Do you know what your protesting

[Jordon]

I am not that well versed in RCC theology, I know some but am not an expert by many means. And I tend to differ with them just as I do with many Protestants. I dislike using terminology that made sense 1500+ years ago and is no longer fully understood instead of trying to update the terms into things we really understand today.

One example would be that Plato and Aristotle made great arguments for the existence of God, but they are largely ignored because of the language used. But they can be easily updated using more modern language and knowledge and are suddenly very insightful to many people. But heaven forbid that we update the language of the Church to make it more understandable.

ok I'll address this more tomorrow now, to busy as it stands.

For now heres there theology is All based on the word if, there theology is the if God,

It's all based on if you do this or that with no mention of why else if could be being used,

All those time if is mentioned, for if you do this or that, there's no mention your being assured that the gift of faith you have been given is a result of if , they see faith as something you must express only with conditions.

There's mention of from them it could be Scripture assuring you that is proof of what a person does with the will of God in them.

It's just set in one meaning for all the ifs mentioned

 

[Jordon]

Slight mistake in my last post forgot the word no

There's no mention from them, it could be Scripture assuring you that if is proof of what a person does with the will of God in them.

And he believes faith alone can be destroyed by a computer , RCC theology

 

[seeking_christ]

is God drunk? im sorry but he sounds drunk when he mentions beer in my bible but for that reason i love the she reads truth csb version and because i can’t afford a beer right now so maybe later also another to the equation of what he is explaining also he sounded rough in his pardon but i take his word no matter what


interesting version……

food for thought


also this coild be the devil’s playground what do you think
shout Jesus here

also Jesus meets us when we fail telling us no why did you go that is not my way

and brings us back to his way

until we reach the end

 

[Jordon]

Notice rcc theology starts with a false representation of John calvin, and doesn't include John Calvins teaching people must be obedient to the father

Then he destroys faith with a computer, then he doesn't include the will of God could be a result of the word if.

Then he accuses reformed faith of saying people have no will of there own.


Sound familiar ?

It's looks RCC doctrine is the most popular doctrine here at cc

 

[seeking_christ]

Lazaro murio

 

[Jordon]

Declaration to all Roman Catholics from the council of Trent still in force today

You can hate reformed faith by whatever means possible and gain merit for it, which means you can tell lies about the reformed faith to and gain merit for it, which also means anyone of the reformed faith can be called a Calvinist pig and God will find favour in you


Council of Trent, sixth session, Decree on Justification, Canon 9 
If any one says that by faith alone the impious is justified; in such wise as to mean, that nothing else is required to co-operate in order to the obtaining the grace of Justification, and that it is not in any way necessary, that he be prepared and disposed by the movement of his own will; let him be anathema. 



Council of Trent, sixth session, Decree on Justification, Canon 24 
If anyone says that the justice received is not preserved and also not increased before God through good works, but that those works are merely the fruits and signs of justification obtained, but not the cause of its increase, let him be anathema. 



RCC Catechism 2027: No one can merit the initial grace which is at the origin of conversion. Moved by the Holy Spirit, we can merit for ourselves and for others all the graces needed to attain eternal life, as well as necessary temporal goods. 


 

[Rob7]

I've read the church history that also includes the protestant extermination of Catholics. Listen my friend don't think you talk garbage and think I won't call on it.

That's interesting. I've heard many people defend the anti-Christ, but never with, "church history that also includes the protestant extermination of Catholics."

Please prove your point, by linking us to some of that documented history, cuz I'm not aware of it. Not that it matters to the Truth of what I'm saying, but it seems to you, that it does.

 

[Rob7]

Gotta love this RCC versus Protestant argument. You leave out the entire Orthodox traditions from Eastern Europe, the Coptic church from Egypt, and other Christian traditions as if they do not exist. You also seek to ignore that the Protestant tradition is not uniform as it includes such groups as the Anabaptist traditions and the Anglicans. Meanwhile the Lutherans spelled out in their Book of Concord where they disagreed with the RCC, where they were not certain if they differed but stated their position and then agreed on all other points. Further, the nice, united mainline Protestants attacked both the RCC and the Anabaptist Protestants, when the Lutherans were not attacking the Calvinists.

You are presenting, further verification, of Satan's agenda and achievements of creating chaos, (1 Corinthians 14:33) in the religious world. All developed by Him and his anti-Christ to lead away from Truth, Jesus. Satan doesn't care where, or what you believe, as long as it IS NOT Christ and His Righteousness, being obedient to the Father, which is the Everlasting Gospel. Revelation 14:6

I like to point out the 44,000+ different nominal protestant denominations, all having a slightly different understandings on Biblical doctrine, but all uniting on one point, of justifying disobedience. They can't be correct, (right), as there in only one correct, "Righteous" way, Jesus, The (one) Way, The (one) Truth, The (one way to) Life.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++​

 

[Rob7]

Folks, ... Let me clarify one important thing.
I'm not saying that anyone not keeping the Seventh Day Sabbath holy, rather than Sunday, is automatically going to Hell and perdition.

