Loss of salvation???

If the explanations on these sites you are offering are as complicated and confusing and far fetched as the answers you are giving on this post—no thank you. I will just stick to what the Bible says. I don’t need to try to “explain it away”. Obviously, you do.

Yes, thank you. I’m still being faithful to God.

I have the ability to interpret Acts 8:19-24 and in verse 21, Peter clearly said to Simon, "your heart is not right with God." Peter's rebuke was crystal clear. Why can't you see it?

Mark 16:16 - He who believes and is baptized will be saved (general cases without making a qualification for the unusual case of someone who believes but is not baptized) but he who does not believe will be condemned. The omission of baptized with "does not believe" shows that Jesus does not make baptism absolutely necessary for salvation. Condemnation rests on unbelief and not on a lack of baptism. *NOWHERE does the Bible say, "baptized or condemned."

If water baptism is absolutely required for salvation, then we would expect Jesus to mention it in the following verses. (3:15,16,18; 5:24; 6:29,40,47; 11:25,26) Yet what is the 1 requirement that Jesus mentions 9 different times in each of these complete statements *BELIEVES. *What happened to baptism? *Hermeneutics. *John 3:18 - He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who (is not water baptized? - NO) does not believe is condemned already, because he has not (been water baptized? - NO) because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. I believe Jesus. You believe your eisegesis.

Oh, the irony and Acts 8:18-24 clearly refutes your argument about Simon. Once again, when Simon offers the apostles money to have their ability to impart the Holy Spirit (verses 18–19), he is rebuked by Peter. Peter answered: "May your money perish with you, because you thought you could buy the gift of God with money! You have no part or share in this ministry, because your heart is not right before God. 22 Repent therefore of this your wickedness and pray God if perhaps the thought of your heart may be forgiven you. 23 For I see that you are poisoned by bitterness and bound by iniquity. (verses 20-24) Yet you call that saved?

As we see in John 2:23-25, in which their belief was superficial in nature and Jesus would not entrust/commit Himself to them. The object of Simon's belief revolved around the miracles and signs which were done and laying on of hands which led him to his misguided belief that he could buy the gift of God with money. That falls short of saving belief in Christ.

John has portrayed people who "believe" (at least to some extent) but are clearly not saved. There is a stage in the progress of belief in Jesus that "falls short of firmly rooted and established belief resulting in salvation." In James 2:19, we see that the demons believe "mental assent" that "there is one God" but they do not believe in/on the Lord Jesus Christ and are not saved. (Acts 16:31)

Also, in John 8:31-59, where the Jews who were said to have "believed in him" turn out to be slaves to sin, indifferent to the words of Jesus’, children of the devil, liars, accused Jesus of having a demon and were guilty of setting out to stone and kill the one they have professed to believe in. We can see at best, these Jews believed in Him (based on their own misconceptions and expectations) of Jesus, yet upon gaining further knowledge about Jesus through His words, we see they did not believe unto salvation and become children of God (John 1:12; 3:18) but were instead children of the devil.

I trust in what Jesus said in Mark 16:16 (the whole verse) and also what He said in John 3:15,16,18; 5:24; 6:29,40,47; 11:25,26. I just don't trust in your eisegesis. I also trust what Peter said in Acts 8:20-24. You do not. You simply isolate pet verses that tell you what your itching ears want to hear, build doctrine on them and then ignore the rest. That's called "flawed hermeneutics."

I understand what miracles and signs are for. I also understand Peter's rebuke of Simon in Acts 8:20-24.

Salvation is by grace through faith, not works. (Ephesians 2:8,9) Do not neglect it. We obey the gospel by choosing to believe the gospel. Romans 10:16 - But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Isaiah says, “Lord, who has believed our report?” So, we obey the gospel by choosing to believe the gospel by trusting in the death, burial and resurrection of Christ as the ALL-sufficient means of our salvation. (Romans 1:16; 1 Corinthians 15:1-4) Those who trust in works for salvation have not obeyed the gospel and do not believe the gospel.

