Is Jesus New Covenant or New "Law"?

[TMS]

There was no law in the garden of Eden, it wasn't until sin was introduced that the law was given. The Lord not only responded with the law to guide us in our life in this world, but gave a way (in eternal time, not in our kind of time) of being forgiven for breaking that law that was perfected in Christ.

We are blessed with the longest psalm, the 119th psalm, that tells us all about the law. Along with the 23rd psalm, if you memorize it and live by it you will receive blessings as we are told in scripture, especially as we are given the fruits of the spirit.

Salvation is our overall, greatest blessing we can have. By knowing the law we can know what sins we are to give to the Lord for His forgiveness as long as we obey through the spirit of the Lord, with love, not legalistically. It results in our salvation. To live, guided by the law is our second, precious blessing.

What came first sin or the law?

Rom 3:20 Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.

No law = no sin...

Sin can not happen if there is no law. When Adam sinned there must have been a law.

Rom 7:7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.
Rom 7:8 But sin, taking occasion by the commandment, wrought in me all manner of concupiscence. For without the law sin was dead.

We are sinners today so the law is still making sin known.

 

[TMS]

I understand! I just read God's Word as I am simple,for what it is,not for what I wish to choose to make it mean. I judge no one in what they wish to believe,that is our business,I just never wish for anyone to preach the law over grace as those who do this are in for a double accursed,only place found is here in Gal 1:6-10. There was, and is no grace whatsoever in the law,please check out Deaut 28:1-68 there is no grace according to the law,hence why when it was given there was no prayer needed,for prayer requires faith and as stated in Gal 2:11-14 there is no grace in the law.Faith is in Jesus not in the law.

The law does not save us...
The law reveals our sins and reveals our need for Jesus to save us.
By Jesus we can be freed from the sin we have done. Praise God.
Does that mean the law is void, or taken away? No, We keep the law through Gods grace and because we love Jesus.

1Jn 3:4 Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.
Rom 6:12 Let not sin (the transgression of the law) therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof.
Rom 6:13 Neither yield ye your members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin: but yield yourselves unto God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness unto God.
Rom 6:14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.
Rom 6:15 What then? shall we sin, (the transgression of the law.) because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.
Rom 6:16 Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?
Rom 6:17 But God be thanked, that ye were the servants of sin, but ye have obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine which was delivered you...

 

[Blik]

,I just never wish for anyone to preach the law over grace as those who do this are in for a double accursed,only place found is here in Gal 1:6-10. There was, and is no grace whatsoever in the law,please check out Deaut 28:1-68 there is no grace according to the law,hence why when it was given there was no prayer needed,for prayer requires faith and as stated in Gal 2:11-14 there is no grace in the law.Faith is in Jesus not in the law.

I haven't seen postings that teach that we are saved by law. That does not seem to be a problem with isthese posts. There IS a problem of posters teaching that a saved person does not need to accept Christ in their life, a Christ who does not sin. They teach that not wanting to sin is actually teaching that law saves, that is just as wrong as teaching that law obedience results in salvation.

 

[Blik]

What came first sin or the law?

Rom 3:20 Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.

No law = no sin...

Sin can not happen if there is no law. When Adam sinned there must have been a law.

Rom 7:7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.
Rom 7:8 But sin, taking occasion by the commandment, wrought in me all manner of concupiscence. For without the law sin was dead.

We are sinners today so the law is still making sin known.

Read Genesis. Sin came into the garden through what Adam and Eve did, what they did is defined by the Lord as the Lord gives us the law. Sin did not happen until Adam and Eve disobeyed.

 

[Evmur]

Christ did not abolish any law, Christ plainly said so in Matthew 5:17-18. Christ gave us forgiveness from breaking the law, that is what nailing it to the cross means.

The law applies only to sinners ... are you a sinner?

 

[Evmur]

How can you follow Christ? You have no law to break, so you can not ask for forgiveness for breaking a law that is non existent. That leaves out the Lord's Prayer for you. You cannot separate Christ from the gospel.

When we sin we sin against grace and what is this grace? that God has taken away ALL our sins [why are saints still doing them then?] it's only because they do not understand the grace that has been extended to them.

The power of sin is the law, when you preach the law you are empowering sin among your hearers, that's why so called holiness folks are the worse backsliders. The law says "thou shalt not covet" and immediately you begin to search your mind and members for signs of covetousness.

