Do you know what your protesting

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Jordon

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Mar 19, 2025
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In this sermon we get clear instruction as to why there is a great divide, between Protestants and Catholics.

Now you could say in some away the end result is the same but I'm not so sure the end result validates my next question , I ask is the journey as peaceful as it is for having assurance as it for not having assurance. And then I ask what would be the good points and bad points of both beliefs.

Next i ask for mature heads and kindness in this debate. Whilst we try to understand it.

Key points of the sermon,

People who call themselves protestants have no idea what it is there protesting or why we have a protestant faith.

The reasons they give is I don't believe in Mary like they do,
Or i don't believe the pope is infallible, or I dont believe in confessing my sins to a priest.

The main reason is to do with being Justified by faith alone.

The main reason protestant faith was formed, was in reactions, to do with arguments on how does a sinner find salvation in Christ.

The main reason is because we can have justification by faith alone. And the reformation side believing it's this article in which the church stands or falls, that this understanding teaches the very core of salvation.

And it's this reason for the devide, and why the fracture of the Christendom, was fractured then, and still fractured to this day.

The very reason being the meaning of justification

The meaning of justification in a Latin meaning, means to make righteous which the roman Catholic church got from just studying the Latin Vulgate bible only , so they never looked at the greek here, the meaning for justification in Latin means to make righteous, which stems from the Roman empire, and not the greek. So the idea of justification from a Catholic perspective, was a sinner had to had to made righteous. So the idea emerged that justification would be after sanctification. So in order to be justified you had to be sanctified to a high level of righteousness that is acceptable to God.

How ever the protestant used the greek meaning of justification, which means to be declared, and they developed a doctrine that justification was given before the process of sanctification.

The question is which way do you go now that you know, now that you know the devide was over the order of salvation

Here's the sermon with other key points part 1 only 23 mins long


 
In this sermon we get clear instruction as to why there is a great divide, between Protestants and Catholics.

Now you could say in some away the end result is the same but I'm not so sure the end result validates my next question , I ask is the journey as peaceful as it is for having assurance as it for not having assurance. And then I ask what would be the good points and bad points of both beliefs.

Next i ask for mature heads and kindness in this debate. Whilst we try to understand it.

Key points of the sermon,

People who call themselves protestants have no idea what it is there protesting or why we have a protestant faith.

The reasons they give is I don't believe in Mary like they do,
Or i don't believe the pope is infallible, or I dont believe in confessing my sins to a priest.

The main reason is to do with being Justified by faith alone.

The main reason protestant faith was formed, was in reactions, to do with arguments on how does a sinner find salvation in Christ.

The main reason is because we can have justification by faith alone. And the reformation side believing it's this article in which the church stands or falls, that this understanding teaches the very core of salvation.

And it's this reason for the devide, and why the fracture of the Christendom, was fractured then, and still fractured to this day.

The very reason being the meaning of justification

The meaning of justification in a Latin meaning, means to make righteous which the roman Catholic church got from just studying the Latin Vulgate bible only , so they never looked at the greek here, the meaning for justification in Latin means to make righteous, which stems from the Roman empire, and not the greek. So the idea of justification from a Catholic perspective, was a sinner had to had to made righteous. So the idea emerged that justification would be after sanctification. So in order to be justified you had to be sanctified to a high level of righteousness that is acceptable to God.

How ever the protestant used the greek meaning of justification, which means to be declared, and they developed a doctrine that justification was given before the process of sanctification.

The question is which way do you go now that you know, now that you know the devide was over the order of salvation

Here's the sermon with other key points part 1 only 23 mins long



Protestants protest all dictatorship, whether by papalists, Marxists or Islamists, because it opposes God/GW/the Gospel of Christ.
 