In regard to the Samaritans, they received the Holy Spirit, so their conversion was not bogus like Simon's alleged conversion. Where does scripture say that Simon received the Holy Spirit? Instead, Simon received strong rebuke from Peter in Acts 8:20-24!

John Calvinist? LOL! I am not a Calvinist.

I properly harmonize scripture with scripture before reaching my conclusion on doctrine.

Proper Biblical hermeneutics is not about following a man. Scripture makes it clear there are folks who were never saved in the first place but since that does not accommodate your preconceived beliefs, you simply dismiss it.

Peter stated in 2 Peter 3:16 that in Paul's epistles, some things are hard to understand. Not everything is plain and simple or else Peter would have never said that and there would not be so many disagreements by genuine Christians and "nominal" Christians on certain passages of scripture. God says what He means but man does not always take the time to read what God says in context and properly harmonize scripture with scripture before reaching a conclusion on doctrine.

Why do you think we have so many false religions and cults? What is the main false doctrine that they all teach?

You believe your eisegesis. You simply isolated the first half of Mark 16:16, built doctrine on it, then ignored the second half of the verse, along with ignoring John 3:15,16,18; 5:24; 6:29,40,47; 11:25-26. That's called flawed hermeneutics.

You obviously don't believe Peter in Acts 8:20-24. You simply isolated verse 13 and ran with it before considering the context. More flawed hermeneutics.

Your twist disregards what Peter clearly stated in Acts 8:20-24. All you read is verse 13 and ignore the rest.

Sure, let them decide. So, where do you attend church?

What a cop out. You are obviously very satisfied with what you already believe and don't want to be confused with the facts. You can just stick with your eisegesis and refuse to be sharpened if you choose.

Proverbs 27:17 - As iron sharpens iron, So one person sharpens another.

yeah that was a typo on my part.

Absolutely is. The doctrine of unconditional eternal security however is not. See Romans 2.

Romans 2 is not about people who are saved through the gospel; it concerns those whose hope is in their works and in the Law: see Romans 3:21 and onward, "but now.."

Certain folks jump to the conclusion that 1 John 5:16 is talking about believers committing certain sins that lead them to spiritual death, but that does not fit the context. 1 John 5:16 - If anyone sees his brother sinning a sin which does not lead to death, he will ask, and He will give him life for those who commit sin not leading to death. There is sin leading to death. I do not say that he should pray about that. 17 All unrighteousness is sin, and there is sin not leading to death. 18 We know that whoever is born of God does not sin; but he who has been born of God keeps himself, and the wicked one does not touch him.

1 Corinthians 11:29 - For he who eats and drinks, eats and drinks judgment to himself if he does not judge the body rightly. 30 For this reason many among you are weak and sick, and a number sleep. 31 But if we judged ourselves rightly, we would not be judged. 32 But when we are judged, we are disciplined by the Lord so that we will not be condemned along with the world.

The apostle Paul knows that the judgment of God can take on the form of physical illness and even physical death. The word "sleep" when referring to death, refers to the physical death of believers, not spiritual death or soul sleep (John 11:11-12; Acts 7:60; 1 Corinthians 15:6,18,20,51; 1 Thessalonians 4:13-15; 2 Peter 3:4).

God is God of the living, not the dead, Son is risen where new life is given and is eternal, and not of flesh
in daddy's, PaPa's, Father's Spirit and Truth John 4:23-24
I am dead yet am alive, thanks to Father and Son as Won (One for us all)
death is born dead, in the first birth, yet everyone has a free choice to choose life in Father and Son willingly as well, to be new in love for all too, thank you
Thanks I chose choose life, thanks

God warned wayward believers to "rise from the dead."

One can be a believer. Yet? We need to follow 1 John 1:9 to stay spiritually alive to God in our daily walk!


But, if he neglects 1 John 1:9? He will become as good as dead to God.

