Are all the spiritual gifts still active today?

[Lamar]

LOL insults is all you have, But no Biblical refute. Your hate of people you don't even know is remarkable.

He provided three passages that refute the claimed similarities of 1st Century miracles to what is presented today.

Where is your Biblical defense that modern day claims of the supernatural are the same as the 1st Century?

I await your answer.

Also, your mock laughing at people is truly "insulting".

You have much to learn young man.

 

[CS1]

He provided three passages that refute the claimed similarities of 1st Century miracles to what is presented today.

Where is your Biblical defense that modern day claims of the supernatural are the same as the 1st Century?

I await your answer.

Also, your mock laughing at people is truly "insulting".

You have much to learn young man.

Really which ones ? You seem to know again Modern day liberal theologians who rely on Humanistic theology prefer their own understanding over the word of GOD. You say he provided Three passages ? Those three diminished John 1:33 John 14:25-26
Luke 24:20-22 Acts 1:8 1cor chapter 12 through 14.

You have a false narrative. " Where is your Biblical defense that modern day claims of the supernatural are the same as the 1st Century?"

The same GOD, The same Lord , and the Same Holy Spirit. God is recorded in the Old Testament of doing healing and Recorded by Eye witnesses in the New Testament doing them. The buffoonery of the comment of modern day claims is laughable.

Where is your Biblical proof of modern day salvation that happen just like they did over two thousands years ago?

how will you provide proof that 3000 salvation happen in one day same as the 1st Century?

your carnal mindset is ridicules. Only salvation happen today ? God doesn't answer prayer of healing anymore in the way he did 2000 years ago?

Where doe it say in the word of GOD that now that we have hospitals and doctors GOD doesn't heal anymore and we should not ask for GOD to heal us?

Modernism and Post Modernism FYI are man take without GOD. Its more atheistic and humanism than Biblical. You would be happier if people would flock to you and your benevolent Wisdom and knowledge. LOL. Nope.

 

[PaulThomson]

Yes, you are correct, but the subject was spiritual gifts, as listed in 1 Corinthians, especially the power gifts, and dreams are not listed there.

There is no evidence of any exhaustive list of spiritual gifts in scripture.

 

[Lamar]

Really which ones ? You seem to know again Modern day liberal theologians who rely on Humanistic theology prefer their own understanding over the word of GOD. You say he provided Three passages ? Those three diminished John 1:33 John 14:25-26
Luke 24:20-22 Acts 1:8 1cor chapter 12 through 14.

You have a false narrative. " Where is your Biblical defense that modern day claims of the supernatural are the same as the 1st Century?"

The same GOD, The same Lord , and the Same Holy Spirit. God is recorded in the Old Testament of doing healing and Recorded by Eye witnesses in the New Testament doing them. The buffoonery of the comment of modern day claims is laughable.

Where is your Biblical proof of modern day salvation that happen just like they did over two thousands years ago?

how will you provide proof that 3000 salvation happen in one day same as the 1st Century?

your carnal mindset is ridicules. Only salvation happen today ? God doesn't answer prayer of healing anymore in the way he did 2000 years ago?

Where doe it say in the word of GOD that now that we have hospitals and doctors GOD doesn't heal anymore and we should not ask for GOD to heal us?

Modernism and Post Modernism FYI are man take without GOD. Its more atheistic and humanism than Biblical. You would be happier if people would flock to you and your benevolent Wisdom and knowledge. LOL. Nope.

You write like an emotional child.

Trust and Obey presented three examples of the differences between 1st Century miracles and modern "miracles".

You simply rant and rave. Where is your Biblical defense of the claims of modern day Pentecostals and Mormons???

No one is denying that the miracles happened in the 1st Century, this is about the claims that are being made today.

Why do you simply attack my motives and not address the differences between the two time periods?

Are you so blind as to not see the difference?

 

[CS1]

You write like an emotional child.

Trust and Obey presented three examples of the differences between 1st Century miracles and modern "miracles".

You simply rant and rave. Where is your Biblical defense of the claims of modern day Pentecostals and Mormons???

No one is denying that the miracles happened in the 1st Century, this is about the claims that are being made today.

Why do you simply attack my motives and not address the differences between the two time periods?

Are you so blind as to not see the difference?

Coming from you I will take that as a compliment. I am not attacking your motives I am responding to your false claims.

