Can We Really Exercise Free Will?

[Magenta]

The participants in the NC are ultimately those who responsively, volitionally believe in God.

You funny. I take it to mean that after God convinced you, you think you decided to believe what you already believed.

Then you slap a favorite word on it and say you did it. Uh huh. Hilarious. Totally illogical as well.

But we can expect no less from FWers. You take credit for what God did.

1 Corinthians 3 v 19-21a, 1 Corinthians 1 v 19 ~ The wisdom of this world is foolishness in God’s sight. As it is written: “He catches the wise in their craftiness.” And again, “The Lord knows that the thoughts of the wise are futile.” Therefore, stop boasting in men. For it is written: “I will destroy the wisdom of the wise; the intelligence of the intelligent I will frustrate.”

 

[cv5]

Of course we are! We all take after CV5's superhero Adam. Like father like son, don't you know?

Actually, Satan is the elder first son. Adam is the younger second son.

The implications are profound.

 

[studier]

If I thought you would benefit, I would.

Deflection expected when the Text threatens the system.

 

[lrs68]

Yes in fact the whole chapter is to be taken into consideration not just that one verse
But nothing in it contradicts what Jesus plainly says

So you understand that Jesus is talking to the same people He blinded and deafened to fulfill the Isaiah prophecy also mentioned in the Letters written by Paul?

So if the Jews are blind and deafened that means everyone else should be able to come to Jesus.

So those who reject Jesus and those who accept Jesus are not blinded nor deafened like the Jews.

Are these natural men\women rejecting and accepting Jesus in free will since they are not blinded and deafened like the Jews?

The only ones that we read in the Bible incapable of coming to Jesus were the Jews who were blinded and deafened. That should mean the rest of the world can come to Jesus.

 

[Blain]

So you understand that Jesus is talking to the same people He blinded and deafened to fulfill the Isaiah prophecy also mentioned in the Letters written by Paul?

So if the Jews are blind and deafened that means everyone else should be able to come to Jesus.

So those who reject Jesus and those who accept Jesus are not blinded nor deafened like the Jews.

Are these natural men\women rejecting and accepting Jesus in free will since they are not blinded and deafened like the Jews?

The only ones that we read in the Bible incapable of coming to Jesus were the Jews who were blinded and deafened. That should mean the rest of the world can come to Jesus.

Well no because it doesn't matter if he was talking to them his words still remain true there is no loop hole here. your assuming that the idea of free will and being able to freely choose Christ is still on the table but Jesus already said none can come to him unless the father draws them first

it isn't complicated and there is no loop hole Jesus said what he meant and meant what he said

 

[Cameron143]

Deflection expected when the Text threatens the system.

Love it when I post something and it's affirmed almost immediately.

 

[Genez]

Please. How does one have inward obedience with a corrupted heart? How does one obey the command to believe when he is carnal and not subject to the law? Fallen natural man is quite the super hero. I wonder why he was found cowering shamefully in the garden blaming everyone but himself. He's at the car lot still waiting for a benefactor.

You still do not comprehend the full scope of what God's power (grace) can accomplish in isolating a person's soul from the depravity of the flesh.

It is when the flesh is allowed to normally function that a soul can not choose to believe in God.
But, how does anyone get saved?
They all had flesh when they believed.

What stopped the flesh they were still living in from stopping them to believe?
Even the regenerated ones have to contend with their flesh!

So the alleged concept of being regenerated before salvation does not eliminate the flesh.

The key is?
Like with a Christian (where we know it can be demonstrated) the Holy Spirit can neutralize the influence of the flesh over the soul.

It is with our soul (heart) that one believes in Jesus Christ.
The Holy Spirit is neutralizing the depravity of our flesh by grace when our soul chooses to believe.

What you have accepted is convoluted and defies logic.
Not to mention.
The word 'logic' comes from the same root as 'logos.'

You're not smarter. You only think you are.
It feeds your pride (which you deny having) as you mock others as being "free willers" in a closed-minded stawman fashion....

 

[Magenta]

Love it when I post something and it's affirmed almost immediately.

Yeah, their ability to rewrite the texts they don't like to better fit their pre-programmed way of thinking is a total train
wreck for anyone hoping for honest discussion. Best to avoid their twisted way of distorting what is plainly written.

 

[Cameron143]

You still do not comprehend the full scope of what God's power (grace) can accomplish in isolating a person's soul from the depravity of the flesh.

It is when the flesh is allowed to normally function that a soul can not choose to believe in God.
But, how does anyone get saved?
They all had flesh when they believed.

