Did it happen literally and physically?

[Godsgood]

Where in Scripture does it say that EVERYTHING God says is a parable? Nowhere! Rather, most of Scripture is plain text. Yes, there are parables. Most of Psalm 78 is parable. Much of what Jesus says in public is parables, but what He says to His disciples in private is not parables. Most of the New Testament and almost all of the Old Testament are not parables.

Think about it in logical terms: if everything God says is a parable, then even the statement, "God is speaking in parables" is itself a parable. That's silly.

Look at the serpent in this verse.
And who will tell that God the Father is speaking in parables when he said WHEN YOU EAT FROM IT YOU WILL SURELY DIE.
Because what God the father said is very clear in serpent understanding.
GENESIS 2:17
17 but you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, for when you eat from it you will certainly die.”

The serpent never believe that God the Father is speaking in parables.
So he said this to Eve.
GENESIS 3:4
4 “You will not certainly die,” the serpent said to the woman. 5 “For God knows that when you eat from it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil.”

 

[Dino246]

Look at the serpent in this verse.
And who will tell that God the Father is speaking in parables when he said WHEN YOU EAT FROM IT YOU WILL SURELY DIE.
Because what God the father said is very clear in serpent understanding.
GENESIS 2:17
17 but you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, for when you eat from it you will certainly die.”

The serpent never believe that God the Father is speaking in parables.
So he said this to Eve.
GENESIS 3:4
4 “You will not certainly die,” the serpent said to the woman. 5 “For God knows that when you eat from it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil.”

What the serpent said to Eve has absolutely nothing to do with whether God spoke in parable. Still, He didn’t.

 

[Godsgood]

What the serpent said to Eve has absolutely nothing to do with whether God spoke in parable. Still, He didn’t.

What the serpent said to Eve has absolutely nothing to do with whether God spoke in parable. Still, He didn’t.
It has to do.
Because serpent believe that God the Father is not speaking in parables, so for the serpent God the Father is lying. Because Adam & Eve did not die when they ate the forbidden fruit. And for the serpent he is telling the truth.

Same thing with the Jews particularly Scribes & Pharisees..
Because they don't believe that Jesus Christ is speaking in parables (Mark 4:34)
JOHN 2:19-20
19 Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.
20 Then said the Jews, Forty and six years was this temple in building, and wilt thou rear it up in three days?

With their belief that Jesus is not speaking in parables. for them Jesus is a liar. Because they never seen the literal temple being destroyed and build in 3 days.
MATTHEW 27:39-40
39 And they that passed by reviled him, wagging their heads,
40 And saying, Thou that destroyest the temple, and buildest it in three days, save thyself. If thou be the Son of God, come down from the cross.

For the Scribes & Pharisees they are telling the truth and Jesus is lying.

This is what will happen when the belief that God is not speaking in parables.

 

[Dino246]

This is what will happen when the belief that God is not speaking in parables.

Try a complete sentence next time.

 

[4urenlightment]

GENESIS 6:13-22
13 And God said unto Noah, The end of all flesh is come before me; for the earth is filled with violence through them; and, behold, I will destroy them with the earth.

14 Make thee an ark of gopher wood; rooms shalt thou make in the ark, and shalt pitch it within and without with pitch.

15 And this is the fashion which thou shalt make it of: The length of the ark shall be three hundred cubits, the breadth of it fifty cubits, and the height of it thirty cubits.

16 A window shalt thou make to the ark, and in a cubit shalt thou finish it above; and the door of the ark shalt thou set in the side thereof; with lower, second, and third stories shalt thou make it.

17 And, behold, I, even I, do bring a flood of waters upon the earth, to destroy all flesh, wherein is the breath of life, from under heaven; and every thing that is in the earth shall die.

18 But with thee will I establish my covenant; and thou shalt come into the ark, thou, and thy sons, and thy wife, and thy sons' wives with thee.

19 And of every living thing of all flesh, two of every sort shalt thou bring into the ark, to keep them alive with thee; they shall be male and female.

20 Of fowls after their kind, and of cattle after their kind, of every creeping thing of the earth after his kind, two of every sort shall come unto thee, to keep them alive.

21 And take thou unto thee of all food that is eaten, and thou shalt gather it to thee; and it shall be for food for thee, and for them.