"And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:"
— Acts 17:30 (KJV) is an important text that speaks to God's justice and mercy, especially in relation to those who are in ignorance of certain truths, such as the Sabbath or the full knowledge of the gospel. There are unselfish, loving, obedient people in all denominations, doing the best they know how, including Catholics.​

The Apostle Paul addressed the people of Athens, explaining that in times past, God overlooked the ignorance of people who did not have the full revelation of His truth. However, with the coming of Jesus Christ and the gospel being preached to all nations, there is now a clear call for repentance and acceptance of God's truth, which includes recognizing Christ as the Savior and obeying His commandments. ( Jesus said, IF you love me, you will keep my commandments. ~~ John 14:15 )

This concept is aligned with the broader biblical understanding of God's justice and fairness, recognizing that God's judgment will be just and based on the knowledge each person has had access to. The merciful and just nature of God ensures that the final judgment will be fair and considerate of each individual's situation and understanding.

I well expect to meet Amazon natives, who have never heard the name Jesus, in heaven.. IF I win this earthly struggle, and am judged worthy... I Pray !!

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++​

 

[rewriter]

ok I'll address this more tomorrow now, to busy as it stands.

For now heres there theology is All based on the word if, there theology is the if God,

It's all based on if you do this or that with no mention of why else if could be being used,

All those time if is mentioned, for if you do this or that, there's no mention your being assured that the gift of faith you have been given is a result of if , they see faith as something you must express only with conditions.

There's mention of from them it could be Scripture assuring you that is proof of what a person does with the will of God in them.

It's just set in one meaning for all the ifs mentioned

All Christian, and that includes RCC, theology is based on HUMAN interpretations of what is recorded in the Bible, often influenced by political factors. Not something most ardent Christians want to hear, but true. The Lutheran position was developed partially by scripture, partially by politics, the Reformed traditions likewise, and the Anglican and the Anabaptist on out to the more modern traditions. The RCC just responds to more ancient political pressures than the Protestants.

And I do not need any Protestant takes on RCC theology, I know enough RCC theologians that I can get any questions I have answered by them. They are aware of the subtle differences in their various positions.

 

[Nedsk]

That's interesting. I've heard many people defend the anti-Christ, but never with, "church history that also includes the protestant extermination of Catholics."

Please prove your point, by linking us to some of that documented history, cuz I'm not aware of it. Not that it matters to the Truth of what I'm saying, but it seems to you, that it does.

Of course you're not aware of it. Read a book once in a while. Start with Henry VIII and see for yourself. Blind ignorance is never pleasant not look upon.

 

[Rob7]

Except for the wars between Catholics and Protestants.. like in Ireland, after the reformation.

 

[Nedsk]

Except for the wars between Catholics and Protestants.. like in Ireland, after the reformation.

Like Henry VIII. I really am not in the mood today to deal with low intelligence posts. Maybe I need to take a few days off from this site then

 

[Rob7]

Of course you're not aware of it. Read a book once in a while. Start with Henry VIII and see for yourself. Blind ignorance is never pleasant not look upon.

The 50+ million that the Papacy killed for their Faith... was before the Reformation. When the Papacy held dominance in the world, controlling peoples freedom of conscience, torturing and killing, for what the RCC considered heresy, if we didn't believe the way that the Pope deemed we should believe.. Like the Sunday worship..

... stop trying to confuse the issues, defending the RCC

The Anti-Christ is taking the world, right back into those same conditions and mind set, of the Dark Ages Even ol' Pres. Joe Biden, a lifelong, practicing Roman Catholic, said, that the Pope was the moral authority of the World... so don't you think he was doing the bidding of the Papacy? (rhetorical question)

 

[Jordon]

All Christian, and that includes RCC, theology is based on HUMAN interpretations of what is recorded in the Bible, often influenced by political factors. Not something most ardent Christians want to hear, but true. The Lutheran position was developed partially by scripture, partially by politics, the Reformed traditions likewise, and the Anglican and the Anabaptist on out to the more modern traditions. The RCC just responds to more ancient political pressures than the Protestants.

And I do not need any Protestant takes on RCC theology, I know enough RCC theologians that I can get any questions I have answered by them. They are aware of the subtle differences in their various positions.

Subtle difference I question, well ok let's comment together for all the reason why the RCC church should rule, I'll watch this sermon later, and take notes on each point raised with for and against.

And ask all the questions that need asking,

One thing for clear this Roman Catholic is more self assured of there own faith
Then anyone else. Sound familiar ?

But make out if we dont believe like they do, you have no assurance, and even tells lies how our assurance is gained.



