Loss of salvation???

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The confusion is loss of salvation.

We have 100+ verses that clearly and succinctly state our eternal security.

The loss of salvation crowd throws em all to the curb and tries to build a doctrine on the verses that confuse or "scare" them.

I guess maybe that's what it boils down to. Some people just don't receive and know the spirit of the fear of the lord, so they aren't afraid to wander off into whatever beliefs tickle their fancy.

The fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom: and the knowledge of the holy is understanding. Proverbs 9:10
Wherefore we labour, that, whether present or absent, we may be accepted of him. For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad. Knowing therefore the fear of the Lord, we persuade men; but we are made manifest unto God; and I trust also are made manifest in your consciences. 2 Corinthians 5:9-11
 
If the shoe fits, wear it

"[The Valentinian gnostics] hold that they shall be entirely and undoubtedly saved, not by means of conduct, but because they are spiritual by nature. For, just as it is impossible that material substance should partake of salvation (since, indeed, they maintain that it is incapable of receiving it), so again it is impossible that spiritual substance (by which they mean themselves) should ever come under the power of corruption, whatever the sort of actions in which they indulged. For even as gold, when submersed in filth, loses not on that account its beauty, but retains its own native qualities, the filth having no power to injure the gold, so they affirm that they cannot in any measure suffer hurt, or lose their spiritual substance, whatever the material actions in which they may be involved.' Against Heresies. Book, Chapter 6, paragraph 2​
We will never perish. We will never, no not ever come into condemnation. We have eternal life. We have Christ in us.

Loss of salvation dishonors God and makes Him out to be a liar.

1 John 5
10The one who believes in the Son of God has the testimony in himself; the one who does not believe God has made Him a liar, because he has not believed in the testimony that God has given concerning His Son. 11And the testimony is this, that God has given us eternal life, and this life is in His Son. 12The one who has the Son has the life; the one who does not have the Son of God does not have the life.
 
I want to build the case that NT Greek linguistic construct is the root of Christian confusion, because it subtly shifts emphasis away from Christ crucified, “For I determined not to know anything among you except Jesus Christ and Him crucified” (1 Corinthians 2:2) and reframes it into the bastardised, heretical doctrine of “Christ Plus.”

Matthew’s “obey the Pharisees” vs Moses, and 1 John’s “Word” vs “Son,” together with the New Testament’s inherently Hebraic linguistic construct (Galatians 1:6–7) should give every believer pause to consider that Greek (contrary to the consensus view) is a translation of an earlier Hebraic New Testament, one likely buried, burned, or lost over the centuries.

These disconnects are not minor translation slips; they divert Western theology from its covenantal roots and overlay it with Greek meism qualifiers, presenting an alien Gospel that first‑century Jewish believers would have rejected"(2 Corinthians 11:4).

Greek has so thoroughly distorted the Gospel of Christ Crucified into a foreign, me‑centric gospel, where salvation rests not on Christ’s finished work but on us (our obedience).

No wonder Christians are so confused: their inner witness affirms that salvation is a free gift from our Father in Heaven, yet the doctrines of men muddy minds into believing they must be faithful, remain faithful, and endure to the end to receive the Salvation that God alone initiated and accomplished at Calvary.

No one ever merited Salvation; so the Good News is all ungodly men were gifted Salvation.

From the beginning, God’s Word has been distorted by subtle additions: Adam’s hedge (Genesis 3:3), the Pharisees’ fences (Mark 7:8–9), the serpent’s “not” (Genesis 3:4), and Greek’s covenant distortion; framed as conditional on man’s faith, belief, and endurance.

“God makes” versus “God cuts” a covenant is another example of a subtle shift in meaning: the Western Greek view implies a legal, contractual agreement entered into by man, while the Hebraic view is that God unilaterally cuts a covenant (Genesis 15:18), showing that it is not merely a contractual agreement but His sacred, sacrificial, and irrevocable oath.

In the Hebraic mind, “cutting” a covenant is radically different from “making” one because it’s about sealing a sacred, blood‑bound relationship that cannot be undone.

God initiated His unilateral redemptive plan after the fall of Adam by cutting the Edenic covenant (Genesis 3:15), He promised the Seed of the woman would crush the serpent’s head. In God’s mind, Christ was crucified from the foundation of the world (Revelation 13:8), meaning salvation from the Beginning was never contingent on men but on God; and His redemptive plan was finally Finished at Calvary.

The True Gospel is this: God saved us because He promised-Christ crucified (1 Corinthians 2:2).

Adam and Eve did not “believe” or “accept” the promise for it to be true; it was God's unilateral Covenantal work. Faith, belief, and endurance are gifts produced by God, not prerequisites for salvation.