That is why it said to believers....

Ephesians 5:14b

The question really is, “Can one lose eternal life?” Well, no - it is ETERNAL life. Also, can we sin too much - too badly? No. God’s way is discipline with His children because He loves them - not condemnation. Also, if we could lose our salvation by sinning, then we are trying to earn our salvation and play the role of Saviour but Jesus is the Saviour, saving us by His powerful grace.

Give these Scriptures a careful read…

“Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me HAS eternal life.” (John 5:24) The one who places their confidence in Jesus alone for salvation becomes the immediate possessor of eternal life - not temporary life.

“I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, that you may KNOW that you have eternal life.” (1 John 5:13) Clearly we can know that we currently have eternal life.

“There is therefore now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus.” (Rom. 8:1)

“Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life. He does not come into judgment, but has passed from death to life.” (John 5:24)

“In him you also, when you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation, and believed in him, were sealed with the promised Holy Spirit, who is the guarantee of our inheritance until we acquire possession of it, to the praise of his glory.” (Eph. 1:13-14)

“And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, by whom you were sealed for the day of redemption.” (Eph. 4:30)

“For I am sure that neither death nor life, nor angels nor rulers, nor things present nor things to come, nor powers, nor height nor depth, nor anything else in all creation, will be able to separate us from the love of God in Christ Jesus our Lord.” (Rom. 8:38-39) Absolutely nothing can separate us from God’s love. Context reveals this is in respect to the Christian. Simply, nothing can end our relationship with God.

“I give them eternal life, and they will never perish, and no one will snatch them out of my hand. My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all, and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father’s hand.” (John 10:28-29) Triple protection: in the Son’s hands, Father’s hands, sealed with the Holy Spirit.

“Now to him who is able to keep you from stumbling and to present you blameless before the presence of his glory with great joy, to the only God, our Savior, through Jesus Christ our Lord, be glory…” (Jude 1:25-25) Onus is seen to be on the Saviour to bring us through to His glory.

“Consequently, he is able to save to the uttermost those who draw near to God through him, since he always lives to make intercession for them.” (Heb. 7:25) Jesus saves us to the uttermost because He is interceding for us!

“Our Lord Jesus Christ, who will sustain you to the end, guiltless in the day of our Lord Jesus Christ. God is faithful.” (1 Cor. 1:8-9) The Saviour sustains the born again Christian till the end.

“On that day many will say to me, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not… do many mighty works in your name?’ And then will I declare to them, ‘I NEVER knew you; depart from me.” (Mat. 7:22-23) Jesus didn’t say, “I once knew you,” but, I never knew you.” In plain words, they hadn’t once been a Christian and then “lost their salvation.” So, it’s not a - now I’m saved - now I’m not - now I am - now I’m not.

“As Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, so must the Son of Man be lifted up, that whoever BELIEVES in him may have ETERNAL life. For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever BELIEVES in him should not perish but have ETERNAL life. For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him.” (John 3:14-17)

So it's all up to the believers ability to "follow" well enough then? That is what you are saying, that "salvation" is really just being put on holy probation to test our ability to "follow" well enough. Sounds very works based to me.

Notice that - "If we confess our sins, he is faithful and righteous to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness" (1 John 1:9) is in contrast to - If we say that we have no sin, (present tense) we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us (1 John 1:8) and - If we say that we have not sinned, (past tense) we make him a liar, and his word is not in us. (1 John 1:10)

Certain folks seem to misunderstand verse 9 to mean that we "must confess each and every sin that we commit as we commit them" (keep a specific inventory of every sin) as an "additional requirement" to "remain cleansed" and "if we forget a sin, we are toast!" Who could actually write an exhaustive list of every sin they have ever committed or ever will commit? Sin is not only missing the mark by what we do but also what we fail to do. (James 4:17)

Believers "confess" (Greek - homologeó) speak the same/acknowledge/agree with God's perspective about their sins and have a settled recognition and ongoing acknowledgment that one is a sinner in need of cleansing and forgiveness in contrast with saying that we have no sin or that we have not sinned. (1 John 1:8-10)

Why do we have to endure in our faith?

