Righteousness
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What do you do to 'work' righteousness?
You change your responses just enough to try and make it seem we do not understand what you say. But, I am interested in knowing who the 'we' is that you talk about? A group you belong to or other people in this forum?
I specifically said that character traits are not earned and that the one and only way to attain a character trait is through faith, so please interact with what I said in the OP rather than burning a straw man.
We are those who obey the spirit. I sincerely believe you don't understand at all what I'm talking about.
Righteousness is treating people equitably, speaking the truth, showing mercy/compassion, treating others like I want to be treated, etc. You know, what Jesus and the apostles taught.
Go and learn what circular reasoning is… and stop employing it to make your point.
What your saying here there were many at that time that called Him lord lord, Rabbi Rabbi, master master. Just caling Him lord will not get you in so to speak.
Your first post I agree yet disagree. For me its very clear and not based on anything I have heard or been taught. Father Abraham was righteous because he believed God. I like the AMP here "For what does the Scripture say? “ABRAHAM BELIEVED IN (trusted, relied on) GOD, AND IT WAS CREDITED TO HIS ACCOUNT AS RIGHTEOUSNESS (right living, right standing with God).”
So for every believer who believes in Jesus Christ John 3:16-17 Rom 10:9-10 they will not taste death but will have ever lasting life. We are righteous because we believe in Jesus "This righteousness of God comes through faith in Jesus Christ for all those [Jew or Gentile] who believe [and trust in Him and acknowledge Him as God’s Son]. There is no distinction,"
That "fruit" comes from the vine not the branch. "Being confident of this very thing, that He who has begun a good work in you will complete it until the day of Jesus Christ." Its Him.
Pfft obey.. are we talking about John 14? Do we understand the context the time and what was about to happen? It seems some just take one verse out and run with it as in " do you love Jesus? They you will obey Him". Its true yet wrong. Its taken out of context.
If there's one thing that's consistent throughout scripture, from beginning to end, it's "Obey my voice"
Do you mean the Holy Spirit? He is not 'the spirit' lower case force of some kind. You cannot address the scriptures others and myself have asked you about, so now you decide that you have a 'we' group (that I already asked you about) that obey some 'spirit'. You may be right. Perhaps I do not know this 'spirit' you speak of, but, I do know the Holy Spirit who is identified with God and Jesus and He does not teach whatever it is that you and the 'we' group present.
No, those might be classified as good works, but they are not 'righteousness'. You keep denying that you equate any works with salvation through Christ, but you return to your understanding when the right question is asked and you go right back to works. I doubt I will take the time to respond to you and your group again. You infer I am ignorant of the Holy Spirit. That is not an insult. It is a road sign indicating that we are not on the same path.
If I had said doing righteousness is treating people equitably, speaking the truth, showing mercy/compassion, treating others like I want to be treated, etc, would have changed your respons?
Sorry for being confusing, I would be happy to clarify something if you had a question. It is good to show support for my position from throughout the Bible rather than to just based my position on a single verse. Character traits are simple to understand, but righteousness has a lot of theological constructs that make it difficult to understand, which is why I created this thread to first discuss the way to attain a character trait, what it means to have it, and to then understand what the Bible says about righteousness in that that light.
Please clarify this statement.The author does not reflect a point of salvation but claims to have grown up as one.
God's way is the way to know Him and Jesus by embodying His likeness through being a doer of His character traits, which is the narrow way to eternal life (John 17:3). For examples, in Genesis 18:19, God knew Abraham that he would teach his children and those of his household to walk in His way by being doers of righteousness and justice that the Lord might bring to him all that He has promised. In Exodus 33:13, Moses wanted God to be gracious to him by teaching him to walk in His way that he and Israel might know Him, and in Matthew 7:23, Jesus said that he would tell those who are workers of lawlessness to depart from him because he never knew them, so the goal of being a doer of righteous works in obedience to God's law is to know Him, not in order to earn our righteousness.
In Titus 2:14, Jesus gave himself to redeem us from all lawlessness and to purify for himself a people of his own possession who are zealous for doing good works, so the way to believe in what Jesus accomplished through the cross is by becoming zealous for doing good works in obedience to God's law.
Christ embodied his righteousness through his works by setting an example for us to follow of how to walk in obedience to God's law, and in 1 John 2:6, those who are in Christ are obligated to walk in the same way that he walked, so that is also the way that we get to walk when we have the righteousness of Christ.
In Matthew 7:21-23, Jesus said that only those who do the will of the Father will enter the Kingdom of Heaven in contrast with saying that he would tell those who are workers of lawlessness to depart from him because he never knew them, so entering the Kingdom of Heaven does involve the Mosaic Law. Jesus saves us from our sin (Matthew 1:21) and it by the Mosaic Law that we have knowledge of what sin is (Romans 3:20), so Jesus graciously teaching us to be a doer of it is intrinsically the way that he is giving us his gift of saving us from not being a doer of it. Someone who has no obligation to refrain from doing what God has revealed to be sin through the Mosaic Law would have no need of salvation from sin.
The work of God in us is embodying His character traits in obedience to what He has commanded. The way that Christ produces works in us is by graciously teaching us to do them.
Obedience doesn't produce eternal life and is not evidence of it, but rather it is intrinsically the way to experience the gift of eternal life.
Obedience to God has absolutely nothing to do with trying to be good enough for Him.
Matthew 11 verse 27 ~ All things have been entrusted to Me by My Father. No one knows the Son except the Father, and no one knows the Father except the Son and those to whom the Son chooses to reveal Him.
Your reasoning is not just circular, it's coiled up like a snake... which is not surprising given that's where it originates.
Grace is a gift and gifts can't be earned, so grace is incompatible with works insofar as they are done to earn a wage (Romans 11:6), however, works can be done for reasons that are compatible with grace. For example, the content of a gift can be the experience of doing something, such as giving someone the opportunity to experience driving a Ferrari, where the gift intrinsically requires them to do the work of driving it in order to have that experience, but where doing that work contributes nothing towards earning the opportunity to drive it.
In Psalms 119:29-30, he wanted to put false ways far from him, for God to be gracious to him by teaching him to obey His law, and he chose the way of faith by setting it before him, so this has always been the one and only way of salvation by grace through faith alone.
In Exodus 33:13, Moses wanted God to be gracious to him by teaching him to walk in His way that he and Israel might know Him, and in Matthew 7:23, Jesus said that he would tell those who are workers of lawlessness to depart from him because he never knew them, so the goal of the law is to teach us how to experience knowing God and Jesus, which is His gift of eternal life (John 17:3), and which again is the gift of salvation by grace through faith.
In Genesis 6:8-9, Noah found grace in the eyes of God, he was a righteous man, and he walked with God, so God was gracious to him by teaching him to walk in His way and he was righteous because he obeyed through faith. In Romans 1:5, we have received grace in order to bring about the obedience of faith.
In Ephesians 2:8-10, we are new creations in Christ to do good works, so while Paul denied that we can earn our salvation as the result of our works lest anyone should boast, being made to be a doer of good works in obedience to God's law is nevertheless a central part of God's gift of salvation.
In Titus 2:11-13, our salvation is described as being trained by grace to do what is godly, righteous, and good, and to renounce doing what is ungodly, so doing those works has absolutely nothing to do with trying to contribute anything towards earning our salvation, but rather God graciously teaching us to be a doer of those works is part of His gift of salvation. In Titus 2:14, Jesus gave himself to redeem us from all lawlessness and to purify for himself a people of his own possession who are zealous for doing good works, so the way to believe in what Jesus spent his ministry teaching by word and by example and in what he accomplished through the cross is by repenting and becoming zealous for being a doer of good works in obedience to God's law (Acts 21:20).