What stopped the flesh they were still living in from stopping them to believe?
Even the regenerated ones have to contend with their flesh!

So the alleged concept of being regenerated before salvation does not eliminate the flesh.

The key is?
Like with a Christian (where we know it can be demonstrated) the Holy Spirit can neutralize the influence of the flesh over the soul.

It is with our soul (heart) that one believes in Jesus Christ.
The Holy Spirit is neutralizing the depravity of our flesh by grace when our soul chooses to believe.

What you have accepted is convoluted and defies logic.
Not to mention.
The word 'logic' comes from the same root as 'logos.'

You're not smarter. You only think you are.
It feeds your pride (which you deny having) as you mock others as being "free willers" in a closed-minded stawman fashion....

Sure I understand it. It not only withholds the flesh, but positively gives life, a new heart, and the Spirit. I believe grace is much greater than you suggest. So who doesn't comprehend the full scope of grace?

 

[lrs68]

Well no because it doesn't matter if he was talking to them his words still remain true there is no loop hole here. your assuming that the idea of free will and being able to freely choose Christ is still on the table but Jesus already said none can come to him unless the father draws them first

it isn't complicated and there is no loop hole Jesus said what he meant and meant what he said

No, you assume what you think I mean.
I am saying we are drawn because we're not blinded and deafened so we are enabled.

 

[Cameron143]

You still do not comprehend the full scope of what God's power (grace) can accomplish in isolating a person's soul from the depravity of the flesh.

It is when the flesh is allowed to normally function that a soul can not choose to believe in God.
But, how does anyone get saved?
They all had flesh when they believed.

What stopped the flesh they were still living in from stopping them to believe?
Even the regenerated ones have to contend with their flesh!

So the alleged concept of being regenerated before salvation does not eliminate the flesh.

The key is?
Like with a Christian (where we know it can be demonstrated) the Holy Spirit can neutralize the influence of the flesh over the soul.

It is with our soul (heart) that one believes in Jesus Christ.
The Holy Spirit is neutralizing the depravity of our flesh by grace when our soul chooses to believe.

What you have accepted is convoluted and defies logic.
Not to mention.
The word 'logic' comes from the same root as 'logos.'

You're not smarter. You only think you are.
It feeds your pride (which you deny having) as you mock others as being "free willers" in a closed-minded stawman fashion....

Can you show me where I mocked someone?

 

[Rufus]

I'm positive you are describing yourself.
As my good buddy SBC Pastor Rick Johnson would say, the unfortunate issue about those of us who follow the Reformed Doctrine is we're rather rude and cocky and none of those qualities are listed as good in the Bible.

And then there are FWers who think they are something when in God's eyes they are less than nothing!

So, tell me, Mr. DNA man, are you a child of promise or not?

And have you figured out yet from Rom 1 who Paul's primary audience was?

 

[BillyBob]

They are bots too?

That is true! They believe that they Bot their way into salvation. . . . . . .

 

[cv5]

Except he also said this ohn 6:44 where Jesus says, "No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him

Do your homework sir.

Jhn 6:44 - No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw G1670 him: and I will raise him up at the last day.
Tools

Jhn 12:32 - And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw G1670 all men unto me.

 

[Genez]

Sure I understand it. It not only withholds the flesh, but positively gives life, a new heart, and the Spirit. I believe grace is much greater than you suggest. So who doesn't comprehend the full scope of grace?

Yet you say nothing to back up your claim.
Not one chapter and verse states God regenerates us before salvation.

 

[Magenta]

And then there are FWers who think they are something when in God's eyes they are less than nothing!

Pelagian heretics seem destined (certainly determined!) to elevate man above what Scripture says of him...

God compares man to grass and gnats but that is far beneath the heretic's view.

 

[Blain]

No, you assume what you think I mean.
I am saying we are drawn because we're not blinded and deafened so we are enabled.

Well again your idea of freely choosing even if we are enebaled physically is flawed here because even if we are eneabled physically he is talking things of the spirit not carnal and thus it doesn't matter if we are not blind or deaf the carnal cannot comprehend the spiritual and we are not spiritually enabled until he draws us first

 

[Genez]

Can you show me where I mocked someone?

I say all I said?
And you just pick up on one detail?

It is true.
You filter out a gnat and leave in a camel.

 

[NightTwister]

Actually, Satan is the elder first son. Adam is the younger second son.

The implications are profound.

Are you Mormon?

 

[Cameron143]

Yet you say nothing to back up your claim.
Not one chapter and verse states God regenerates us before salvation.

I have shown the necessity of all those things using other verses.
If this is poor form, then I make the same claim towards you as there are no plain verses that say what you say.