22 Thus did Noah; according to all that God commanded him, so did he.

There's evidence of Noah's flood. But schools are prohibited from teaching about them. And there's evidence that these ancient cities like Egypt was built before the flood. That the Egyptians came after and started refurbishing these ruin cities.
But I believe the Egyptian drawing on these structures and other drawing on other mega structures were painted or carved onto these structures after the separation from the city of Babel. That the people in those days didn't know how to communicate with one another and so they draw images as a way of communicating or to tell a story.

 

[Godsgood]

Try a complete sentence next time.

Not very good in english speaking is not a basis to salvation.

The basis is the truth. And you can't ask any body to stop sharing the turth by just simlply telling they have a wrong grammar.

God never let that happen.
LUKE 19:40
40 And he answered and said unto them, I tell you that, if these should hold their peace, the stones would immediately cry out.

 

[Godsgood]

Your reasoning is deeply flawed here. This verse reinforces the fact that it happened literally. If the Noahite flood happened only spiritually, then there were no "days of Noah" to which Jesus could refer.


Again, none of this suggests that the events were "only" spiritual (whatever that is supposed to mean). Try reading these verses in a modern translation to get a modern understanding of the concepts instead of a 500-year-old version.

"The Lord regretted that he had made human beings on the earth, and his heart was deeply troubled." (NASB95)

That doesn't impinge on God's perfection. As you said, "If we read below verses with using man's intellect"; God's perfection is not what human intellect accounts it to be.

Again, none of this suggests that the events were "only" spiritual (whatever that is supposed to mean). Try reading these verses in a modern translation to get a modern understanding of the concepts instead of a 500-year-old version.

God knows which version showing the truth. It doesn't mean a 500 year old versiion is not showing the truth.
In fact The King James version 1611 showed the truth because it is neutral.

 

[RegisterNow]

Yes, physically and literally. Sedimentary rock layers in the Grand Canyon and elsewhere around the world were formed by this flood, the clean, sharp lines indicate they were formed very rapidly. All the ices in the so called "ice age" were frozen flood waters.

The creation, giant and flood narrative is your first test of faith. If you dismiss them as myth, you wouldn't take the rest of the bible seriously either.

 

[Just_A__Follower]

Yes, physically and literally. Sedimentary rock layers in the Grand Canyon and elsewhere around the world were formed by this flood, the clean, sharp lines indicate they were formed very rapidly. All the ices in the so called "ice age" were frozen flood waters.

The creation, giant and flood narrative is your first test of faith. If you dismiss them as myth, you wouldn't take the rest of the bible seriously either.

So you really have to believe every word of the Bible as what literally happened to believe the rest. I find it easy to believe some of the stories are literal and some are metaphorical. There’s no proof that the Grand Canyon was caused by the flood. Also if the ice in Antarctica is made from layers of ices formed over millions of years, not from a single flood. We can’t simply deny physical evidence and science to make our interpretation of the Bible fit the world we see today. We also have to remember that the stories, especially in the old testament, were passed down orally for thousands of years before actually written down.

Do I believe the flood happen? Definitely. There’s stories in every culture around the world of a flood with a single family surviving. Did all those stories come from the same flood? Most likely yes and details changed over time like most stories that are passed down orally.

 

[Gideon300]

So you really have to believe every word of the Bible as what literally happened to believe the rest. I find it easy to believe some of the stories are literal and some are metaphorical. There’s no proof that the Grand Canyon was caused by the flood. Also if the ice in Antarctica is made from layers of ices formed over millions of years, not from a single flood. We can’t simply deny physical evidence and science to make our interpretation of the Bible fit the world we see today. We also have to remember that the stories, especially in the old testament, were passed down orally for thousands of years before actually written down.

Do I believe the flood happen? Definitely. There’s stories in every culture around the world of a flood with a single family surviving. Did all those stories come from the same flood? Most likely yes and details changed over time like most stories that are passed down orally.

I may be naive, but I believe God has the ability to ensure that His word was recorded exactly as He determined it would be. He created all things out of nothing, after all. Oral history was preserved accurately. It was a skill that is lacking these days.

"Proof" is not possible with historical science. However, it is possible to infer to the best explanation. I've been to the Grand Canyon and listened to the guide worshiping at the altar of evolution. Noah's flood is a much better explanation. No one prove it because no one is alive to testify. I could go into why the flood is the best explanation. I can link to a publication that explains it better than I can, if you are interested.

I also believe in gap theory, aka the pre-Adamic creation. Again, no one alive was a witness so proof is not possible. However, I do believe that the Bible implies it and the text allows for it.