Huh?


Though always saved....
Believers in time can fail to do God's will for their lives.
No loss of salvation for them.
They will remain saved from the Lake of Fire.
What will be lost will be their rewards.









They will be ashamed at His presence to be told they had lived such a life that God had to withhold
special rewards that God wants so much to grant us for eternity!




No loss of salvation! Yet, a loss of rewards!

.... grace and peace!

God's free irrevocable saving grace will never be revoked by God or us.

Salvation is not a thing that can be accidentally lost but rather a relationship/fellowship that can be intentionally divorced or repudiated, which is why there are so many exhortations to persevere and not commit apostasy (do I need to post the "sour 16" here?). Because such a person has become completely corrupt, reversing good and evil, they will never repent and thus will never be forgiven for this blasphemy against the HS (MT 12:25-34).

A truly saved believer can backslide too much and become carnal/worldly (1CR 3:1-3) or prodigal (LK 15:11-21), but they may repent and be forgiven (1JN 1:9).

We always have a choice. I believe you can cross a line where there's no coming back from, but I also believe god can do the impossible.

Charging the subject just for edification purposes of course but have you noticed that 1Cor 3:1-3 that you quote describes them as carnal when they strive between each other over whether Paul, Apollos, or Peter is the better teacher? It does not say drunkards are carnal Christians. Then when it talks about works passing through the fire and some wood hay and stubble not surviving but they would still be saved yet not receive a reward and suffer some loss, that it is in the context of the teachings, and ministry of Paul, Apollos, Peter or any other minister. So we as ministers are to be careful about our teachings that we are preaching Christ. This is important
Too many have misunderstood and teach this passage all about a Christian who is a drunkard but that's not what Paul called carnal. He said drunkards will not inherit the kingdom of God. In this passage where he says they are carnal he says it's because they are striving over favorite preachers but their jealousy and envy is NOT the wood hay and stubble that he refers to. The wood hay and stubble and being saved but suffering loss is not being applied to the carnal striving jealous Corinthians it is applied to Paul, Apollos,Peter or any other minister who must be careful that they build upon no other foundation than Jesus Christ, and to be careful that what they teach will receive a reward.

Okay, can you share your Christian bar of soap , please? wait a sec, you just did, using 1 John 1:9 as if God needs to send Son back to die all over again to forgive us, each person individually?
That is what I hear the 1 John 1 whiners state, God's Son's death is not good enough, you need to get forgiven all over again and again, wash, wash, wash.
With that attitude (Flesh) will never please God, that is done once in Son's death once for us all. there is no more going Back to give or do anymore forgiveness. It is finished we all are forgiven Eph 1:7 2 Cor 5:17-20, John 19:30
So, what to do, since one has and does sin again, before and after belief to God in risen Son?
How to overcome and not be proud when do or at least think you have or will in not giving up trying not to sin again under Law? That all continue in sin because of trying not to sin. Is that you?
How, you doing in trying not to do it, behind closed doors? I do not do well either. Therefore I have given up on me, seeing no flesh can do it perfect as is done now by Son once for us all first. I saw to ask for the new life, asked without any ultrerior motive and God gave freely, hoping for all others also.

Authorized (King James) Version

2 Cor 10:5-8
5 casting down imaginations, and every high thing that exalteth itself against the knowledge of God, and bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ; 6 and having in a readiness to revenge all disobedience, when your obedience is fulfilled.
7 Do ye look on things after the outward appearance? If any man trust to himself that he is Christ’s, let him of himself think this again, that, as he is Christ’s, even so are we Christ’s. 8 For though I should boast somewhat more of our authority, which the Lord hath given us for edification, and not for your destruction, I should not be ashamed: