Unconditional love and the church's approach to homosexuality

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Apr 12, 2021
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Some (including you) who have visited us here yammer on as if you are safe to sin because your sins are covered by the blood of Christ, while others are in peril if they sin because they could lose their salvation. Perhaps hoping you see the hypocritical double standard in this is expecting too much.
Before I repented and was born again, I sinned very frequently, every day, ignored all that God's word had to say about sin because I didn't view all the things I did as sin, even though God's word says they are.

Once I repented and was born again, I sinned less, and less, and still sin less. I am not completely sinless, but I do sin less, lots less. And when I do find myself tempted, I go to the Lord in prayer for strength. And if I do sin, I confess it to the Lord just as we are exhorted to do. Not everyone does, though, and that is sad.

I am safe because I am saved, am being saved, and will one day be eternally glorified. I follow Christ, obey His commands, abide in him, and pray to Him constantly.

How about you?
 
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When you say "the purpose of repentance was clearly to keep your candlestick", of what is the candlestick figurative?
The seven candlesticks are individual church congregations.

Revelation 1:20
20The mystery of the seven stars which thou sawest in my right hand, and the seven golden candlesticks. The seven stars are the angels of the seven churches: and the seven candlesticks which thou sawest are the seven churches.
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
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Yes it does. Perfect

As to God it means completely and entirely righteous, undivided, infallible, inerrant, which includes sinless. And when Jesus tells us to be perfect as the Father is percect, he is telling us to be sinless.
Biblically, perfect means complete, whole, lacking nothing. Has the Lord asked us to be perfect even though all have sinned?
 

AlmondJoy

Active member
Oct 31, 2020
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You seem to be suggesting that Christians do not sin, which is false.
Or are you suggesting that homosexuality is worse than other sins?

Nobody is suggesting that homosexuality is not a sin. This thread is about how sins are dealt with, and I used homosexuality as an example.

I used to go to a "church" that believed as you do, and yet the "pastor" used the "church" as an income stream...as in "give me more and more of your money" and taught the falsehood that tithing is a requirement of modern Christians.

Funny how they were not accepting of homosexuality but we're accommodating of swindling...!
I didn't seem to suggest nothing. I said very plainly "if you are a gay man or women you are not saved" although you can become a Christian when you repent and forsake that lifestyle. Remember the words of the Master "Go and sin no more"
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
I find it odd how those who like to go around pointing out the supposed sins of others and acting like
those sins will cost them their salvation then turn around and admit that they are likewise sinners.
Amen

God sees us as righteous the moment we trusted in him. Not just when we obey him

we want to put limits on God.
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
Paul's angler? What sort of fishing line and bait was he using? Surf casting, deep sea, bass fishing, brook fishing? :unsure:
Dude I have eye problems and I try to post on a small I phone

ypu know what I a, talking about

i asked you about Jesus anger

and then I mentioned pauls anger against Peter, you went off on how I am not jesus, and even though I asked you multiple times about Paul and Peter this is the type of nonsense I get

answer the stinking question or continue to prove who you are and I will sound my troll alert
 
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Biblically, perfect means complete, whole, lacking nothing. Has the Lord asked us to be perfect even though all have sinned?
The Lord is calling us to Him because He is perfect. When we are His, when we abide in Him,, we are covered by His perfection.
 
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Dude I have eye problems and I try to post on a small I phone

ypu know what I a, talking about

i asked you about Jesus anger

and then I mentioned pauls anger against Peter, you went off on how I am not jesus, and even though I asked you multiple times about Paul and Peter this is the type of nonsense I get

answer the stinking question or continue to prove who you are and I will sound my troll alert
Oh, sorry.

Jesus is God and is completely righteous, so His anger was completely righteous. You're not God and therefore have no complete righteousness.

Galatians 2 does not say Paul was angry with Peter. Paul opposed Peter on issues related to Judaizing, and Paul accused Peter, i.e., he was to be blamed for waffling. But I don't see anger at all. You think perhaps they were screaming and yelling at each other? I don't see that either.
 

Mark47Oz

Active member
Jun 4, 2021
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Thank you for sharing. One day you will see just how powerful the blood of Christ is to cleanse away your sin. It's wonderful freedom to to wake up and realise that God has wiped your sins, not matter how many and how bad, from your record. The word Tedeleski, translated "it is finished", was used to indicate that a debt had been paid in full. You are free now, not to use freedom as license to sin but to walk in the new life that Jesus gives you through the power of the resurrection.

As you consecrate your life to Christ, accepting His Lordship, He will lead and guide you. He will also empower you to do what He asks of you. You know that life can be tough. Satan hates to lose those who were his slaves, so you will need to stay close to Jesus. Don't worry, He has been to hell and back and nothing is too hard for Him. Just don't try and work it out yourself.

I used to be pretty good at English. It was the only school subject that interested me. Your account is as good or better than most from that point of view. And what you have to say is more important than how you say it.
At first I didn't understand what on earth was going on, then God lead me to a book called 'The Warning' by Christine Watkins. At first I was a bit dubious but then I got listening to the testimonies in it. I've come to understand that what I've experienced is a real thing. It's happened to many Christians who have walked away or have been lukewarm in their faith have been given this incredible act of grace. And it IS the most amazing act of grace. We've been shown the true nature of our lives and how Jesus would judge us. Normally you'd have to die and wait for judgement Day, by which time it's far too late change. Jesus didn't have to say much to me. I was fully aware of how bad my life was. He showed me I wasn't wrong when I used to joke with people 'I'm going to hell' instead he just had to ask me one simple question - if I was with him. Which I knew meant 'will you follow me?' Just seeing him in my room was enough to know that even though I'd written myself off decades ago, he was still willing to forgive and offer another chance.

Yes it is painful. It's meant to be. Every single one of us that has experienced it has been a terrible sinner, or a member of the clergy who was on the wrong path. Jesus had shown us what we're doing to offend him and he's purging us of that sin.

And I do feel peace. I know I'm on the right path now and I'm actually grateful for the pain I feel because on the deepest level I know God is going through my all the garbage of my life and taking out the trash bit by bit.

So, for all you reading this, no hypergrace is not a thing. Every sin you commit before AND after you are saved weighs on your soul. God will forgive your transgressions throughout your life BUT you must a) Repent little thing you do wrong regularly (at least weekly) and then you must atone for your sins. This world has become v soooo corrupt with sin that even Christians are not fully aware of what sin is anymore. Something as simple as unkind words can devastate a person and it can send them down the wrong path. As humans we're all connected and God wants us to remember this.

He wants us to love one another and help each other when we fall. And PASSING JUDGEMENT ON YOUR FALLEN BROTHERS AND SISTERS HELPS NOBODY. God expects us to help them back on their feet and show them the love of Christ that resides within you.

Just because a person doesn't change then and there in front of you and come to the Lord doesn't mean your effort was wasted. God plays the long game and he changes people gently. He plants a seed and sometimes it takes a while to germinate.

"3And he told them many things in parables, saying: “Listen! A sower went out to sow. 4And as he sowed, some seeds fell on the path, and the birds came and ate them up. 5Other seeds fell on rocky ground, where they did not have much soil, and they sprang up quickly, since they had no depth of soil. 6But when the sun rose, they were scorched; and since they had no root, they withered away. 7Other seeds fell among thorns, and the thorns grew up and choked them. 8Other seeds fell on good soil and brought forth grain, some a hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty. 9Let anyone with ears listen!”

As you can see from Matthew 13 everyone you witness to will yield a different result. But we must pray pray pray for those who are not walking with Jesus. For many the weeds of doubt and temptation really do choke out the seed of the word. But we must never give up. Ever. Even on gay people.
 

Mark47Oz

Active member
Jun 4, 2021
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I pray that you come to truly possess the peace of God, which is beyond human understanding. It is a journey, one that Jesus comments on repeatedly. He also said we can do nothing without Him. I believe that means that our heart/motives, under the direction of the Holy Spirit can glorify God if we can dispel the fear that comes along side. It is a battle and one that can only be fought in union with the Spirit. Test the spirits-beware of your emotions, they can overwhelm and distract. Also-distinguish between pure Scripture, and religious man-made rules. If it’s not Scriptural, it’s tradition and it can easily can steer one off course.
Thankyou. As a Christian who use purely motivated by scripture, please read this from Psalm 66 and Malachi 3

"For you, O God, have tested us; you have tried us as silver is tried. You brought us into the net; you laid a crushing burden on our backs; you let men ride over our heads; we went through fire and through water; yet you have brought us out to a place of abundance."

"But who can endure the day of his coming, and who can stand when he appears? For he is like a refiner's fire and like fullers' soap. He will sit as a refiner and purifier of silver, and he will purify the sons of Levi and refine them like gold and silver, and they will bring offerings in righteousness to the Lord."

God through his grace chooses to refine some of us through fire so he can bring out the gold and silver in our souls. And if you think that it is all going to be unicorns and rainbows when this happens, not it isn't. It is hard and it does hurt. It's meant to. All the impurities need to be removed so we are just precious metal once again.
 
Apr 12, 2021
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And if you think that it is all going to be unicorns and rainbows when this happens, not it isn't. It is hard and it does hurt. It's meant to. All the impurities need to be removed so we are just precious metal once again.
We are in a battle, every day. If you've been in a physical battle then you have gone through it to be where you are right now, and you can attest to its physical and emotional strain. Our spiritual battles are with evil and wickedness, and we will feel strain on a very different level. When we've endured through all of it, when we've finished our race, we'll be with our Lord for ever. Never give up, never give in. Trust in the Lord always.
 

Mark47Oz

Active member
Jun 4, 2021
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We are in a battle, every day. If you've been in a physical battle then you have gone through it to be where you are right now, and you can attest to its physical and emotional strain. Our spiritual battles are with evil and wickedness, and we will feel strain on a very different level. When we've endured through all of it, when we've finished our race, we'll be with our Lord for ever. Never give up, never give in. Trust in the Lord always.
Finally you have said something we agree upon. Peace be with you brother!
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
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Before I repented and was born again, I sinned very frequently, every day, ignored all that God's word had to say about sin because I didn't view all the things I did as sin, even though God's word says they are.

Once I repented and was born again, I sinned less, and less, and still sin less. I am not completely sinless, but I do sin less, lots less. And when I do find myself tempted, I go to the Lord in prayer for strength. And if I do sin, I confess it to the Lord just as we are exhorted to do. Not everyone does, though, and that is sad.

I am safe because I am saved, am being saved, and will one day be eternally glorified. I follow Christ, obey His commands, abide in him, and pray to Him constantly.

How about you?
Sinning is not obeying His commands.
 

Sipsey

Well-known member
Sep 27, 2018
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Thankyou. As a Christian who use purely motivated by scripture, please read this from Psalm 66 and Malachi 3

"For you, O God, have tested us; you have tried us as silver is tried. You brought us into the net; you laid a crushing burden on our backs; you let men ride over our heads; we went through fire and through water; yet you have brought us out to a place of abundance."

"But who can endure the day of his coming, and who can stand when he appears? For he is like a refiner's fire and like fullers' soap. He will sit as a refiner and purifier of silver, and he will purify the sons of Levi and refine them like gold and silver, and they will bring offerings in righteousness to the Lord."

God through his grace chooses to refine some of us through fire so he can bring out the gold and silver in our souls. And if you think that it is all going to be unicorns and rainbows when this happens, not it isn't. It is hard and it does hurt. It's meant to. All the impurities need to be removed so we are just precious metal once again.
I could speak of many battles and fires in my 70 years on this earth. I have known extreme pain and loss. But, my hope in God is stronger now than ever. It is not about us, though many think it is.
 