Who decides how old things are? Science assumes that everything in history is linear. Has the speed of light always been the same? We don't know. Dating is fraught with problems. If the choice is between God's word and secular science, I choose God's word every time.

 

[Just_A__Follower]

I may be naive, but I believe God has the ability to ensure that His word was recorded exactly as He determined it would be. He created all things out of nothing, after all. Oral history was preserved accurately. It was a skill that is lacking these days.

"Proof" is not possible with historical science. However, it is possible to infer to the best explanation. I've been to the Grand Canyon and listened to the guide worshiping at the altar of evolution. Noah's flood is a much better explanation. No one prove it because no one is alive to testify. I could go into why the flood is the best explanation. I can link to a publication that explains it better than I can, if you are interested.

I also believe in gap theory, aka the pre-Adamic creation. Again, no one alive was a witness so proof is not possible. However, I do believe that the Bible implies it and the text allows for it.

Who decides how old things are? Science assumes that everything in history is linear. Has the speed of light always been the same? We don't know. Dating is fraught with problems. If the choice is between God's word and secular science, I choose God's word every time.

I’ve watched, read, and listened to many let’s say biblical explanations of how the flood created the Grand Canyon. Just makes more sense to me that it was made over time. Our dating methods definitely have flaws but I believe the flaws would cause more of a few percent plus or minus on the dates, not a 90% offset.

I was really big into apologetics when I first became a Christian looking for a biblical explanation of everything I saw, hoping to prove the scientists wrong. I guess it was because I used to be on the other side as an atheist hoping to prove the Christian’s wrong. Bout drove myself crazy. After accepting that the Bible doesn’t have to be 100% correct for me to have faith, I’m not driving myself crazy anymore.

I see the Bible as what it is, many books put together by humans. God didn’t decide which books went into it. If He did there would be one version. The Catholics, Ethiopians and Protestants would all contain the same books. No one would know who Martin Luther is today. He also didn’t write the books nor translate the books. I’m ok with the Bible being imperfect. I haven’t found anything in it that claims it to be perfect.

 

[Gideon300]

I’ve watched, read, and listened to many let’s say biblical explanations of how the flood created the Grand Canyon. Just makes more sense to me that it was made over time. Our dating methods definitely have flaws but I believe the flaws would cause more of a few percent plus or minus on the dates, not a 90% offset.

I was really big into apologetics when I first became a Christian looking for a biblical explanation of everything I saw, hoping to prove the scientists wrong. I guess it was because I used to be on the other side as an atheist hoping to prove the Christian’s wrong. Bout drove myself crazy. After accepting that the Bible doesn’t have to be 100% correct for me to have faith, I’m not driving myself crazy anymore.

I see the Bible as what it is, many books put together by humans. God didn’t decide which books went into it. If He did there would be one version. The Catholics, Ethiopians and Protestants would all contain the same books. No one would know who Martin Luther is today. He also didn’t write the books nor translate the books. I’m ok with the Bible being imperfect. I haven’t found anything in it that claims it to be perfect.

You doubt the ability of God to ensure that His word is exactly as He wants it to be? You then must decide what is true and what is error. Good luck with that.

The Grand Canyon consists of vast amounts of sedimentary layers. If they were deposited over millions of year, then there would be evidence of life between the layers. There is none. A similar phenomenon to the Grand Canyon formation can be seen as a result of the Mt St Helens eruption. Sediment layers formed very quickly. Because the layers are soft to begin with, a fast moving river would cut through very easily. I believe that the river was formed as the waters drained into the ocean. The ocean floor collapsed in many places because of the weight of the water.

You can do a simple experiment yourself. Get a large glass container, or a small fish tank and half fill it with water. Get some dirt and stir it in, enough to get to about 1/3 of the glass container. Stir it thoroughly. Leave it for a time. It will settle into layers according to the weight of the particles. And that is exactly how the Grand Canyon was formed, so I believe.

 

[GRACE_ambassador]

God didn’t decide which books went into it. If He did there would be one version.

This may be informational, I don't know?:

Where Is God's Word Today?

Amen.

 

[Just_A__Follower]

You doubt the ability of God to ensure that His word is exactly as He wants it to be? You then must decide what is true and what is error. Good luck with that.

The Grand Canyon consists of vast amounts of sedimentary layers. If they were deposited over millions of year, then there would be evidence of life between the layers. There is none. A similar phenomenon to the Grand Canyon formation can be seen as a result of the Mt St Helens eruption. Sediment layers formed very quickly. Because the layers are soft to begin with, a fast moving river would cut through very easily. I believe that the river was formed as the waters drained into the ocean. The ocean floor collapsed in many places because of the weight of the water.