Make no mistake about this the body of flesh and the mind of the flesh is now and always will be in rebellion against God so when God says "thou shalt not..." the flesh immediately cries out "I SHALL..."

The only victory over this is to know God's grace in taking away our sins at the cross and walking in the sure knowledge of that, God will confirm our faith in His word by giving us His Spirit.

Anyone struggling with sin? I can confidently tell you, you will lose. The fight we have is not against sin but the fight to BELIEVE the good news, the fight of faith. Don't struggle with sin, give it to Jesus, He is the only one who ever won that fight. We wash our robes and make them white in the blood of the Lamb.

That is God's only provision for sin.

 

[Blik]

When we sin we sin against grace and what is this grace? that God has taken away ALL our sins [why are saints still doing them then?] it's only because they do not understand the grace that has been extended to them.

The power of sin is the law, when you preach the law you are empowering sin among your hearers, that's why so called holiness folks are the worse backsliders. The law says "thou shalt not covet" and immediately you begin to search your mind and members for signs of covetousness.

Make no mistake about this the body of flesh and the mind of the flesh is now and always will be in rebellion against God so when God says "thou shalt not..." the flesh immediately cries out "I SHALL..."

The only victory over this is to know God's grace in taking away our sins at the cross and walking in the sure knowledge of that, God will confirm our faith in His word by giving us His Spirit.

Anyone struggling with sin? I can confidently tell you, you will lose. The fight we have is not against sin but the fight to BELIEVE the good news, the fight of faith. Don't struggle with sin, give it to Jesus, He is the only one who ever won that fight. We wash our robes and make them white in the blood of the Lamb.

That is God's only provision for sin.

The power of sin is the law, when you preach the law you are empowering sin 7.

The 119th Psalm is preaching the law. Do you feel David was only empowering sin when he wrote it?

What about Romans 3:31, Romans 6:2, Romans 6:15, and so many many verses in scripture telling us to be guided by the law, to put our will on righteousness and never desire to sin.

I understand your point, that we are to accept that Christ made us righteous through Him, and to have faith in that. But I think you carry it too far. We become liars if we say we do not sin. We need to be vigilant, always looking to Christ and Christ is without sin.

 

[Hevosmies]

When the author of Hebrews quoted it again, you noticed that he stick to the future tense too?

He wrote that, after the cross, and still use the future tense.

Obviously your doctrine "WHat did Jesus say when He instituted the Lord's supper? The covenant is in HIS BLOOD which was SHED already." is suspect.

SUSPECT? Bible is SUSPECT? I dont even know about you hyper dispies bro. "
This is my blood of the covenant, which is poured out for many for the forgiveness of sins."

Its quoted from Jeremiah, thats why its still in past tense.... `Just like EVERY QUOTE is in future tense if its QUOTED:

If I quote Jeremiah 31:31 its gonna be in future tense DUH

 

[Guojing]

SUSPECT? Bible is SUSPECT? I dont even know about you hyper dispies bro.

Its quoted from Jeremiah, thats why its still in past tense.... `Just like EVERY QUOTE is in future tense if its QUOTED:

If I quote Jeremiah 31:31 its gonna be in future tense DUH

I have already used Exodus 24 to state to you exactly when did Israel accepted the Old Covenant of the Law.

Tell me exactly which scripture in the NT tells us Israel accepted the New Covenant in Jeremiah 31?

 

[Hevosmies]

I have already used Exodus 24 to state to you exactly when did Israel accepted the Old Covenant of the Law.

Tell me exactly which scripture in the NT tells us Israel accepted the New Covenant in Jeremiah 31?

There is no ACCEPTING.

God saves people, causes them to keep the commandments

"I will give you a new heart and put a new spirit in you; I will remove from you your heart of stone and give you a heart of flesh. And I will put my Spirit in you and move you to follow my decrees and be careful to keep my laws. "

 

[Blik]

SUSPECT? Bible is SUSPECT? I dont even know about you hyper dispies bro. "
This is my blood of the covenant, which is poured out for many for the forgiveness of sins."

Its quoted from Jeremiah, thats why its still in past tense.... `Just like EVERY QUOTE is in future tense if its QUOTED:

If I quote Jeremiah 31:31 its gonna be in future tense DUH

Scripture gives us history, telling of when things happened. But it is a book written by the inspiration of the God who is a spirit, telling of eternal life. Eternal life does not happen according to time, and when we read scripture, we are to learn from this history what the eternal principles are. We can read it ONLY as history, it is true history. But that misses the fundamental ideas God wants us to understand.