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I was raised in a protestant evangelical church and then tried in essence to attain to Heaven as did Saul the Pharisee (Mosaic law apart) I only believed in justification by faith at the point of conversion then. I wonder how many protestants or catholics delve too much into official church doctrine
 
Protestants protest all dictatorship, whether by papalists, Marxists or Islamists, because it opposes God/GW/the Gospel of Christ.
The formula for Catholic faith is

The formula is: faith plus work equals justification + grace plus merit equals justification + Christ and my inherent righteousness that gives me justification.

Our reformed faith crossed out works merit and me to equal

Grace alone + faith alone + Christ alone equals justification
 
In this sermon we get clear instruction as to why there is a great divide, between Protestants and Catholics.

Now you could say in some away the end result is the same but I'm not so sure the end result validates my next question , I ask is the journey as peaceful as it is for having assurance as it for not having assurance. And then I ask what would be the good points and bad points of both beliefs.

Next i ask for mature heads and kindness in this debate. Whilst we try to understand it.

Key points of the sermon,

People who call themselves protestants have no idea what it is there protesting or why we have a protestant faith.

The reasons they give is I don't believe in Mary like they do,
Or i don't believe the pope is infallible, or I dont believe in confessing my sins to a priest.

The main reason is to do with being Justified by faith alone.

The main reason protestant faith was formed, was in reactions, to do with arguments on how does a sinner find salvation in Christ.

The main reason is because we can have justification by faith alone. And the reformation side believing it's this article in which the church stands or falls, that this understanding teaches the very core of salvation.

And it's this reason for the devide, and why the fracture of the Christendom, was fractured then, and still fractured to this day.

The very reason being the meaning of justification

The meaning of justification in a Latin meaning, means to make righteous which the roman Catholic church got from just studying the Latin Vulgate bible only , so they never looked at the greek here, the meaning for justification in Latin means to make righteous, which stems from the Roman empire, and not the greek. So the idea of justification from a Catholic perspective, was a sinner had to had to made righteous. So the idea emerged that justification would be after sanctification. So in order to be justified you had to be sanctified to a high level of righteousness that is acceptable to God.

How ever the protestant used the greek meaning of justification, which means to be declared, and they developed a doctrine that justification was given before the process of sanctification.

The question is which way do you go now that you know, now that you know the devide was over the order of salvation

Here's the sermon with other key points part 1 only 23 mins long


so the first step of justification according to Rome is through the sacraments of baptism which is said to operate the ex opere operato, which means through the working of the work,

Protestants have understood this to mean that baptism works automatically, which means when a person is baptised there placed in a state of grace and a state of justification.

The catholic church where quick to become protestant about that and say no no no. We don't like to use the word automatic. Because there could be some kind of pre -deposition in the recipient and they must not have any inner hostility for baptism to function.

This is despite However the catholics have understood that during baptism grace is infused, which means grace is poured into the soul.

For catholics they will be very careful to say no no no, initial grace also means you can then can have an increase in grace. Or you can lose some of your initial grace.
 
The formula for Catholic faith is

The formula is: faith plus work equals justification + grace plus merit equals justification + Christ and my inherent righteousness that gives me justification.

Our reformed faith crossed out works merit and me to equal

Grace alone + faith alone + Christ alone equals justification

Their both wrong, with of twist of not understanding what NT faith is.
 
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and what is the understanding that makes them both wrong ?

I've been telling you for two days. Your just not ready internally to receive it. That part has to come from Him.

I just think your more interested in playing the debate game right now. When your ready, all the threads I've put on here for the last 2 months are there for you.

You got all the makings of one heck of a saint. You just got to not let all these doctrinal differences consume you.
 
Protestants protest all dictatorship, whether by papalists, Marxists or Islamists, because it opposes God/GW/the Gospel of Christ.
so the evidence is from the the sermon is, that John Calvin believed all mortal sin can be forgiven upon baptism meaning all people , and all sin after that did not make a person lose there saving grace.

Where as the catholics didn't like John Calvin for that
 
I've been telling you for two days. Your just not ready internally to receive it. That part has to come from Him.