Mark47Oz

Active member
Jun 4, 2021
233
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I could speak of many battles and fires in my 70 years on this earth. I have known extreme pain and loss. But, my hope in God is stronger now than ever. It is not about us, though many think it is.
The greatest gift God has given me is 5 simple but powerful words. I say them countless times a day at the moment. Every time I feel challenged

"Your will be done Lord"
 
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Australia
I've been to Fatima, Lourdes and Medjugorje in 1993. Fatima is the scariest place I've ever been to be honest.

What I'm talking about talking about is called the illumination of conscience, or the warning spoken about by Padre Pio, Sister Sasagawa, Garabandal to name a few.

If people don't believe in it, they will soon enough. This is the worldwide event I'm alluding to. It's already happened to some people in advance as a great act of grace and for reasons completely unknown to me, my turn came up just before Easter.

I'm going to try and make this as short as possible, but it's really hard to make a synopsis of the biggest most life changing event you've ever had.

Everyone knows who I am and how I've led an unholy life. No need to catch you up to speed on that. But one night before Easter this year (2021) I was in bed alone (as is normal) I became aware of a presence in my room. It was a male and he was standing in my doorway. I knew immediately it was Jesus. All I could feel was immense shame. And I said in my mind 'how can I come before you Lord, I am so so unworthy!' He said nothing, but instead showed me how he sees me. It was awful. The most spirituality, emotionally and physically (in my heart) painful thing I've ever experienced. I was like a beggar in the streets. Dirty, torn clothes. Disheveled and unwashed. Jesus didn't have to say a word. I knew my sins are what had gotten me in this state.

I kept saying in my mind 'why are you here Lord,? I'm so not worthy of you'

And he responded one simple question: 'Are you with me?'

For some reason, I knew I had to answer out loud. But I couldn't. With all my being I wanted to say YES! But my lips were bound. I struggled my heart was screaming 'I am here Lord' I took me everything ounce of will I had in my existence and my mouth moved. I was able to get those words I desperately wanted to say out. I blurted as loudly as I could 'I am here Lord!'

And then I just started weeping. I literally couldn't stop crying. I haven't been able to for months now. I keep getting this urge to start praying. To pray the rosary. And to fast. Things I've never done before. And I just can't stop. I'm literally obsessed with God and being in Jesus' presence. Every time I fall into prayer it's just a big blubber fest. All I feel is regret and sorrow for everything I've ever done.

And yet despite it being the most ridiculously painful thing I've ever done, I can't stop. It literally feels like I'm being purified in holy fire.

I've come to realise that my whole life has been one of selfishness and desire. All I want to do is make it up for all the things I've done in my life that have offended God and put right the wrongs I've done to other people. God is teaching me about the ripple effects of our sins. How even the smallest things we do, or even don't do can affect another human and cause them to become lost. He loves us all so so very much and he wants us. ALL of us to love him. It destroys Jesus when he sees how we've all dehumanised one another. We've forgotten that every single person on this planet carries the most precious of gifts with them. Their very own soul.

And yet again as I write this, I'm reduced to a blubbering mess 🙄 Whatever Jesus did to me, he stitched me up real good.

I literally went from being somewhere between agnostic and Atheist who teetered between believing there is no God, and if there is one, he didn't believe in me to full on believer who is ready to follow him wherever he leads me.

So this is what is to come for everyone on the planet. A great event will come and every single person on this earth will see how God would judge them if they were to die then and there at the same time. It's going to be horrific for many. Some will literally die from fright when it happens. I know I felt like I couldn't bear to see the stain of my sins, it was so so awful to know just how much Jesus cares, when I truly didn't.

So yes, Jesus does visit gay people. Yes he does want to save us. Yes I am changing. Things that were attractive to me a few months ago hold no interest today. Temptations that ruled my life are of no importance to me anymore.

All that matters to me now is making up for those years I wasted in ignorance and figuring out what God wants me to do next. Which is pretty much a 'to be continued' sort of thing at the moment.

I apologize for bad grammar and probably a poorly written account. Between trying to fight predictive text on my phone and blurry eyes I know I've done a hatchet job. 😑
Man... I will just say, that was one of the most beautiful testimonies i have read...
Thank you for sharing and may Gods peace and grace be with you always...