Questions

Oh- everyone to his own-I believe that's why we have discernment-to discern the good from the bad-so what tools are you using? Tools that help you to dig deeper into Scriptures and not just a "surface swimmer?"

Pro 19:20 Hear counsel and receive instruction, ‖ So that you are wise in your latter end.
Pro 19:21 The purposes in a man’s heart are many, ‖ And the counsel of YHWH—it stands.

Pro 19:20 Hear etzah, and accept musar, that thou mayest be wise in thy acharit (latter end, future).
Pro 19:21 There are many plans in a lev ish; nevertheless it is the etzah of Hashem that shall stand.

J.

Fully agree with you Sir.
Johann

Oh my!-my sincere apologies

That is why God provides elders in the churches (if churches would follow the NT pattern). So all a single Christian sister has to do is meet with a couple of elders and ask away. If they are what they should be ("apt to teach"), then all questions could be answered.

To address this please note:

1. The spiritual gift of interpretation of genuine tongues (glossais = languages) was given to some Christians (1 Cor 12:10) during the apostolic period. Therefore Paul insisted that there always be interpretation when tongues were spoken in the assembly. It is doubtful whether modern tongues (glossolalia) can be regarded as languages.

2. If God said women should keep silence in the churches, then that gift would only be given to men. So the question of whispering to the husband would not even arise. God is not unreasonable.

3. Women can certainly teach children and other women. In fact mature Christian women are urged to teach the younger women. But the focus would be on the role of women in the home and in the church, and what God expects of women in their Christian walk. When it comes to doctrine, that is the responsibility of the church leadership. Hence women are not to teach the church.

4. The Bible says that these restrictions go all the way back to Eve, and how she was deceived and therefore sinned ("in the transgression"). Today we may think that this is unreasonable, but that is what God says. We can either believe the Bible or rebel against it.

It is easy to get 76 responses on this question but try and engage you in something with some meat in it and you go silent just like you want woman to be.
2nd Peter chapter 3:

Verse 1. This second epistle, beloved, I now write unto you; in both which I stir up your pure minds by way of remembrance: Verse 2. That ye may be mindful of the words that were spoken before by the holy prophets, and of us the apostles of the Lord and Savior:

What words is Peter speaking about?

Verse 3. Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after

their own lust.

Scoffers: #1703 New Testament Strong's Concordance: A false teacher, mocker, scoffer.

What is Peter saying? I want to stir up, wake up your mind so that remember what the holy prophets,(the prophets of the Old Testament) and of us the apostles of the Lord and Savior. He is also telling us to pay attention to who is speaking. He wants us to wake up that we who are living in the last days do not fall pray to the words of the false teachers (preachers, teachers etc.) mockers. And scoffers.

Verse 4. And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? For since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of creation.

These scoffers, false teachers are asking where is his coming, We have heard from the beginning that He was coming so instead of putting in the time and effort to learn what was said they just come up with there own doctrine, and teaching that says Jesus could come at any moment; and many other things.

Remember his next verse is not my words.

Verse 5. For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens were of old standing out of the water and in the water.

Verse 6. Whereby the world that then was, being overflowed by water, perished.

Verse 6 tells us that there was an earth age before this one we live in. The same world, but the surface of the earth was destroyed. This is why God had to recreate the earth in Genesis 1:3-31.

Verse 7. But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men.

As Jesus explained in Matthew 13:37-43 Please read it do not take my word for any of it.

After this happens Jesus will return, put His foot on the Mount of Olives split that Mount in half making a valley 60 square miles that will have the millennium temple, city of Jerusalem, the land for the Levitates and the Priests.

Peter gives us one more very important peace of information in verses 8&9

Verse 8. But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that on day is with the Lord as a thousand years as one day. Verse 9. The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but all should come to repentance.

I hope that you will at least try and give me an answer.

Ok, well after all these years you know I respect you as a brother. I think we agree pretty often. But I'm going to throw a bit of a curve here, take this out of Bible times and apply to today and something that personally happened to me. You and the others here that believe women should not speak in church read carefully and then reply as to what you believe was done wrong or if there was wrong done and how would/will God judge it.