Greek distorts the pure Gospel. Salvation is not “offered” or “conditional”, it is Finished and Gifted to us Freely by God’s Covenantal Love, Grace and Mercy, without any human (Greek) qualifiers at the cross.

The True Gospel is as follows:

Christ Alone = Christ Crucified = Atonement = Justification = Sanctification = Glorification

Greek skewed minds cannot accept the True Gospel because theirs is a foreign Gospel, one contrary to “Christ crucified”.

Christ Alone + Nothing…
 
We will never perish. We will never, no not ever come into condemnation. We have eternal life. We have Christ in us.

Loss of salvation dishonors God and makes Him out to be a liar.

1 John 5
10The one who believes in the Son of God has the testimony in himself; the one who does not believe God has made Him a liar, because he has not believed in the testimony that God has given concerning His Son. 11And the testimony is this, that God has given us eternal life, and this life is in His Son. 12The one who has the Son has the life; the one who does not have the Son of God does not have the life.

Amen..to what you said to CRFTD
 
202 pages of milk-fed baby Christians who can’t get past Salvation. It’s like a toddler still trying to jump back in his mother’s womb every chance he gets.

Move on! My Gosh! You’re saved stupid! Now get on with it!
 
202 pages of milk-fed baby Christians who can’t get past Salvation. It’s like a toddler still trying to jump back in his mother’s womb every chance he gets.

Move on! My Gosh! You’re saved stupid! Now get on with it!

Can't argue with you...simple yet profound one liner that gets to the point!
 
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Grace is only received through faith

For by grace you are saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Ephesians 2:8

The issue was not how grace is received, the issue is what sustains us in our salvation and as it says, faith is a gift for it comes form the word. The power of faith lies solely in God. We do not have the power within ourselves to either obtain or sustain salvation.

2 Corinthians 12:9
And He said to me, “My grace is sufficient for you, for My strength is made perfect in weakness.” Therefore most gladly I will rather boast in my infirmities, that the power of Christ may rest upon me.
 
If the shoe fits, wear it

"[The Valentinian gnostics] hold that they shall be entirely and undoubtedly saved, not by means of conduct, but because they are spiritual by nature. For, just as it is impossible that material substance should partake of salvation (since, indeed, they maintain that it is incapable of receiving it), so again it is impossible that spiritual substance (by which they mean themselves) should ever come under the power of corruption, whatever the sort of actions in which they indulged. For even as gold, when submersed in filth, loses not on that account its beauty, but retains its own native qualities, the filth having no power to injure the gold, so they affirm that they cannot in any measure suffer hurt, or lose their spiritual substance, whatever the material actions in which they may be involved.' Against Heresies. Book, Chapter 6, paragraph 2​

Then you would be wrong to think @Kroogz believes that nonsense.

Our means of conduct shall most definitely affect our salvation from evil.
 
𝙄 𝙙𝙤𝙣'𝙩 𝙠𝙣𝙤𝙬 𝙩𝙝𝙚 𝙥𝙥𝙚𝙧𝙛𝙚𝙘𝙩 𝙥𝙡𝙖𝙘𝙚 𝙩𝙤 𝙨𝙖𝙮 𝙩𝙝𝙞𝙨, 𝙗𝙪𝙩 𝙩𝙝𝙚 𝙎𝙥𝙞𝙧𝙞𝙩 𝙝𝙖𝙨 𝙨𝙩𝙧𝙤𝙣𝙜𝙡𝙮 𝙘𝙤𝙣𝙛𝙞𝙧𝙢𝙣𝙚𝙙 𝙞𝙣 𝙢𝙚 𝙩𝙝𝙖𝙩 𝙬𝙝𝙚𝙣 𝙩𝙩𝙝𝙚 𝙖𝙣𝙩𝙞𝙘𝙝𝙧𝙞𝙨𝙩 𝙩𝙖𝙠𝙚𝙨 𝙩𝙝𝙚 𝙨𝙚𝙖𝙩 𝙞𝙣 𝙩𝙝𝙚 𝙩𝙚𝙢𝙥𝙡𝙚, 𝙝𝙚 𝙬𝙞𝙡𝙡 𝙛𝙤𝙤𝙡 𝙢𝙖𝙣𝙮 (𝙖𝙣𝙙 𝙩𝙝𝙞𝙨 𝙞𝙨 𝙬𝙝𝙚𝙧𝙚 𝙚𝙫𝙚𝙣 𝙩𝙝𝙚 𝙚𝙡𝙚𝙘𝙩 𝙬𝙞𝙡𝙡 𝙬𝙤𝙣𝙙𝙚𝙧) 𝙬𝙬𝙞𝙩𝙝 𝙩𝙚𝙘𝙝𝙣𝙤𝙡𝙤𝙜𝙮 𝙩𝙝𝙖𝙩 𝙝𝙖𝙨 𝙗𝙚𝙚𝙣 𝙠𝙚𝙥𝙩 𝙛𝙧𝙤𝙢 𝙩𝙩𝙝𝙚 𝙥𝙤𝙥𝙪𝙡𝙪𝙨.
�𝙎𝙤𝙧𝙧𝙮, 𝙟𝙟𝙪𝙨𝙩 𝙬𝙖𝙣𝙩𝙚𝙙 𝙩𝙤 𝙜𝙚𝙩 𝙩𝙝𝙖𝙩 𝙤𝙪𝙩 𝙩𝙝𝙚𝙧𝙚 𝙚𝙫𝙚𝙣 𝙩𝙝𝙤𝙪𝙜𝙝 𝙞𝙩𝙨 𝙤𝙪𝙩 𝙤𝙛 𝙥𝙡𝙖𝙘𝙚. 𝙋𝙡𝙚𝙖𝙨𝙚 𝙞𝙣𝙛𝙤𝙧𝙢 𝙖𝙨 𝙢𝙖𝙣𝙮 𝙖𝙨 𝙮𝙤𝙪 𝙖𝙧𝙚 𝙖𝙗𝙡𝙚.
𝙩𝙝𝙖𝙣𝙠𝙨
𝙖𝙣𝙙 𝙖𝙜𝙖𝙞𝙣, 𝙄 𝙖𝙥𝙤𝙡𝙤𝙜𝙞𝙯𝙚.
 
