circumcising my sinful nature, causing me to obey by putting His Holy Spirit in me, and giving me a new heart.
:)
 
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Romans 7 v 18-24a I know that nothing good lives in me, that is, in my flesh; for I have the desire to do what is good, but I cannot carry it out. For I do not do the good I want to do. Instead, I keep on doing the evil I do not want to do. And if I do what I do not want, it is no longer I who do it, but it is sin living in me that does it. So this is the principle I have discovered: When I want to do good, evil is right there with me. For in my inner being I delight in God’s law. But I see another law at work in my body, warring against the law of my mind and holding me captive to the law of sin that dwells within me. What a wretched man I am! Who will rescue me from this body of death? Thanks be to God, through Jesus Christ our Lord!
 
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Flesh serves the law of sin. For the flesh craves what is contrary to the Spirit, and the Spirit what is contrary to the flesh. They are opposed to each other. Nothing good lives in my flesh. Who can say, “I have kept my heart pure; I am clean and without sin”? Who can bring what is pure from the impure? No one! The flesh brings forth fruit unto death. Romans 7 v 25, Galatians 5 v 17, Romans 7 v 18, Proverbs 20 v 9, Job 14 v 4, Romans 7 v 5 (Romans 8 v 13 and James 1 v 15)
 
Magenta said:
Calvin did not write the Bible. Come up with something better, please.

mindofflesh.png

The mind of the flesh is death, but the mind of the Spirit is life and peace, because the mind of the flesh is hostile to God: It does not submit to God’s law, nor can it do so. Those controlled by the flesh cannot please God. Romans 8 v 6-8 This is what we speak, not in words taught us by human wisdom but in words taught by the Spirit, explaining spiritual realities with Spirit-taught words. The person without the Spirit does not accept the things that come from the Spirit of God but considers them foolishness, and cannot understand them because they are discerned only through the Spirit. 1 Corinthians 2 v 13-14
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Never said he did. And you’re right, he didn’t, but what you believe about those verses is pure Calvinism.
 
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