Why I now believe that salvation can be lost.

Well done!

nice that someone agrees with me .. any who do not do God's Will and do not repent for such are not going to have eternal life in heaven and why so many think they will boggles my mind .. there will be NO unrepentant sinners in heaven, only repentant ones ..

Surely we are saved by faith alone.

But that faith will

Ephesians 2:8-10
8 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, 9 not of works, lest anyone should boast. 10 For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand that we should walk in them.

That faith will manifest in us the good works in us prepared for us before we were saved by faith.

Our good works do not save us neither will our bad works unsave us (ok not sure if unsave us is a word but I'll go with it).

The point is we will endeavour to walk in those works and when we don't, we fess up to God, agree we got it wrong and ask for help, thank him we are forgiven.

We are saved by faith alone apart from works when we come to the Lord and are saved, that is what "faith alone" refers to, it is refering to the point of salvation.

Not sure how you can say you agree with me then add words to what I said - I said we are not saved by "faith alone" simply because this is not a Biblical expression! Saying we are not saved by "faith alone" is quite different from saying we are saved by doing God's will and repenting. My view



But then if that faith works it is not alone . . . ??



I make some sense out of your idea here - but I think there is no need at all to differentiate how we are saved at the point of salvation or during our ongoing walk with God.

One has to ask the question.

If some are belivers and they refuse to repent then we need to consider whether they are belivers.

We cannot consider that until we come alongside.
Now if we address the situation with them, using Romans 5-6 and they reject it and say something like "I can sin all I want and still be saved"

Then shake the dust off our feet.

Yet if they hate what they do then let's walk with them.
I'm fed up with people who say "Well just stop it"
When people seek help to tell them that will have the affect of being condemned.
After all if they could just stop it then they would not be seeking help.

If there is an affect there will always be cause.

Are we willing to be used by Jesus to to reveal the affect of just to add to the cause.
When people are willing to be used by Jesus to be used for those who genuinely want release then let's go for it.

If not shake the dust off our feet and walk away.

You obviously do.

One extreme to the other.

Kill people every day????????????????
Come on man get real.
When do genuine believers do that?
I'm surprised you haven't mentioned rape or adultery every day.

Now tell me where I said it was ok.

If I correctly understand your analogy

A dog is a sinner

New creation is sinless

When creator make the dog into new creation, impossible for them to be back to a dog

When Jesus make a sinner into sinless, it is impossible for the sinless back to a sinner.

Adam and Eve was sinless and they make themselves a sinner

So it is possible for creation to change the self from sinless into sinner.

When we are born again we receive His Holy Spirit and their is no sin in Him.

So when we are born again we receive Holy Spirit and we not able to sin anymore? Or the Holy Spirit not sin but we still able doing sin?

You obviously do.

One extreme to the other.

Kill people every day????????????????
Come on man get real.
When do genuine believers do that?
I'm surprised you haven't mentioned rape or adultery every day.

Now tell me where I said it was ok.

Extremes as I said.

Is it ok to steal time from your employer.
Is it ok to see a poor person in the church who can't put food on the table, yet you have spare money and don't buy food for them?

So when we are born again we receive Holy Spirit and we not able to sin anymore? Or the Holy Spirit not sin but we still able doing sin?

Why did Jesus go to the cross?

You seem to be saying there was no need for His sacrifice. You seem to wrongly think you will go to hell for your sins, wrong.

You are saved from the “effects” of sin, which is death. No one in Scripture, except Jesus, was sinless. If you think that “you” or anyone can be “perfectly sinless,” then you need to go back and read a little more, about what you are saved from, and for.

David and Moses were both murderers. Look at all the sinners God saved, by grace, not because they were sinless.

Extremes as I said.

Is it ok to steal time from your employer.
Is it ok to see a poor person in the church who can't put food on the table, yet you have spare money and don't buy food for them?

You are saved from the “effects” of sin, which is death. No one in Scripture, except Jesus, was sinless. If you think that “you” or anyone can be “perfectly sinless,” then you need to go back and read a little more, about what you are saved from, and for.

David and Moses were both murderers. Look at all the sinners God saved, by grace, not because they were sinless.

Jackson, Holy Spirit within is does not sin, but yes we can still sin.

So when we are born again we receive Holy Spirit and we not able to sin anymore? Or the Holy Spirit not sin but we still able doing sin?

We are capable of and will occasional sin after being born again.
That is why G-d does not limit us in the number of times we can receive forgiveness;
That is why the Lord's daily prayer contains....the forgiveness section;
That is why the Bible says ...no one is perfect....no not one.
etc.

I agree, and I believe if we sin, Holy Spirit in us will remind us not to and repent, and if we ignore again and again, there will be a time Holy Spirit leave us and we lose our salvation

Yep, as long as we ask forgiveness and repent, we are ok.