We can pound our fists against the brick wall of context and history, saying it is truth. It is truth, but it is not the truth of scripture that includes eternal principles explained in the history and context.

 

[Guojing]

There is no ACCEPTING.

God saves people, causes them to keep the commandments

"I will give you a new heart and put a new spirit in you; I will remove from you your heart of stone and give you a heart of flesh. And I will put my Spirit in you and move you to follow my decrees and be careful to keep my laws. "

So you do agree the House of Israel and the House of Judah, the current Israel that we see now on the world map, never accepted the New Covenant.

So the promise in Hebrews 8:8-12 is still a future event for them, as of now.

Unless, of course, you take the popular doctrine that the current Body of Christ is the Israel that Hebrews 8:8-12 was talking about.

 

[seed_time_harvest]

What came first sin or the law?

Rom 3:20 Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.

No law = no sin...

Sin can not happen if there is no law. When Adam sinned there must have been a law.

Rom 7:7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.
Rom 7:8 But sin, taking occasion by the commandment, wrought in me all manner of concupiscence. For without the law sin was dead.

We are sinners today so the law is still making sin known.

Sin came first followed by death and the law was added because of transgression.

 

[Evmur]

The 119th Psalm is preaching the law. Do you feel David was only empowering sin when he wrote it?

What about Romans 3:31, Romans 6:2, Romans 6:15, and so many many verses in scripture telling us to be guided by the law, to put our will on righteousness and never desire to sin.

I understand your point, that we are to accept that Christ made us righteous through Him, and to have faith in that. But I think you carry it too far. We become liars if we say we do not sin. We need to be vigilant, always looking to Christ and Christ is without sin.

David is not only in awe of the law in psalms 119 but also the statutes. testimonies and ordinances. The law must be [in the OT] undergirded by the ordinances, that is to say the blood sacrifice. If they had applied only the law then they all would have died under the law because everybody sins against the law and the law demands death to the sinner.

hence the blood sacrifice

But the blood of bulls and goats were only a temporary arrangement until the perfect sacrifice for sin came, the sacrifice which would forever remove our sins. And that is what Jesus has done. Accept Christ perfect sacrifice for all your sins and you will be sanctified for all time. Isn't that the best news you ever heard?

What are God's people still messing about with sin for? The bigger people's understanding of what Christ has accomplished for us on the cross the bigger they will get victory over sin.

 

[pumpkinbread1567]

I am talking about the nation of Israel

do you mean the modern "state" of Israel?

 

[Guojing]

do you mean the modern "state" of Israel?

I don't know what you define as state. I was referring to the nation Israel as stated in Exodus 19:6

 

[pumpkinbread1567]

Sin came first followed by death and the law was added because of transgression

Ehm...........

Romans 7:9-11​

9 Once I was alive apart from the law; but when the commandment came, sin sprang to life and I died.​

10 So I discovered that the very commandment that was meant to bring life actually brought death.​

11 For sin, seizing its opportunity through the commandment, deceived me and through the commandment put me to death.​

​

It's indeed true as you say that the law gives you knowledge to sin and die, but where did the knowledge of sin & righteousness come from? Is it not the righteousness of God? Did God not know what sin was? I think he did since he was holy, but Satan came and he sinned. I... think the Lord himself is the Law who knew good and evil before creation, thus, it came first and sin second.

 

[pumpkinbread1567]

I just never wish for anyone to preach the law over grace

uhm.... do you actually think I was trying to promote Law observances?

...The only thing I was getting at is the fact that the Law can only be fulfilled by Jesus.

Those who wish to stay under the old law shall be judged by it.( Rom 2:12)

By the way, the verse doesn't say "old law". Just law. What there is is old covenant made with Israel and now gone away.

 

[pumpkinbread1567]

rose again on the 3rd day

Just off-topic, but... the Greek text author didn't actually put "again" there. I don't understand why "again" is there in probably English only, and I have to keep saying this over and over again bcs people are indoctrinated with this sentence.

 

[Guojing]

Just off-topic, but... the Greek text author didn't actually put "again" there. I don't understand why "again" is there in probably English only, and I have to keep saying this over and over again bcs people are indoctrinated with this sentence.

I take it from the KJV of the gospel, 1 Cor 15:1-4

Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;

2 By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.

3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;

4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: