Can We Really Exercise Free Will?

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Guess you just don't believe/trust in Christ as the Savior who saves sent by God for that exact purpose. Very odd for a Christian to believe that and to admit to it.

What I know scripture does not any way teach is >>>> regeneration (being justified and sanctified) before faith/belief, does not happen.

But with bad hermeneutics and cherry picked verses sadly TULIP stays in their brain, for those who want a god of favoritism when it works in their favor of course.
 
What I know scripture does not any way teach is >>>> regeneration (being justified and sanctified) before faith/belief, does not happen.

But with bad hermeneutics and cherry picked verses sadly TULIP stays in their brain, for those who want a god of favoritism when it works in their favor of course.

By that statement, you demonstrate that your trust is in man's work for salvation and not the Savior's - once again, denying Him.
You should go back to scripture, read, and learn about Him.
 
What I know scripture does not any way teach is >>>>
Scripture says, the world cannot receive the spirit of truth. Your view is, it can. Scripture says the man of flesh (unregenerated) cannot submit to or obey God. Your view, and the view of free willers, is he can. Scripture says the natural man cannot receive the spiritual things of God. Your view, and the view of free willers, is, he can. Scripture says the natural man cannot understand the spiritual things of God. Your view, and the view of free willers, is, he can. Scripture says a bad tree cannot bring forth good fruit. Your view, and the view of free willers, is, it can. Scripture says the natural man is opposed to the spiritual things of God. Your view, and the view of free willers, is, he is not. Scripture says the gospel is hid. Your view is, the gospel is not hid. Jesus said not everyone hears. Your view is, everyone hears. Scripture says flesh serves the law of sin and brings forth fruit unto death. Your view is, the flesh can choose to make a decision a plethora of Scriptures say it cannot, to please God and bring forth fruit unto life. Scripture says the devil has taken people captive to do his will. Your view, and the view of free willers, is, man has a will that is free. Scripture says no man can come to God unless God draws them. Your view is, divine intervention is not necessary. Your view is, man has everything he needs to come to believe. Scripture makes plain certain things are only known through the Spirit and revelation which you continually denigrate. Scripture shows over and over again from Genesis all the way through to Revelation that God reveals Himself differently from one person to the next. Your view is, God is unfair if He were to reveal Himself in any way differently from one person to the next. Your view is those you disagree with should preach in cemeteries, then you lie about conflating spiritual death with physical death. Your view is to not only blaspheme God yourself, but agree with those who blaspheme God in other ways. Along with other free willers, you come across as despising God's sovereignty, and call Him doing things for His own purposes doing them "for no good reason." No matter how you look at it, your theological stance on this issue directly contradicts and outright denies what the Bible explicitly articulates in a number of places, and you are not likely to change it any time soon because to bring your view into line with what Scripture actually teaches would bring your whole house of cards down, and demolish your vain self-exalting stance. You cannot have that, since you are far too attached to your ear-tickling doctrine. One could even say you were in love with it. You certainly love it more than the Truth of Scripture.

You misrepresent Scripture so very often, and not only Scripture, but the views of others, your own self, and also the record of history, because you love your logical fallacies as much as your falsehoods. And we have never seen you beg forgiveness for your repeated false depictions of what the Bile says, as you claim those you oppose should do, or even for blaspheming God, which you have done a number of times... no apologies there, no begging forgiveness, not even saying you should not have said the things you have, no acknowledgement that you are so glaringly obviously wrong one could be excused for thinking you had not even ever read the Bible to begin with before making your proclamations. No, instead you claim you are defending God's character, even as you support others who shamelessly blaspheme God. When you are corrected, when you contradict and deny what the Bible explicitly articulates, and it is pointed out to you again and again what it actually says, you simply repeat what you have been saying all along, and tell us relevant verses have been taken out of context, and that parallel verses are irrelevant. You and your Pelagian heretic buddies contradict and outright deny much of what is explicitly stated.
 
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What I know scripture does not any way teach is >>>> regeneration (being justified and sanctified) before faith/belief, does not happen.

But with bad hermeneutics and cherry picked verses sadly TULIP stays in their brain, for those who want a god of favoritism when it works in their favor of course.
Regenerated doesn't mean being justified and sanctified.
 
Regenerated doesn't mean being justified and sanctified.
People conflate much, like this whole topic: many believe man having volition means his will is free.

They are deceived. No two ways about it. Scripture makes plain man's will is not free.

Uh, for those with eyes to see, that is. And ears to hear.

And Jesus said, not all do.

I believe Him.
 
What I know scripture does not any way teach is >>>> regeneration (being justified and sanctified) before faith/belief, does not happen.

But with bad hermeneutics and cherry picked verses sadly TULIP stays in their brain, for those who want a god of favoritism when it works in their favor of course.

That says a lot both about your knowledge of scripture and your ability to correctly interpret it. We have been posting verses
that say exactly that but which you are unable to comprehend.
 
Scripture says, the world cannot receive the spirit of truth. Your view is, it can. Scripture says the man of flesh (unregenerated) cannot submit to or obey God. Your view, and the view of free willers, is he can. Scripture says the natural man cannot receive the spiritual things of God. Your view, and the view of free willers, is, he can. Scripture says the natural man cannot understand the spiritual things of God. Your view, and the view of free willers, is, he can. Scripture says a bad tree cannot bring forth good fruit. Your view, and the view of free willers, is, it can. Scripture says the natural man is opposed to the spiritual things of God. Your view, and the view of free willers, is, he is not. Scripture says the gospel is hid. Your view is, the gospel is not hid. Jesus said not everyone hears. Your view is, everyone hears. Scripture says flesh serves the law of sin and brings forth fruit unto death. Your view is, the flesh can choose to make a decision a plethora of Scriptures say it cannot, to please God and bring forth fruit unto life. Scripture says the devil has taken people captive to do his will. Your view, and the view of free willers, is, man has a will that is free. Scripture says no man can come to God unless God draws them. Your view is, divine intervention is not necessary. Your view is, man has everything he needs to come to believe. Scripture makes plain certain things are only known through the Spirit and revelation which you continually denigrate. Scripture shows over and over again from Genesis all the way through to Revelation that God reveals Himself differently from one person to the next. Your view is, God is unfair if He were to reveal Himself in any way differently from one person to the next. Your view is those you disagree with should preach in cemeteries, then you lie about conflating spiritual death with physical death. Your view is to not only blaspheme God yourself, but agree with those who blaspheme God in other ways. Along with other free willers, you come across as despising God's sovereignty, and call Him doing things for His own purposes doing them "for no good reason." No matter how you look at it, your theological stance on this issue directly contradicts and outright denies what the Bible explicitly articulates in a number of places, and you are not likely to change it any time soon because to bring your view into line with what Scripture actually teaches would bring your whole house of cards down, and demolish your vain self-exalting stance. You cannot have that, since you are far too attached to your ear-tickling doctrine. One could even say you were in love with it. You certainly love it more than the Truth of Scripture.

You misrepresent Scripture so very often, and not only Scripture, but the views of others, your own self, and also the record of history, because you love your logical fallacies as much as your falsehoods. And we have never seen you beg forgiveness for your repeated false depictions of what the Bile says, as you claim those you oppose should do, or even for blaspheming God, which you have done a number of times... no apologies there, no begging forgiveness, not even saying you should not have said the things you have, no acknowledgement that you are so glaringly obviously wrong one could be excused for thinking you had not even ever read the Bible to begin with before making your proclamations. No, instead you claim you are defending God's character, even as you support others who shamelessly blaspheme God. When you are corrected, when you contradict and deny what the Bible explicitly articulates, and it is pointed out to you again and again what it actually says, you simply repeat what you have been saying all along, and tell us relevant verses have been taken out of context, and that parallel verses are irrelevant. You and your Pelagian heretic buddies contradict and outright deny much of what is explicitly stated.

Excellent, Magenta!
 
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Einstein plagiarized Poincare and Lorentz, conjured up a few math tricks to replace the aether with curved spacetime, and his theories are at odds with objective observable reality.

“Einstein's relativity work is a magnificent mathematical garb which fascinates, dazzles and makes people blind to the underlying errors. The theory is like a beggar clothed in purple whom ignorant people take for a king... its exponents are brilliant men but they are metaphysicists rather than scientists.”

- Nikola Tesla

Translate: I have no clue about what I wrote yesterday re Lucifer. :rolleyes:
 
You know my preferred responses are short and to the point, but these FWers make so many
false claims that enumerating them is quite an exercise and turns into a very long post!

Yes, I know, but it was great - you laid it all out - and there's no way they can refute it - well, no doubt they will try in their perverted way, but the facts will stand. Thanks for posting.
 
Yes, I know, but it was great - you laid it all out - and there's no way they can refute it - well,
no doubt they will try in their perverted way, but the facts will stand. Thanks for posting.
Thank you, Roger, and you are welcome.

Well we know that denial is their main suit.
 
Yes you are so very special, chosen by god for salvation. :rolleyes:
Thats quite rude, the truth is the darkness that exists in all people would win unless the light overcomes the darkness in people,

I wonder why none of you people advocating for free will here, can take any inclination to the fact God has to choose to make his light be known in people's hearts in everyone before saving them them And he has to choose to make people believe,

You insult the very thing that God does not what Roger is saying.
 
You can't talk about salvation without Jesus's sacrifice. It is you that keeps trying to take Jesus's sacrifice out of the equation and make it all about me. I am putting Jesus's sacrifice above all and anything I do or do not believe in, because it is His sacrifice that gives me anything to believe or not believe in.

Do you really put "Jesus' sacrifice above all..."? There are FWers in this thread who believe that God's skin coverings in the Garden that He provided to A&E represents an efficacious work of atonement. Do you believe that Christ's atoning work on the Cross was efficacious for all those for whom He died?
 
If belief ain't from the heart, it ain't.

[Rom 10:10 KJV] 10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

@HeIsHere

And it is God alone who changes the heart, so to have true belief, the heart must first have been changed by Him, which only occurs as a result of salvation, not before. So, these verses, in addition to many other verses, demonstrates that salvation must occur before belief.

