predestination vs freewill

You are only free to choose if God sets you free to choose ... there were some who followed Jesus whose eyes God closed and whose ears He stopped up and whose hearts He hardened, lest at any time they should turn to Him and He heal them.

In old testament days this promise or command as it is only came to the Jews. The Egyptians didn't get the choice or the Philistines or Moab or Anakin.

There is a tension in my mind in attempt to grasp these. If there is freewill, it means your actions determine your outcome. If there is predestination, it means no matter what you do, you cant alter the outcome. But both above are mentioned in bible, which contradicts one another. Someone pls enlighten me thanks.

There is a tension in my mind in attempt to grasp these. If there is freewill, it means your actions determine your outcome. If there is predestination, it means no matter what you do, you cant alter the outcome. But both above are mentioned in bible, which contradicts one another. Someone pls enlighten me thanks.

Let me give you an hypothetical scenario, and see if it's true that you can't have both free will and predestination?

Let's say God has created the world to save 10 billion people. And He sent forth His word to create these people. His Word cannot fail, and these people must be created. In effect this means that the billions of people produced beyond the planned 10 billion people cannot be saved, because they were not planned by God.

But let's say that God also built into His predestined Word a process, in which free will takes place. Then people fail, producing people either planned by God or people not planned by God.

What people are "planned by God," and those who are *not,* is part of the process of free will. When God's Word plans people, they can fail, or disobey God's Word, but they will always respond to God's Word, as well. When they are not planned by God, they can succeed in obeying God's Word at times, but ultimately they reject God's Word.

To put it bluntly, those planned by God accept the Word that planned them. They are drawn towards the fulfillment they were predestined to.

But those not planned by God are repulsed by the Word of God that had not planned them. God cannot plan for children He did not predestinate, and they will always reject the Word that did not predestine them.

That doesn't mean that people are not free to obey God or to disobey God. Whether planned or not, all can either obey or disobey God. But the critical element in Salvation is the acceptance of God's Word as an internal reality, remaking the person in the image of God.

Those who reject this Word can never do more than obey God occasionally and experience spirituality on occasion. They reject a complete makeover of their lives based on God's Word.

It's important, if this is true, to recognize that all men still have dignity, whether they will be saved or not, and that all men can obey God's Word. And so, we must declare the Gospel to all men, regardless of whether we think they will be saved.

The reward for Salvation is eternal life with God. But those who will not be saved and in close fellowship with God will still exist in some domain created by God with some distance. (It's called "Outer Darkness"--the Lake of Fire is purely an eternal condition of removal from the "Promised Land.") And to the degree they have obeyed God their punishment will be lightened. We should help all men, regardless of their outcome.

is (God's) mercy and grace possible without predestination?

[Eph 1:1, 3-5 KJV]
1 Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, to the saints which are at Ephesus, and to the faithful in Christ Jesus: ...
3 Blessed [be] the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly [places] in Christ: 4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:
5 Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,

Q: Was The "Foreknowledge" Of God somewhere in your hypothesis?

You are only free to choose if God sets you free to choose ... there were some who followed Jesus whose eyes God closed and whose ears He stopped up and whose hearts He hardened, lest at any time they should turn to Him and He heal them.

In old testament days this promise or command as it is only came to the Jews. The Egyptians didn't get the choice or the Philistines or Moab or Anakin.

And it's a command YOU didn't choose the options, YOU had no say in the consequences. You couldn't even choose not to choose, you must choose.

Serve God and live that's not your will, that's God's will.
serve the devil and die, dead men have no freewill.

You can't say " ok God I won't serve You but I refuse to die"

We are not puppets or robots. How can God judge righteously if He compels people to sin? If God chooses to save or not, what is the point of preaching the gospel? You are wrong about the other tribes that were contemporary to Israel. God made provision that a non-Israelite could become an Israelite if he wished. No, I don't know how to reconcile free will with predestination. I will say that if God made all the choices for me, my life would have been vastly different and way better. Hyper Calvinism is no better than hyper Grace.

And many of the Jews resisted the leading of the Holy Spirit because they had free will..

There is a tension in my mind in attempt to grasp these. If there is freewill, it means your actions determine your outcome. If there is predestination, it means no matter what you do, you cant alter the outcome. But both above are mentioned in bible, which contradicts one another. Someone pls enlighten me thanks.

The below doesn't sound like free will to me. But, I could be wrong.

Deuteronomy 29:4 NLT - "But to this day the LORD has not given you minds that understand, nor eyes that see, nor ears that hear!"

The below gives us good reason to be thankful that being Controlled by the Spirit is the Work of the Lord.

Deuteronomy 30:6 NLT - "The LORD your God will change your heart and the hearts of all your descendants, so that you will love him with all your heart and soul and so you may live!"

The below doesn't sound like free will to me. In fact, it shows that the Lord has placed His Holy Mind Control over "most of Israel."

Romans 11:7-8 NLT - "So this is the situation: Most of the people of Israel have not found the favor of God they are looking for so earnestly. A few have--the ones God has chosen--but the hearts of the rest were hardened. As the Scriptures say, "God has put them into a deep sleep. To this day he has shut their eyes so they do not see, and closed their ears so they do not hear."

I could just be out of my mind and am somehow believing what I'm reading . . . it all seems pretty clear to me.

Clear to some

And since mums the word, no one wanted to comment on my obvious verses but yourself. What does that tell ya? Most, here, don't even want to believe . . . they're too afraid to change their mind and say, "Wow. I was wrong." No one recants on their bad doctrine . . . that's scary.

The NT doesn't say anything at all about anyone having freewill. The Jews were under the law, that is not freewill.

Jesus said of those who persecuted that they were children of their father the devil and HIS will ye will do.

The Jews were under the law, that is not freewill.

Do we have freewill to choose?
Yes,
Sure we are born in slavery to sin, which means we naturally desire sin more then righteousness, but Jesus has given us free choice from the start. To be free from sin require a choice on our part. A choice to die to the flesh or obey the flesh. We cannot do it in our own power but Jesus has promised to help anyone that call out to Him .

Do we have freewill to choose?
Yes,
Sure we are born in slavery to sin, which means we naturally desire sin more then righteousness, but Jesus has given us free choice from the start. To be free from sin require a choice on our part. A choice to die to the flesh or obey the flesh. We cannot do it in our own power but Jesus has promised to help anyone that call out to Him .

Mat 11:28 Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.

Rom 8:1-4 There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. 2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death. 3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh: 4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

These verses would mean nothing if we had no choice.

You seem to have a pretty distorted definiton of free will..



And how often did the Jews by their free will ability rebel against the Laws of God thus leading to the wrath of God coming upon them time and time again as when they where banished to Babylon to serve 50 years as bonded servants.. They demonstrated their free will by resisting the Will of God..