I simply provided many text and passages for you too. But you simply rant and rave. Where is your Biblical defense that supports modern day salvations. You say no one is denying that the miracles happened in the 1st century "this is about the claims that are being made today." I want to make sure I understand you, you don't deny what happen in the first century even though you were not there to see them but deny that God of the First Century doesn't heal as many have claimed and witness today?


So, You are the sole authenticator of what GOD does today around the world ? You .... are the authoritative entity that validates

how God answer prayers for healing and salvation?

 

[PaulThomson]

It most certainly is written to the Church, to warn them of the reckless groups that were to come.

Groups that "present themselves as having the physical gifts of God but show no evidence of its power".

In other words, you and the rest of your sordid movement.

All claims but no substance.



It is the liberal mindset that attempts to prove current events by presenting history.

And this is what you are doing.

I notice you use a lot of "LOL" and "hahahaha" I will chalk this up to your youth but it is viewed as condescending to the more mature.

Are you saying that Jackie Pullinger, who gave over 50 years of her life planting the church among criminals in the walled city of Hong Kong, was merely a deceiver in a sordid movement?

 

[PaulThomson]

We were addressing spiritual gifts given to the church and ' divine dreams " are nowhere listed, that I have read.

Surely, God speaking through dreams is a means by which He imparts prophecy, words of wisdom and words of knowledge.

 

[PaulThomson]

The pharisees' blasphemy of the Holy Spirit included, "He casts out demons by the prince of demons".

The modern sceptics' blasphemy of the Holy Spirit includes, " Today's Pentecostals offer stories, sleight of hand and parlor tricks."

Yes, they attributes the work of the Holy Spirit to something profane, reducing the Holy Spirit to something profane. In their case to the devil. In your case to fiction writers, conjurers and tricksters.

 

[studier]

Yes, they attributes the work of the Holy Spirit to something profane, reducing the Holy Spirit to something profane. In their case to the devil. In your case to fiction writers, conjurers and tricksters.

Are you saying there are no such charlatans today or that a work of the Spirit is clear?

 

[Lamar]

Coming from you I will take that as a compliment. I am not attacking your motives I am responding to your false claims.

I simply provided many text and passages for you too. But you simply rant and rave. Where is your Biblical defense that supports modern day salvations. You say no one is denying that the miracles happened in the 1st century "this is about the claims that are being made today." I want to make sure I understand you, you don't deny what happen in the first century even though you were not there to see them but deny that God of the First Century doesn't heal as many have claimed and witness today?


So, You are the sole authenticator of what GOD does today around the world ? You .... are the authoritative entity that validates

how God answer prayers for healing and salvation?

Your immature nature and emotional state are on full display.

I suggest you stop and collect your thoughts. You have no Biblical answer to why modern day "miracles" do not match that of the 1st Century.

Your defense is emotional and not biblical.

 

[Lamar]

Are you saying that Jackie Pullinger, who gave over 50 years of her life planting the church among criminals in the walled city of Hong Kong, was merely a deceiver in a sordid movement?

Are you saying that Mother Teresa, who gave over 50 years of her life serving the poorest of the poor in the slums of Calcutta, was a fraud?

 

[studier]

Are you saying that Mother Teresa, who gave over 50 years of her life serving the poorest of the poor in the slums of Calcutta, was a fraud?

I knew a Messianic Jewish Rabbi who, since she ultimately took people to the Pope, was, let's just say, less than impressed with her.

There are many perspectives now, are there not?

 

[CS1]

Your immature nature and emotional state are on full display.

I suggest you stop and collect your thoughts. You have no Biblical answer to why modern day "miracles" do not match that of the 1st Century.

Your defense is emotional and not biblical.

Thank you. Have nice Thanksgiving to you and your family. Here is more biblical text for the Gifts of the Holy Spirit Found in :

1corinthains chapters 12 through 14. Enjoy. The words of term "Modern day" is not found in the bible.

 

[PaulThomson]

Are you saying that Mother Teresa, who gave over 50 years of her life serving the poorest of the poor in the slums of Calcutta, was a fraud?

No, I am not. Why would you think that.

Did other Theresa have an assurance of her own salvation?

No, Mother Teresa did not have assurance of her salvation and experienced a long period of spiritual darkness, doubt, and "the absence of God" in her private writings. Her correspondence revealed that for decades she felt no presence of God, and she struggled with a crisis of faith, despite her public persona of strong devotion.

