Is Jesus New Covenant or New "Law"?

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Did Jesus Fulfill ALL the Law and the Prophets (at Crucifixion)?

  • Yes

    Votes: 10 66.7%

  • No

    Votes: 5 33.3%

  • I do not know

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Total voters
    15
G

Guojing

Banned
#41
Jan 12, 2019
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#41
pumpkinbread1567 said:
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Let me clear this suppositions about me. I NEVER said I believe I was Israel.
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But more importantly, where did you get this idea?
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How do you interpret Romans 11:26-27 to mean "at the 2nd coming"?
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Currently the nation Israel is an enemy to God, so that we can receive salvation (Romans 11:11).

So their sins could not have been forgiven yet.
 
Hevosmies

Hevosmies

Well-known member
#42
Sep 8, 2018
3,612
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#42
There are way more than 10 commandments!

But the right answer is YES, Jesus did fulfill the righteous requirements of the law during His first coming
I dont believe all the prophets have been fulfilled yet, as there are still prophecies such as the SECOND COMING That are yet to take place.
 
pumpkinbread1567

pumpkinbread1567

Active member
#44
Feb 26, 2021
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#44
Guojing said:
Currently the nation Israel is an enemy to God, so that we can receive salvation (Romans 11:11).

So their sins could not have been forgiven yet.
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Although Romans 11 does not specify as return of Christ, an inspection of Isaiah 59, where "deliverer will come for Zion's sake" comes from, reveals it's about Judgement, so I think the notion that Israel will be saved sometime during that time makes sense.

Nonetheless, I don't say that I am Israel as supposed by you, but a member-in-law of the house in Christ Jesus, but whether or not I am allowed in the house may be questionable based on Leviticus 14.
 
G

Guojing

Banned
#46
Jan 12, 2019
7,497
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#46
pumpkinbread1567 said:
Although Romans 11 does not specify as return of Christ, an inspection of Isaiah 59, where "deliverer will come for Zion's sake" comes from, reveals it's about Judgement, so I think the notion that Israel will be saved sometime during that time makes sense.

Nonetheless, I don't say that I am Israel as supposed by you, but a member-in-law of the house in Christ Jesus, but whether or not I am allowed in the house may be questionable based on Leviticus 14.
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So what exactly do you mean when you say you are added into the house of Israel?
 
pumpkinbread1567

pumpkinbread1567

Active member
#47
Feb 26, 2021
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#47
Guojing said:
So what exactly do you mean when you say you are added into the house of Israel?
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It basically means "to be on the side of God" because the nations, the Gentiles, are the ones to be judged and taken along with the 10 kings and the beast that rule them.
 
Evmur

Evmur

Well-known member
#48
Feb 28, 2021
5,219
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London
christianchat.com
#48
pumpkinbread1567 said:
then why has Jesus said:
Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets. I have not come to abolish them, but to fulfill them.​
?
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He fulfilled the law. The end of the law is death. The soul that sinneth it shall die. we all sin, we all must die but Jesus died FOR US, in our place.

That is the end of the law then for us.

For sinners the law and the prophets remain.
 
G

Guojing

Banned
#49
Jan 12, 2019
7,497
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#49
pumpkinbread1567 said:
It basically means "to be on the side of God" because the nations, the Gentiles, are the ones to be judged and taken along with the 10 kings and the beast that rule them.
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That is a very broad meaning.

Does that mean you can take the promises God made to the nation Israel, and apply them to you?
 
pumpkinbread1567

pumpkinbread1567

Active member
#50
Feb 26, 2021
389
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#50
Guojing said:
That is a very broad meaning.

Does that mean you can take the promises God made to the nation Israel, and apply them to you?
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Of course you can. Here are examples.

Leviticus 17:3-onwards "Every man of the children of Israel, or of the strangers abiding among you, ..."​
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Numbers 24:18 "Edom will be an inheritance, ..."​
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Numbers 15:15 "There will be one law for you and for the strangers abiding among you, ..."​
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Isaiah 54:3 "your seed will inherit the Gentiles"​
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Isaiah 54:15 "Behold, strangers shall come to thee by me, and shall sojourn with thee, and shall run to thee for refuge."​
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There is a clear differentiation of the children of Israel and of the strangers, and there is enough evidence to expect that the Gentiles are joined to Israel (as if grafted in to the tree where Israel has been.)
 