The issue was not how grace is received, the issue is what sustains us in our salvation and as it says, faith is a gift for it comes form the word. The power of faith lies solely in God. We do not have the power within ourselves to either obtain or sustain salvation.

2 Corinthians 12:9
And He said to me, “My grace is sufficient for you, for My strength is made perfect in weakness.” Therefore most gladly I will rather boast in my infirmities, that the power of Christ may rest upon me.

Faith doesn't have power. It enables us to receive and live by the spirit which is the power and life of God.
 
Hebrews 11:1
Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.

If you think you can generate that sort of certainty from within yourself and that it is not powerful?

Faith is being persuaded that the words God speaks are true and placing one's confidence in and ordering one's life around them. So there is no power in faith; the power is in God's persuasion through his holy spirit to place our confidence in him.
 
I think God's command to believe in the name of His Son Jesus Christ can save men who obey God by believing His command to believe in the name of His Son 1John3:23a.

Believing with all one has in God and loving one's neighbor as self, yes. We all agree with that as the fulfillment of all the Law. No problem there. The issue at hand is when one erroneously thinks we can live those perfectly.

On the one hand, most professing believers admit that we can't live the Law perfectly as did Jesus, but then they turn right around and pretend as though they can and are living "perfectly enough" the first two Jesus stated as being the fulfillment of all the Law, and assume that Jesus was implying that we can live those two perfectly enough to be a satisfaction to God...no. That's not in the words Jesus spoke. THAT is the error in some people's understanding.

TRUE salvation is believing in the death, burial and resurrection of Christ Jesus on the third day (1 Cor. 15: 1-4), THAT is the truth that brings about the unmerited favor, grace, upon the one who sets their faith squarely upon those facts, which go beyond just mere belief in the existence of Christ and His name. It's about what He accomplished for us to redeem us from the guilt of our sin, for the strength of sin is the Law, the commands, and so that power of sin is shattered through that faith in what He accomplished, with Him doing the rest by placing His favor upon those who did not at all merit such.

Sadly, the vagabonds out there, in an attempt to paint with negative colors and stripes as a tool to more effectively sway to their side the weak minds of those who don't believe Paul's gospel, all in trying to make their prideful and legalistic beliefs more credible with the weak-minded, they succeed in continuing to replicate the confusions in those people's minds and beliefs. They duplicate themselves to keep the false narratives flowing, even though they do so in ignorance.

I've said many times that we should all seek to adhere to the moral commands Christ and His disciples stated, but not all that they stated and commanded were for us today, as you know. Water baptism is one of those that went by the wayside with the fall of Israel that some today still think is a requirement upon us as the means for the remission of sins for those who have that ability to fulfill. No. That is utterly false to those who are saved by grace through faith alone as our remission of sins and saved to the uttermost.

Those out there who believe in works-based salvation, then, to them I say good luck, because they're going to need far more than mere luck...

MM
 
You to a "T."

Disagreement isn't a matter of trashing anyone. That's the weak weapon commonly used by cults and culture out there, labeling anyone who disagrees with them as being perpetrators of character assassination and/or hate. Attacking a belief system and its inherent flaws isn't hate, it's discussion.

MM