• Internal struggle: Her letters described her inner life as a period of "dryness," "darkness," and "loneliness," and at one point she doubted the existence of heaven and God.
• Discrepancy between inner and outer life: She acknowledged that her public smile was a "mask" or "cloak" and that her outward expressions of love for God were not a reflection of her internal reality.
• Self-doubt about faith: Her private writings indicated that she felt she had no faith, even questioning if she was engaging in "verbal deception" when she spoke about her love for God.
• Long-term crisis: These private struggles continued for the last half-century of her life, a stark contrast to her public work and image.

Her Catholic dogma may have crippled her ability to receive God's word properly.

 

[PaulThomson]

No, I am not. Why would you think that.

Did other Theresa have an assurance of her own salvation?

No, Mother Teresa did not have assurance of her salvation and experienced a long period of spiritual darkness, doubt, and "the absence of God" in her private writings. Her correspondence revealed that for decades she felt no presence of God, and she struggled with a crisis of faith, despite her public persona of strong devotion.

• Internal struggle: Her letters described her inner life as a period of "dryness," "darkness," and "loneliness," and at one point she doubted the existence of heaven and God.
• Discrepancy between inner and outer life: She acknowledged that her public smile was a "mask" or "cloak" and that her outward expressions of love for God were not a reflection of her internal reality.
• Self-doubt about faith: Her private writings indicated that she felt she had no faith, even questioning if she was engaging in "verbal deception" when she spoke about her love for God.
• Long-term crisis: These private struggles continued for the last half-century of her life, a stark contrast to her public work and image.

Her Catholic dogma may have crippled her ability to receive God's word properly.

The initial question and the final sentence are my words.
I should have marked the answer to my question as "Google AI overview". My bad.

 

[Lamar]

No, I am not. Why would you think that.

Did other Theresa have an assurance of her own salvation?

No, Mother Teresa did not have assurance of her salvation and experienced a long period of spiritual darkness, doubt, and "the absence of God" in her private writings. Her correspondence revealed that for decades she felt no presence of God, and she struggled with a crisis of faith, despite her public persona of strong devotion.

• Internal struggle: Her letters described her inner life as a period of "dryness," "darkness," and "loneliness," and at one point she doubted the existence of heaven and God.
• Discrepancy between inner and outer life: She acknowledged that her public smile was a "mask" or "cloak" and that her outward expressions of love for God were not a reflection of her internal reality.
• Self-doubt about faith: Her private writings indicated that she felt she had no faith, even questioning if she was engaging in "verbal deception" when she spoke about her love for God.
• Long-term crisis: These private struggles continued for the last half-century of her life, a stark contrast to her public work and image.

Her Catholic dogma may have crippled her ability to receive God's word properly.

Are you not aware that presenting the work of Mother Teresa vs. the work of Jackie Pullinger was to show the foolishness of your defense?

IOW, what does Jackie Pullinger have to do with the similarities or lack of similarities of current claims of supernatural manifestations to 1st Century supernatural manifestations?

Since you like AI to do your research, here is AI's answer to the question.


Are current claims of miracles to same as New Testament miracles?

Here are some key characteristics of the NT miracles and how they are often compared to current claims:

1. Nature and Scale of the Miracles

• NT Miracles: Included instantaneous and complete physical healings of organic diseases, raising the dead (after being deceased for a period), control over nature (calming storms, walking on water), and multiplying food (feeding 5,000). These were often spectacular and undeniable events in the public eye, even acknowledged by opponents.
  • Examples: Healing a man blind from birth (John 9), raising Lazarus after four days (John 11), turning water into wine (John 2).
• Current Claims: Many contemporary claims are often centered on healing, which sometimes involve conditions that are psychological, psychosomatic, or spontaneous remissions that are difficult to verify as supernatural intervention. Claims of NT-scale "nature miracles" (like instantaneously creating food or walking on water) are extremely rare and often lack the same level of widespread, credible, and hostile witness verification found in the NT narratives.

2. Purpose and Function

• NT Purpose: The primary purpose was to authenticate Jesus as the promised Messiah and the coming of the Kingdom of God, and to later validate the message and authority of the Apostles (Acts 2:22; Hebrews 2:4). They served as "signs" pointing to the divine identity of the messenger and the truth of the message. They were also acts of compassion.
• Current Claims: Modern claims are often presented as ongoing acts of God's compassion or a sign of faith, but some critics argue they are sometimes used for personal prestige or financial gain by the claimant.