Hevosmies

Hevosmies

Well-known member
#51
Sep 8, 2018
3,612
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#51
Guojing said:
Us non Jews were not under the Old Covenant, neither will we be part of the New Covenant (Hebrews 8:8).
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Great to hear you are in no covenant with God bro! What other good news you got? IF you not under the new covenant guess what... you are in NO COVENANT whatsoever. Its the only covenant going. And gentiles are also grafted into it, before you try that it says house of Israel trick.
 
brighthouse98

brighthouse98

Senior Member
#52
Apr 16, 2015
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#52
If you took ,the time to look pumpkin I am a he. I do not wish to go round the tree with you anymore,I explained why I think the way I do about this,I showed scripture showing you why,take it or leave it,you went back to matt 5 which we already covered.
 
Blik

Blik

Senior Member
#53
Dec 6, 2016
7,312
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#53
Evmur said:
No but there is an abolished law, a law that was nailed to the cross with Christ.

The law is abolished for us who believe, it still stand for sinners.
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Christ did not abolish any law, Christ plainly said so in Matthew 5:17-18. Christ gave us forgiveness from breaking the law, that is what nailing it to the cross means.
 
Dino246

Dino246

Senior Member
#54
Jun 30, 2015
25,400
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#54
Blik said:
Christ did not abolish any law, Christ plainly said so in Matthew 5:17-18. Christ gave us forgiveness from breaking the law, that is what nailing it to the cross means.
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I disagree, but you know that already.
 
oyster67

oyster67

Senior Member
#55
May 24, 2014
11,887
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#55
Nehemiah6 said:
...reject the Gospel. Which has nothing to do with the Old Covenant.
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The Gospel has everything to do with the Old Covenant. The Gospel is the very thing that the Old Covenant points to and the Gospel is the fulfillment of it. If you don't agree 100% with her, that is ok. No need to paint her as evil.
 
G

Guojing

Banned
#56
Jan 12, 2019
7,497
1,399
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#56
Hevosmies said:
Great to hear you are in no covenant with God bro! What other good news you got? IF you not under the new covenant guess what... you are in NO COVENANT whatsoever. Its the only covenant going. And gentiles are also grafted into it, before you try that it says house of Israel trick.
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I am in the Body of Christ, I have salvation from my sins now (Ephesians 1:7).

Would you rather wait until the new covenant begins with Israel, before receiving forgiveness of your sins? (Acts 3:19-21, Hebrews 8:8-12)

Which good news is better?
 
G

Guojing

Banned
#57
Jan 12, 2019
7,497
1,399
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#57
pumpkinbread1567 said:
Of course you can. Here are examples.

Leviticus 17:3-onwards "Every man of the children of Israel, or of the strangers abiding among you, ..."​
​
Numbers 24:18 "Edom will be an inheritance, ..."​
​
Numbers 15:15 "There will be one law for you and for the strangers abiding among you, ..."​
​
Isaiah 54:3 "your seed will inherit the Gentiles"​
​
Isaiah 54:15 "Behold, strangers shall come to thee by me, and shall sojourn with thee, and shall run to thee for refuge."​
​
There is a clear differentiation of the children of Israel and of the strangers, and there is enough evidence to expect that the Gentiles are joined to Israel (as if grafted in to the tree where Israel has been.)
Click to expand...
So you believe you are "joined to Israel" and yet you also believe you are "not Israel"?

Do you actually mean to say you consider yourself 2nd class to natural Israel?
 
pumpkinbread1567

pumpkinbread1567

Active member
#58
Feb 26, 2021
389
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#58
Guojing said:
So you believe you are "joined to Israel" and yet you also believe you are "not Israel"?

Do you actually mean to say you consider yourself 2nd class to natural Israel?
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You're twisting my word, brother. I also said
as if grafted in to the tree where Israel has been.
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The tree is God, the branch is Jesus Christ, the Gentiles are grafted in to the tree to bring forth fruit worthy of repentance, and Israel also must come back to its OWN house/tree, and then we're joined with them in Jesus name.
 
pumpkinbread1567

pumpkinbread1567

Active member
#59
Feb 26, 2021
389
59
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#59
And besides, I was talking about the QUOTED VERSES where Israel brings judgement to the Gentiles. I say we can't be joined with them until they come back to the tree. @Guojing
 
pumpkinbread1567

pumpkinbread1567

Active member
#60
Feb 26, 2021
389
59
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#60
brighthouse98 said:
I showed scripture showing you why,take it or leave it,you went back to matt 5 which we already covered
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The only Scripture verse you showed me concerning the Matthew 5 Jesus' statement was the fact that he said "It is done (finished)." And so I took you to Rev 21's recreation where he also says "It is done," and you told me:
You can't compare those two
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So I responded, saying Jesus said "Until heaven and earth pass away," and Rev 21 is that. And you stopped responding.

Perhaps it was covered for you, but not for me. ( ͡° ل͜ ͡°) @brighthouse98
 
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