Can We Really Exercise Free Will?

[reneweddaybyday]

please read again what the Spirit says.

the word has gone out to all. everyone heard.
the elect received it and the rest were blinded.

those who are "blinded" are the ones who reject ... you agree everyone hears ... you agree those who receive are not blinded ... do you agree that those who reject are the ones who are blinded? ... not that God blinds them beforehand so that they cannot, under any circumstance, hear the word that has gone out to all?
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[studier]

And, you are one of those experts (who does time travel)....

Both the Hebrew - 'min bit'en' - and the Greek -'ek kolia' literally mean, "out from the womb.

Stick with your kiddy translations if it makes you feel good.
What I am talking about is "meat" for those who wish to mature in Christ.

That's sure been a controversial and emotional issue from translation. But, no matter, it says what it says and just like everything He says, we get to accept it or reject it - believe or not believe.

 

[reneweddaybyday]

they don't see it that way.

they think everyone deserves a fair chance to win eternal life, and believe that if it is up to God rather than man, that means it isn't fair.

that is not what I believe. I believe God reaches out to all ... God's Word is rejected by some ... the ones who do not reject God's Word receive the benefit ... those who reject receive the consequence.

forgetting that the very basis of our faith is that everyone already has that chance and everyone fails - - hence the need for Mercy

how about "everyone already has that chance and [not] everyone fails" - - and even in that scenario the need for Mercy is not abated.

God tells us in Genesis 3:22 that mankind can know good and evil ... if mankind can know good and God, in His great goodness, has given us His Word ... God's Word is good ... the gospel is the good news ... why do you insist that mankind can only reject when God reaches out?
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[NightTwister]

I don't either ... notwithstanding your belief to the contrary.





yep ... and not just salvation ... the Lord Jesus Christ is the very life of the born again believer ... without Him nothing that exists could exist.
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It's unfortunate that some folks can't see that we agree on much more than we disagree. Unfortunately, it has to be all or none, and many false accusations are made against others.

 

[cv5]

There are guarantees though....

1Ki 8:23
And he said, LORD God of Israel, there is no God like thee, in heaven above, or on earth beneath, who keepest covenant and mercy with thy servants that walk before thee with all their heart:

Psa 23:6
Surely goodness and mercy shall follow me all the days of my life: and I will dwell in the house of the LORD for ever.

Psa 25:10
All the paths of the LORD are mercy and truth unto such as keep his covenant and his testimonies.

Anybody notice that the "mercy warranty" is made good according to the volitional willingness of the subjects?
Next question: why are these manifold and prodigious lessons demonstrated aforetime for our learning so easily dismissed by the determinists?

 

[lrs68]

Salvation is what God provided when He allowed Himself to be nailed and crucified.
Grace is the Act of God that made Him lay His life down.

Therefore, Salvation is a Gift of God's Grace.

But the second most important key to the entire process is Faith or Belief. If a person never believes what God did then they will never be saved. But if they do Believe or have Faith in what God did then they will be saved.

The dilemma here is how does a person Believe\have Faith?
Yes, God gives a measure of Faith to everyone.
But the person themselves have to put it into action.

Until a person puts the Faith God gave to them in action to Believe what God did and accomplished upon the Cross that person will never be saved.

So it does actually come down to what will the person do with the evidence God has provided about God's Grace and Works upon the Cross.

 

[BillyBob]

Nope. Wrong. All wrong.

Our ***soteriology*** is grounded upon a divinely established legal transaction. An offer of Marriage freely given available to all. Covenant line items providing for the requirements of informed consent. Obligations and benefits. Payment of outstanding debts. Acquittal. Divine pardons. Justification. Stuff like that.

Vapid and vain pseudo-philosophical tirades and musings add nothing to the transaction. Worse, they impose fraudulent entanglements and barriers to entry.

Pharisaical Calvinists are notorious in this regard.

Seems to me that since you base your belief on a legal transaction, that must mean that you are still under the law, not grace. Good luck with that!

BTW, it is not the reformed who thump their chest and say “Look what I did”, it is the FWers

 

[cv5]

Wrong indeed, regeneration (new birth/united with Christ in real time) prior to justification (the legal transaction) also a real time event.

Yes they do turn reverse the plan of salvation.

The wedding feast comes before the bride has consented/accepted the offer of marriage
Just absurd

Barriers to entry are indeed shameful.
The god with "inscrutable reasons."