You can do a simple experiment yourself. Get a large glass container, or a small fish tank and half fill it with water. Get some dirt and stir it in, enough to get to about 1/3 of the glass container. Stir it thoroughly. Leave it for a time. It will settle into layers according to the weight of the particles. And that is exactly how the Grand Canyon was formed, so I believe.

Do I doubt that God wanted there to be hundreds of versions just in the English language alone let alone the versions in the other thousand languages it’s translated to? yes I doubt that God did that. I doubt that He wanted His word to be unclear enough that His church would break up into 1000’s of different denominations that can’t agree with each other. I doubt that He wanted the meaning of His word to be based upon our flawed opinions and interpretations. I just can’t bring myself to believe that the Bible is inerrant and perfect when it was written, edited, translated, and brought together by a bunch of flawed humans. It’s not God that I have trouble trusting, it’s people like me.

If it is, which versions in which language? I generally use nkjv, esv, niv, and jps tanakh, along with a few dictionaries and sites for translating. I wrote a couple verses into my esv today that were in other versions but not the esv.

I feel like I watched the exact same documentary about the Grand Canyon and mt st Helen’s. The thing is is that there are fossils throughout the layers of the Grand Canyon. But it’s mostly sea crustaceans and sponges etc. things you would expect to see on the sea floor just as we see on mountain tops. The Bible does say that it was all covered by water before He raised the land. If the canyon was caused by the flood I would expect to see human and large fossils within the rock. That’s one of the reasons I believe in prior creations before us. Also a dark void earth between creations would explain the great unconformity in the canyon.

 

[tourist]

I see the Bible as what it is, many books put together by humans. God didn’t decide which books went into it.

Actually God did decide. Those that wrote the books of the bible were inspired and compelled by the Holy Spirit to write what they did write.

 

[Just_A__Follower]

This may be informational, I don't know?:

Where Is God's Word Today?

Amen.

80 pages. Ouch. I’ll try to give it a read. I’m always open to learn something new. Almost lost me on the cover page though

“A Biblical Proof of the Definitive
Authority of the King James Bible”.

I’ve never understood the big deal with the KJV. I mean it’s not the original language and just a translation as many others that we have today. I prefer to read modern English instead of having to retranslate from 17th century English. But let’s say that the KJV is the authoritative version of that means that none of the other versions are authoritative which means most Christian’s are reading the wrong Bible. Or what if the nasb is the authoritative version. That would mean that the KJV isn’t. I mean they can’t all be right can they? If they are then are all denominations right also? I find the simpler solution is to say that none are 100% right, versions nor denominations.

Sometimes I wonder if they left the part out where Jesus went over doctrine, hermeneutics, and theology with the thief on the cross before they broke his knees.

 

[Just_A__Follower]

Actually God did decide. Those that wrote the books of the bible were inspired and compelled by the Holy Spirit to write what they did write.

I don’t doubt that they were inspired by the Spirit to write them. We see the same today with artists writing music, poetry, and books. Does the fact that they were inspired by the spirit mean that they all of sudden became flawless? I believe not. I know that having the Spirit inside me has not made me perfect.

 

[GRACE_ambassador]

80 pages. Ouch. I’ll try to give it a read. I’m always open to learn something new.

I mean they can’t all be right can they?

Correct! If I don't have 'the one that is Right', then I will Certainly Be Absolutely UNable to
to "obey any of The Following", Correct?:

Handling The Word Of Life!

Much Shorter = only Five Pages!!

Amen.

 

[Just_A__Follower]

Correct! If I don't have 'the one that is Right', then I will Certainly Be Absolutely UNable to
to "obey any of The Following", Correct?:

Handling The Word Of Life!

Much Shorter = only Five Pages!!

Amen.

So you’re 100% sure that the KJV is the correct version? With or without the apocrypha?

 

[GRACE_ambassador]

So you’re 100% sure that the KJV is the correct version? With or without the apocrypha?

Precious friend, I believe I have "done my due diligence" and am ready for The Bema Seat
Judgment Where I will humbly "give account" for my own decision in the matter.

My study shows that the apocrypha is Very lacking in Inspired Phrases like: "Thus Saith The
Lord" and similar. There are also things written that Plainly Contradict The Authorized Version.

Thus I believe these are the sufficient reasons the KJV translators "left them Out!"

Amen, and Grace and Peace...