So let's tackle the issue of self assurance.

I'll raise all the question that needs asking later on this Catholic sermon and the one I showed you previously

 

[rewriter]

I am not supporting the RCC, I am merely noting that the Protestant churches follow the same pattern that the RCC has. Both groups have reacted to political situations, often when being established, and have developed their theology in light of those historic precedents. Why does the Anglican church exist, well both the Pope and Martin Luther told Henry VIII that his divorce was not proper, so instead of joining the Lutherans or staying with the RCC, Henry founded a new Protestant group. Then a couple centuries later the Wessley brothers saw problems in the Anglican church and the Methodist church arose. Meanwhile in Germany, depending on who the local ruler was, either Lutherans and Reform churches or else RC churches were suppressed, so the people came to the USA. Then after a couple generations they started realizing their fellow Germans were okay people even if they did attend the wrong church. About that time though there would be more repression in Germany so the new German immigrants to the USA would find their fellow Germans associating with the devil's spawn that just chased them out of Germany and thus would not associate with them and started new Lutheran or Reformed denominations in the USA.

Church history is full of "that group is not theologically correct", it just changes which group is incorrect. I cannot get concerned about a group of Christians who have historically been declared incorrect calling another group theologically incorrect because they happen to be in the majority at present.

 

[Jordon]

Well before I go to a lot more work which may not be until tomorrow now, as things have got a bit more busy for me now,

Could I ask all those taking part in this thread to give part 2 some consideration of the opening sermon in to this discussion. so if you can find the time to watch this and take into account the two last Catholic sermons I've posted post 155 and 144, we can all get the complete picture of what where protesting

Heres the second part of the sermon, if you could just all take time making notes on how assurance is gained, from both the Catholic RCC theology and RC sprouls assessment of that theology.

Thanks

 

[Jordon]

Well before I go to a lot more work which may not be until tomorrow now, as things have got a bit more busy for me now,

Could I ask all those taking part in this thread to give part 2 some consideration of the opening sermon in to this discussion. so if you can find the time to watch this and take into account the two last Catholic sermons I've posted post 155 and 144, we can all get the complete picture of what where protesting

Heres the second part of the sermon, if you could just all take time making notes on how assurance is gained, from both the Catholic RCC theology and RC sprouls assessment of that theology.

Thanks

So just a brief overview the final analysis of this sermon from RC Sproul between Roman Catholic theology and reformed theology all related to the council of Trent is this, which is the Roman Catholic declaration to all Roman catholics.

The dangers of the RCC council of Trent declaration which is still in force to this day is

Roman Catholic theology declares you can never know your sins have been washed away until you die

Reformed theogly declares upon being justified your sins are washed away

Ok do which way do you go now


Ok so Do you Carry on to support reformed faith being called Calvinistic pigs by Catholic dogma

 

[NewLifeInChrist]

Declaration to all Roman Catholics from the council of Trent still in force today

You can hate reformed faith by whatever means possible and gain merit for it, which means you can tell lies about the reformed faith to and gain merit for it, which also means anyone of the reformed faith can be called a Calvinist pig and God will find favour in you


Council of Trent, sixth session, Decree on Justification, Canon 9 
If any one says that by faith alone the impious is justified; in such wise as to mean, that nothing else is required to co-operate in order to the obtaining the grace of Justification, and that it is not in any way necessary, that he be prepared and disposed by the movement of his own will; let him be anathema. 



Council of Trent, sixth session, Decree on Justification, Canon 24 
If anyone says that the justice received is not preserved and also not increased before God through good works, but that those works are merely the fruits and signs of justification obtained, but not the cause of its increase, let him be anathema. 



RCC Catechism 2027: No one can merit the initial grace which is at the origin of conversion. Moved by the Holy Spirit, we can merit for ourselves and for others all the graces needed to attain eternal life, as well as necessary temporal goods. 


It is interesting to me that they would actually put these things in writing. I have certainly seen people describe salvation as being a cooperative effort between God and man, and saying so implies that man merits his own salvation, but I have never ran into anyone who says plainly their good works cause their justification to increase or that by walking in the Spirit they earn the grace they need to attain eternal life.

 

[Jordon]

It is interesting to me that they would actually put these things in writing. I have certainly seen people describe salvation as being a cooperative effort between God and man, and saying so implies that man merits his own salvation, but I have never ran into anyone who says plainly their good works cause their justification to increase or that by walking in the Spirit they earn the grace they need to attain eternal life.

Good points them

You could say from a Catholic view point in a none political way like just your average family person, is they can't declare there Salvation completely, but they can feal morally confident there saved.

Which is similar to how I feal and I'm not Catholic and I know Catholics feal the same way


But the issue at hand is the more severe politics, that I know people are subject to all the time. Here.

It's always best to have your eyes opened to it, so you know what your dealing with, and don't hurt an innocent party further.