Many of you have known me before this name that I have now, I'm long term at CC. And so many of you know I was in traveling ministry for about 20 yrs as a family group (myself, sibling and parent). So the story unfolds this way.

One evening we were asked to minister in a church, doesn't matter which, for New Years. We agreed. We began to both sing and bring the message that evening and clearly no one was listening. The women were busy making coffee and getting the food ready for after at the back of the church. And they weren't doing it quietly, people were joking and talking, not giving any heed to the singing or the message. As we struggled to bring attention back to the message I did something I rarely did, I spoke. I picked up the microphone to the surprise of the other two and said "We could be any where tonight. There are parties all over the city. We could be at a country club instead of here, there is no difference if we simply come for food but leave the same way we came, spiritually empty. We can fill ourselves anywhere, but this house is where we come to bring our burdens and leave differently than we came". Silence, suddenly everyone was paying attention. I shook my head and walked away from the microphone.

A break was called before the second part of the service. As I began to walk down the aisle toward the back my mother grabbed my arm and told me to come quick. She said "a lady is asking for you and needs to talk to you." I saw a group of women and my mother led me to them. They were surrounding a lady who was clearly distraught. She said "You were speaking about me tonight" she was sobbing and continued "my husband told me he doesn't love me anymore and wants a divorce. He said I could stay till I found a place but he is moving his girlfriend in. I have only ever been a mother, I have never had a job, I don't know what to do." The women in the church didn't know what she was going through. I prayed with her and then the pastors wife stepped in. I do hope that lady found help and peace.

Now I tell this story not to brag on myself, so lets get that straight. I tell this story because I think it is a good example for those who say a woman should not speak in service. So where was I wrong? Why didn't God tell a man to speak up? The woman was in need of help and prayer. Should I have ignored what I felt the Holy Spirit was telling me? Or should I have not been there at all. Did God make a mistake when he put it on my heart to say what I did? I ask those who believe a woman should not speak, I'm sure some women feel that way too. Please all of you let me know what wrong was done, what sin, and what rebuke God would give me for doing it.

Actually you did nothing wrong, neither did you violate Scripture. The meeting was not a worship service, and you did not start teaching from the Bible. So in fact you did the right thing at the right time. So God used you for that incident.

Amen.
And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams: And on my servants and on my handmaidens I will pour out in those days of my Spirit; and they shall prophesy:

- Acts 2:17-18 (KJV)

Something my pastor pointed out that quite often gets overlooked regarding the "woman keep silent" issue is, in a time when the education of women was seen as unnecessary, Paul actively encouraged woman to learn. Even today there are certain countries that actively discourage women gaining an education.

Thank you for sharing this, your story made me tear up <3.

I spent some time in a church that was pretty adamant that only men could lead (except for the lead pastor and assistant pastor's wives, they could do whatever they wanted). It wasn't terribly oppressive, mostly just annoying.....but it did leave me not knowing what would be seen as "acceptable" for a woman to do (I am and always have been single and celibate). We were allowed to do stuff, but the line wasn't really clear where "doing stuff" ended and "leading" began. Anyway........

One of my jobs in church was doing weekly flower arrangements. I supplied all my own materials and at the end of the service I would ask The Lord to tell me who to give them to. And every week I was given a name or a vision of who should have them. So that person got flowers from Jesus. Sometimes they cried. Sometimes they told me they had just had one of the hardest weeks of their lives, but hadn't told anyone. Sometimes they just thanked me or shared a prayer request. But the whole church agreed that God was in it.

One week when I asked for a name, I heard "Mary". I didn't know of anyone in our church named Mary. But no other name came up. So I asked the Pastor if he thought there could be anyone there named Mary. He said no. I was hoping he would announce it over the microphone just in case, but he didn't. I was too timid to ask if I could do it, because I was afraid it would be seen as a woman taking the lead or speaking out in church. So I just took the flowers home that week and gave them to my Mom. But I was bothered.

The next week I wasn't in church for some forgotten reason, but I sent the flowers anyway with my sister. When she got home she told me she had given them to a lady who was caretaking for someone in a wheelchair, so they were attending our church while theirs was under construction. Apparently they had been there the week before as well. The lady's name was Mary.

Someday, if I ever learn to listen to God and obey without second-guessing what others might think of me for it, I just might see miracles.

Anyway..... my point in all this is: When verses like the ones we're talking about are thrown around casually or even used as weapons to "keep women in their place", it leaves us ladies not really knowing what we are "allowed' to do. And sometimes the guys in our churches yell louder than the still, small voice in our spirit. Please don't yell so loud you drown Him out, because He speaks to us, too.

That is a very powerful statement. And a beautiful story. If God puts something in your spirit my dear friend, obey Him. You can never ever go wrong. But God made a way for you just the same and that is a touching end to the story. I still sometimes wonder if I should step out at times but I believe if God lays it on my heart, He is asking me to do it.

Another quick story. Before I married I attended a small start up church with my parents. They had church in a storefront small building. So one Wednesday we were having service and I looked back for a moment and saw a lady who looked very upset. It seemed like she came with one of the congregation so I ignored it. But it bothered me and a moment later, I looked again. Clearly the lady was upset and it seemed a young teen girl was with her. I figured it wasn't my business, it was the person who brought her. So now I'm fighting with myself. At that time I was dating a person and I didn't want to just leave them alone. Back and forth I went. I looked one last time and I saw them heading for the door. I don't know what made my feet move but I beat them to the door. The lady was crying, what I assumed was her daughter was freaking out. I said "Can I help you?" The mother said " I want to go forward for prayer". But the daughter said " No I want to go, now!!" So here I stood thinking what to do next. So I said to the daughter " could we go to a room and talk?" She shook her head that that would be ok. We went in a small room and sat. And I said " What can I help you with? Is there something wrong?" She said " I have been diagnosed with a brain tumor and I wanted to go forward for prayer". I was floored. My grandmother had had a brain tumor and God called her home. The daughter began to get upset again and wanting to leave. So I said " would you allow me to pray with your Mom here?" She shook her head and agreed that she would. Here I am, just a young adult, and though I had been in ministry, this was a different situation than I had ever faced. So I gently put my hands on this woman's head, a lady I had never met before nor since, and prayed for her. Just as I was finishing my prayer the more spiritually mature ladies began to come in the room suddenly. I simply walked away and went back to the service. I never saw her again, but I know that's what God wanted me to do.When He lays it on your heart obey Him! If someone rebuffs you know that you did what you were asked to do. God didn't lay on anyones heart that day to pray for that lady but me. I don't know why, but I know I did what He laid on my heart and I will always try and obey. Blessings sister!

It makes no difference to God whether a woman has a Ph. D. or only a 6th grade education. The same rule applies which is silence in the churches.

It is commonly assumed that women were uneducated at that time, but that is a false assumption. Both Timothy's mother and grandmother were proficient in the Scriptures and taught Timothy well. And many Christian women are named in the Bible who no doubt were well educated. How could Deborah (in the time of the Judges) be a magistrate or judge in Israel if she was uneducated? People today think that ancient civilizations were backward, when in fact they were very far advanced in technology, architecture, mathematics, etc.

Wow nice Test. Gave me warm fuzzy filling when I read! In case no one has ever experienced that type of discernment of the spirit it is when the HOLY SPIRIT touches you. I know some will mock that but so be it ,it is not so, but be that as it may I know< When HOLY SPIRIT touches me and enlightens me. GOD knows and I try to please GOD and not man.

If you really must know Strongs (his 1st work) not the newer one where they change the meanings of words and passages to fit the newer versions of Bibles. Smith dictionary, Greens Interlinear new and old. Bullingers Companion bible, Websters 3rd collegiate dict, best 1 before they changed to wokeness, several maps, E-Sword and a few others.!!

I didnt get to read all the new post since I left yesterday but will when get time.

I do occasional word studies-more interested in the Morphologies and Syntax in the TR.
J.