3. Immediacy and Completeness

• NT Miracles: Healings were typically immediate and complete. A paralytic would instantly pick up his mat and walk; a blind person would instantly see. There was no slow process of recovery or residual symptoms.
  • Example: The lame man healed by Peter and John was instantly able to walk (Acts 3:7).
• Current Claims: While some modern claims describe immediate results, many reported healings are either gradual or involve conditions with a high rate of spontaneous or psychological recovery. Skeptics often point to the lack of clear, instantaneous healing of verifiable, irreversible, congenital, or organic conditions.

4. Conditionality

• NT Miracles: Miracles were not always conditioned on the faith of the recipient. Jesus healed people who didn't ask or even know who he was, and the dead had no faith.
• Current Claims: In some contemporary settings, failure to be healed is often attributed to the lack of sufficient faith on the part of the person seeking the miracle.

 

[PaulThomson]

Are you not aware that presenting the work of Mother Teresa vs. the work of Jackie Pullinger was to show the foolishness of your defense?

IOW, what does Jackie Pullinger have to do with the similarities or lack of similarities of current claims of supernatural manifestations to 1st Century supernatural manifestations?

Since you like AI to do your research, here is AI's answer to the question.


Are current claims of miracles to same as New Testament miracles?

Here are some key characteristics of the NT miracles and how they are often compared to current claims:

1. Nature and Scale of the Miracles

• NT Miracles: Included instantaneous and complete physical healings of organic diseases, raising the dead (after being deceased for a period), control over nature (calming storms, walking on water), and multiplying food (feeding 5,000). These were often spectacular and undeniable events in the public eye, even acknowledged by opponents.
  • Examples: Healing a man blind from birth (John 9), raising Lazarus after four days (John 11), turning water into wine (John 2).
• Current Claims: Many contemporary claims are often centered on healing, which sometimes involve conditions that are psychological, psychosomatic, or spontaneous remissions that are difficult to verify as supernatural intervention. Claims of NT-scale "nature miracles" (like instantaneously creating food or walking on water) are extremely rare and often lack the same level of widespread, credible, and hostile witness verification found in the NT narratives.

2. Purpose and Function

• NT Purpose: The primary purpose was to authenticate Jesus as the promised Messiah and the coming of the Kingdom of God, and to later validate the message and authority of the Apostles (Acts 2:22; Hebrews 2:4). They served as "signs" pointing to the divine identity of the messenger and the truth of the message. They were also acts of compassion.
• Current Claims: Modern claims are often presented as ongoing acts of God's compassion or a sign of faith, but some critics argue they are sometimes used for personal prestige or financial gain by the claimant.

3. Immediacy and Completeness

• NT Miracles: Healings were typically immediate and complete. A paralytic would instantly pick up his mat and walk; a blind person would instantly see. There was no slow process of recovery or residual symptoms.
  • Example: The lame man healed by Peter and John was instantly able to walk (Acts 3:7).
• Current Claims: While some modern claims describe immediate results, many reported healings are either gradual or involve conditions with a high rate of spontaneous or psychological recovery. Skeptics often point to the lack of clear, instantaneous healing of verifiable, irreversible, congenital, or organic conditions.

4. Conditionality

• NT Miracles: Miracles were not always conditioned on the faith of the recipient. Jesus healed people who didn't ask or even know who he was, and the dead had no faith.
• Current Claims: In some contemporary settings, failure to be healed is often attributed to the lack of sufficient faith on the part of the person seeking the miracle.

All your AI summary shows is that some claims to modern miracles are not the same as first century reports. That is hardly a ringing endorsement of claims that they no longer happen at all in the same way as they happened in the first century. Have you read anything about Jackie Pullinger's life and ministry? If you have, do you claim that the gift of tongues in her ministry were fake and powerless babbling?

 

[Lamar]

All your AI summary shows is that some claims to modern miracles are not the same as first century reports. That is hardly a ringing endorsement of claims that they no longer happen at all in the same way as they happened in the first century. Have you read anything about Jackie Pullinger's life and ministry? If you have, do you claim that the gift of tongues in her ministry were fake and powerless babbling?

Why do you claim that Jackie Pullinger was not simply babbling?

 

[PaulThomson]

Why do you claim that Jackie Pullinger was not simply babbling?

Because the effect of tongues was consistently to break longstanding addictions to opium and other drugs.

What is your reason for claiming it was mere babbling?

 

[studier]

Maybe discernment of spirits should be considered as was done in early NC days and was written about for our instruction.