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  1. Yahshua

    The Atonement: What did it REALLY Accomplish?

    Ahh...:unsure: :unsure: Ok, so for this single verse "the sheep" DOES mean "his own sheep", but not anywhere else in His parable............You do realize you're flip-flopping, right? Your "discernment" of this chapter sounds awfully like your definition of twisting... Usually, the charge of...
  2. Yahshua

    The Atonement: What did it REALLY Accomplish?

    I'm usually accused of twisting text when I simply copy and paste it verbatim (chased by a bullet point repetition). Can't get any plainer than to post the verses untouched as I did. It doesn't make sense to address any other points you've replied to me until we settle this passage. Let's...
  3. Yahshua

    The Atonement: What did it REALLY Accomplish?

    According to the Messiah's words, they shall have. I posted the passage and then repeated it in bullet form. According to the Messiah's words. I literally repeated what He said. It's not a warning at all. He's not talking to His sheep or alerting them of anything. He's talking to the corrupt...
  4. Yahshua

    The Atonement: What did it REALLY Accomplish?

    1) God's mercy = The offer of salvation made free to all. All means all. 2) God's salvation = The Messiah's payment for the wage of sin (i.e. His death); covering only the one who believes in Him, sparing them from the fire. 3) God's grace = The gift divine empowerment given to the believer to...
  5. Yahshua

    The Atonement: What did it REALLY Accomplish?

    Your last sentence; you're defining mercy and/or unmerited favor but calling it God's grace. This is why I posted how scripture defines grace vs how most have been taught to understand it. Scripture's definition of grace is divine strength. Unbelievers do not receive the gift of God's divine...
  6. Yahshua

    The Atonement: What did it REALLY Accomplish?

    ...but you've built your entire theology on two translated words - articles - while the context of the chapter is Messiah distinguishing between those who are His sheep (and what he does for them) and those who are not His sheep. John 10:1 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that entereth not...
  7. Yahshua

    The Atonement: What did it REALLY Accomplish?

    This thread is concerning atonement, "the covering" of one's life by Messiah's blood. The offer is made to any and all to be covered. But no one is covered unless and until they accept the offer. The atonement has not happened for the whole world because it's a matter of individuals accepting...
  8. Yahshua

    The Atonement: What did it REALLY Accomplish?

    Hi Laura, The Messiah's death and the Messiah's covering of blood are two different acts. We speak about the cross as if it's one complete act (because it's easy to do) but it's not a single step. No one is covered by Messiah until they accept the Messiah by faith. The atonement didn't occur...
  9. Yahshua

    The Atonement: What did it REALLY Accomplish?

    Faith > Grace > Salvation It's not a foregone conclusion. Faith in Messiah - on the part of the person - activates the grace that affects the atonement. Christ suffered death...but without faith from the recipient, Christ didn't die for the person. Romans 9:22 What if God, willing to shew his...
  10. Yahshua

    The Atonement: What did it REALLY Accomplish?

    That's some sleight of hand with the verses... If we post the chapter's verses in order, it clearly says the Messiah lays down His life for His sheep, but not for those who are not His sheep. John 10:15-16; 25-28 15 As the Father knoweth me, even so know I the Father: and I lay down my life for...
  11. Yahshua

    The Atonement: What did it REALLY Accomplish?

    The Titus passage above that's been referenced clearly states what I'm explaining. 1) All mankind is from Adam. Adam is from the dust. Mankind = earth. 2) The Messiah died and His blood fertilizes all the earth. 3) Almighty's word is the seed planted in the earth...remember what earth is. He...
  12. Yahshua

    Biblical faith what can it really do?

    Without faith is impossible to please Him, ...so if faith is waning then the Almighty is displeased more and more. In fact, He refused to allow any of those first generation Israelites (with exceptions) to see the promised land because they refused to have faith in Him. He considered it...
  13. Yahshua

    The Atonement: What did it REALLY Accomplish?

    If i'm a farmer, I'm going to fertilize all of my land for the specific wheat and barley I expect to grow and harvest. I'm not fertilizing that land for tares sown in by my enemy, even though all that grows in my soil still benefit from my hard work, including the tares...until harvest time.
  14. Yahshua

    What did Jesus say about HIMSELF?

    Her comments most likely had to do with the member's eventual removal. You could feel the guillotine falling closer and closer with each of their posts.
  15. Yahshua

    It's time to wake Judaism up and get them Grafted back in.

    Unfortunately, as history attests to, there was frequent persecution inflicted upon people who identified as Jew regardless of whether they confessed to being Christians or not, particularly because the Papacy viewed them as "heretics" and "murderers of the Blessed One". This precipitated their...
  16. Yahshua

    How the Pre-Trib Rapture Became Popular in the Modern Church

    It's all in Romans 11. It's not a man-made doctrine. Again, we're talking about "TIME", not groups. TIME...AGE. The church AGE is the SAME TIMEFRAME as the time of the gentiles. As the unsaved gentile kingdoms have ruled the world, the body of Christ has also been growing. I think you'll agree...
  17. Yahshua

    How the Pre-Trib Rapture Became Popular in the Modern Church

    Your condescension is a little offputting, I gotta say...there juuust might be a few things you can learn here as well lol. Note that your original disagreement with my post was regarding TIME. You said "the time of the gentiles is NOT the church age". My reply was to specifically point out...
  18. Yahshua

    How the Pre-Trib Rapture Became Popular in the Modern Church

    Pretty sure...which is why I inserted the words in brackets...to show readers the connections.
  19. Yahshua

    How the Pre-Trib Rapture Became Popular in the Modern Church

    I never said the great tribulation is the reason for the Jews' fall. The Jews' fall IS their time of great tribulation FOR rejecting the Messiah. Romans 11:15 15 For if the casting away of them be the reconciling of the world, what shall the receiving of them be, but life from the dead? If my...
  20. Yahshua

    How the Pre-Trib Rapture Became Popular in the Modern Church

    Romans 11 is a parallel explanation of what was prophesied to happen to the Jews during the Olivet Discourse. Verses 5-7 speak about the remnant of Israel according to the "election of grace", and how this "election" received what was promised. This is the very same "elect" mentioned in the...