Since when covenants legally viable and binding if not signed because you have yet to be born?

 

[cv5]

Seems to me that since you base your belief on a legal transaction, that must mean that you are still under the law, not grace. Good luck with that!

BTW, it is not the reformed who thump their chest and say “Look what I did”, it is the FWers

THIS legal transaction is a SETTLEMENT AGREEMENT between the members of the TRINITY.
Try harder genius.

 

[Cameron143]

Since when covenants legally viable and binding if not signed because you have yet to be born?

The new covenant is not a contract between God and man, but between Father and Son.

 

[Genez]

Oh wait...let me come up with a oft-repeated, tiresome, childish FWer refrain: You're cherry-picking isolated verses taken out of context. Anything else you have in your impoverished grab bag of tricks?

​

Rufus the Doofus.... ​

You are now on Ignore.​

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For after the 20th time?​

You've become totally a predictable bore.​

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Bye bye, to the gangsta Bible salesman! ​

For it's the same old garbage, every time. ​

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I bet you didn't know...​

The Holy Sprit knows when to rhyme!​

​

​

bye! ​

 

[cv5]

The new covenant is not a contract between God and man, but between Father and Son.

Already covered. However, this covenant of GRACE must FIRST be OFFERED and then RECEIVED before it is efficacious as far as we are concerned.

 

[Genez]

Yes. Have you ever asked yourself why it is that so many Calvinists possess such a savage spirit of condemnation?

Pro 8:36 - But he that sinneth against me wrongeth his own soul: all they that hate me love death.

The way they present how God treats people in his TULIP patch, appeals to their own sense of pushy depravity.
"Self Righteous nastiness" is their tool.

They do not refute intelligently. Instead, they plaster a few verses on a wall they have yet to understand, and then mock.

 

[Genez]

Already covered. However, this covenant of GRACE must FIRST be OFFERED and then RECEIVED before it is efficacious as far as we are concerned.

Unconfusing the confused, confuses them.

 

[Genez]

yep ... ek ...

check out Acts 3:2 and Acts 14:8.
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Those who wish to gain the upper hand with stubbornness, do not want to gain knowledge to take away their sense of self empowerment.

The Truth will make you free.
Leaving them behind if they do not want to learn what they do not know.

 

[Genez]

That's sure been a controversial and emotional issue from translation. But, no matter, it says what it says and just like everything He says, we get to accept it or reject it - believe or not believe.

This is the adjustment to God that is needed to mature when such knowledge is presented.

“For My thoughts are not your thoughts,
Nor are your ways My ways,” says the Lord.

Isaiah 55:8

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God makes us wonder how we could have been so wrong, while we felt we had to be so right!

God gives greater grace only to the humble.

Such passages are humility tests.

 

[BillyBob]

Already covered. However, this covenant of GRACE must FIRST be OFFERED and then RECEIVED before it is efficacious as far as we are concerned.

Salvation is a one piece puzzle, and the one piece is God's grace. Therefore, it is only man's vanity that attempts to add another piece to complete it.
Christ's work is complete and lacks nothing! It is finished. . . . .

 

[reneweddaybyday]

It's unfortunate that some folks can't see that we agree on much more than we disagree. Unfortunately, it has to be all or none, and many false accusations are made against others.

sad but true ...
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[Cameron143]

Already covered. However, this covenant of GRACE must FIRST be OFFERED and then RECEIVED before it is efficacious as far as we are concerned.

It was offered to Christ who fulfilled it. Whatever was promised to Him now belongs to Him.
What was promised to Him?

 

[Jordon]

I do not believe I have ever indicated "choice" or "choose" ... I maintain that the Word of God is spoken to or read by someone ... which is God reaching out to mankind ... and that mankind either believes God's Word or suppresses the truth in unrighteousness.





God's Word is the divine message. God's Word is alive and God's Word imparts life. God's Word is quick (living) and powerful (Heb 4:12) ... the truth of God's Word is either believed or rejected ... what say you? Is God's Word alive? ... is God's Word powerful?
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yes I say theese things. I say that any of God's word is alive, but those alive for for one person are not as as alive for another person.

As a person can have a bigger accumulation of words they have considered alive.

And the accumulation can disaplin.

It's all about disaplin toe, like this morning I couldn't motivate myself to put up with shambles. briefly for moment I did but then I had to disaplin myself to putting up with shambles.

Disaplin is how I'm wired, I'm not wired by motivation