[Jer 17:9 KJV] 9 The heart [is] deceitful above all [things], and desperately wicked: who can know it?

[Eze 36:26 KJV] 26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.
 
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well for arguments sake if your continuously citing scripture against her, and if you have for along time, how is she suppose to feel when thats all that many other people do,

Are you any different in that score ?
folks are here discussing Scripture ... not "continuously citing scripture against" Magenta (or anyone else for that matter) ...

It may be that the Bible Discussion Forum is not a good place for those who find the discussion upsetting ... or get their feelings hurt to the point that they say things they ought not to say.

and let's take your opinion above ... for arguments sake if Magenta is continuously citing Scripture against [fill in the blank], and if Magenta has for a long time, how is [fill in the blank] suppose to feel when that's all that many other people do.

Those who are strong in the Lord clothe themselves with the whole armor of God in order to stand and withstand against the wiles of the devil ... God protects believers ... and God is much better at protecting believers than I or you ...

Ephesians 6:10-14

10 Finally, my brethren, be strong in the Lord, and in the power of his might.

11 Put on the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil.

12 For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.

13 Wherefore take unto you the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to withstand in the evil day, and having done all, to stand.

14 Stand therefore, having your loins girt about with truth, and having on the breastplate of righteousness;

15 And your feet shod with the preparation of the gospel of peace;

16 Above all, taking the shield of faith, wherewith ye shall be able to quench all the fiery darts of the wicked.

17 And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God




Jordon said:
I get the impression your not, and you feel just as obliged to call people out as she does, so really the bottom line here is, if she's upset you, you've more than made your point by now,
are you her ambassador? ... Magenta can clear the matter up herself ... she can PM me if she does not want to deal with the issue in the open forum ... or better yet, resist the urge to lie about others ... if she is upset over something posted by someone, walk away until she is again at peace in her heart.





Jordon said:
But by the looks of things you've also upset her.
please provide the post submitted by me wherein I've "upset" Magenta. If I lied or falsely accused her, I will apologize.


However, in her post wherein she claimed I "entered the thread breathing lies and falsely accusing", she flat out told me not to "expect [her] to try to find all [my] lies" ...

how convenient ... lie about someone, then tell the person not to expect them to provide any proof corroborating their lie.




Jordon said:
And I know with some people depending on how you upset that person, depends on how they react, maybe you've upset some of her friends as well.
does that apply only to me? does that not apply to you, to Magenta, to her friends?


look through the pages of this thread ... there are pages and pages of slurs against fellow believers ...

James 3:2-10

2 For in many things we offend all. If any man offend not in word, the same is a perfect man, and able also to bridle the whole body.

3 Behold, we put bits in the horses' mouths, that they may obey us; and we turn about their whole body.

4 Behold also the ships, which though they be so great, and are driven of fierce winds, yet are they turned about with a very small helm, whithersoever the governor listeth.

5 Even so the tongue is a little member, and boasteth great things. Behold, how great a matter a little fire kindleth!

6 And the tongue is a fire, a world of iniquity: so is the tongue among our members, that it defileth the whole body, and setteth on fire the course of nature; and it is set on fire of hell.

7 For every kind of beasts, and of birds, and of serpents, and of things in the sea, is tamed, and hath been tamed of mankind:

8 But the tongue can no man tame; it is an unruly evil, full of deadly poison.

9 Therewith bless we God, even the Father; and therewith curse we men, which are made after the similitude of God.

10 Out of the same mouth proceedeth blessing and cursing. My brethren, these things ought not so to be.


is it okay to treat others poorly as long as we don't upset Magenta and her friends? is that what you're saying Jordon? I do not believe so, but asking because thus far you have not acknowledged that behavior which is unbecoming occurs on both sides.




Jordon said:
But your not taking any notice to seriousness of her faith being deliberately miss represented.
again, it goes both ways, Jordon. Do you deny that?





Jordon said:
You haven't acknowledged that I asked you the question and you took it personally again, which suggests you are a bit to sensitive at times.
Have you read the first 10 posts I submitted in this thread? ... did I lie? ... did I falsely accuse?


who is the father of lies, Jordon ...

.
 
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Do you really put "Jesus' sacrifice above all..."? There are FWers in this thread who believe that God's skin coverings in the Garden that He provided to A&E represents an efficacious work of atonement. Do you believe that Christ's atoning work on the Cross was efficacious for all those for whom He died?

I can see the similarities that an animal had to die to cover thier nakedness. It was in fact the first sacrafice that tought blood is the only way to cover sin. In this case thier embarrassing nakedness. And that the blood had to be sinless. Which animals by thier nature are.

Christ sacrifice on the cross was sufficient for every many woman and child in the world if that is how it would of ended up working. However it dosent. So it is sufficient to whosoever calls on his name. Whether that be 10 people or 10 billion.
 
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God's skin coverings in the Garden that He provided to A&E represents an efficacious work of atonement.
not the coats ... the sacrifice of the animal from which the coats were made ... without shedding of blood is no remission ... the coats covered their shame.

.
 
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