I just think your more interested in playing the debate game right now. When your ready, all the threads I've put on here for the last 2 months are there for you.

You got all the makings of one heck of a saint. You just got to not let all these doctrinal differences consume you.
Insinuation, you didn't even know you had been following a Catholic belief in the previous thread, or your scared to say you do follow some Catholic beliefs but your not a full Catholic.

But you don't have to be scared with me, because if you take that road, well you could start insinuating,

You've just made a statement here, after I asked you to explain your understanding, you haven't explained it here, and gone in to critism.

So I'll ask again, with my patient of being tolerant and forgiving to your current unnecessary critique.

Why are both catholics and protestants wrong with your understanding. ?
 
Insinuation, you didn't even know you had been following a Catholic belief in the previous thread, or your scared to say you do follow some Catholic beliefs but your not a full Catholic.

But you don't have to be scared with me, because if you take that road, well you could start insinuating,

You've just made a statement here, after I asked you to explain your understanding, you haven't explained it here, and gone in to critism.

So I'll ask again, with my patient of being tolerant and forgiving to your current unnecessary critique.

Why are both catholics and protestants wrong with your understanding. ?

Because neither one understands what saving faith is correctly.

See the OP in the rediscovering pisteuo thread. It's your understanding of what saving faith is that you need to focus on.
 
Because neither one understands what saving faith is correctly.

See the OP in the rediscovering pisteuo thread. It's your understanding of what saving faith is that you need to focus on.
The speaker understands saving faith to be an unmerited gift, like us acknowledging where not worthy, where as he points out saving Grace must include merit by other beliefs.
 
I prefer to stay outside of the whole system.

Safe to say, protestants are no longer protesting anything. Representatives of pretty much every mainstream protestant church have been seen shaking the Pope's hand.
 
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I prefer to stay outside of the whole system.

Safe to say, protestants are no longer protesting anything. Representatives of pretty much every mainstream protestant church have been seen shaking the Pope's hand.
well you can stand shoulder to shoulder in some disagreement with those who you find it hard to stand shoulder to shoulder with, but you could could shake hands with many infallible people over your life time and not even know it.
 
I was raised in a protestant evangelical church and then tried in essence to attain to Heaven as did Saul the Pharisee (Mosaic law apart) I only believed in justification by faith at the point of conversion then. I wonder how many protestants or catholics delve too much into official church doctrine
. I wonder just how many people actually need to take this discussion seriously here ?

I mean we see so many members here on a daily bases constantly accusing reformed faith of what the catholics are guilty off, it's totally bizarre, the catholics believed only there special saints can get complete justification.

It's ironic that John Calvin taught actually no that privilege is available to all people, and another reason for the devide. But yet it's Calvinism that gets accused of catholicism nearly every day here

It's a little bit funny
 
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Protestants protest all dictatorship, whether by papalists, Marxists or Islamists, because it opposes God/GW/the Gospel of Christ.
so the evidence is from the the sermon is, that John Calvin believed all mortal sin can be forgiven upon baptism meaning all people , and all sin after that did not make a person lose there saving grace.

Where as the catholics didn't like John Calvin for that
did you understand the response here ?
 
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In this sermon we get clear instruction as to why there is a great divide, between Protestants and Catholics.

Get rid of the semantics, word salads and take them both out to the logical conclusion......They are the same.

Satans ACE trump is religion.
 
Get rid of the semantics, word salads and take them both out to the logical conclusion......They are the same.

Satans ACE trump is religion.
I guess the request for kindness must of passed you by
 
so the evidence is from the the sermon is, that John Calvin believed all mortal sin can be forgiven upon baptism meaning all people , and all sin after that did not make a person lose there saving grace.

Where as the catholics didn't like John Calvin for that
Get rid of the semantics, word salads and take them both out to the logical conclusion......They are the same.

Satans ACE trump is religion.
did you understand the response ?
 
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