Creation of Man

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shittim said:
I don't, you are in error to mistakenly believe that.
He has provided a better way to know His ways.
It is explained in the Bible.
goodbye Carlyw
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Oh, well it says you marked it as "zzz" which means boring. Sorry for the misunderstanding.

I think that personal revelation of scripture should be fact checked by scripture. Like anything that you think, if facts contradict it, you are wrong and your interpretations will need adjustment.

Ya know?

And we can get to know who God is through truthful revelation given by his text, faithfully interpreted.

Though prayer helps of course, our own minds can fool us where the scriptures never will.
 
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Carlyw said:
Oh, well it says you marked it as "zzz" which means boring. Sorry for the misunderstanding.

I think that personal revelation of scripture should be fact checked by scripture. Like anything that you think, if facts contradict it, you are wrong and your interpretations will need adjustment.

Ya know?

And we can get to know who God is through truthful revelation given by his text, faithfully interpreted.

Though prayer helps of course, our own minds can fool us where the scriptures never will.
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Translations are always a difficult job Carly, and i say this as someone who speaks 3 languages, English not being my primary.
I'd say that in this case 'in the beginning' and 'revealed', point you to the same conclusion which is the beginning as we find out more through science for example, which confirms a beginning. And we learned this (beginning) through being revealed through the ages because we didn't have telescopes before Galilee.
That's how i see this without even knowing Hebrew. And i've said before that many words in my native language (Albanian) cannot be translated 100% accurately into English and some words don't even exist to translate into Albanian. For example we don't have 'murder' and 'kill'. It's only kill.
Whether you're innocent or not is left up to the lawyers, but you killed nonetheless so the intent or legality of it in that language doesn't matter.
 
The word in the teaching I mentioned was "revealed" for the word "created", which we often find in Genesis.
best wishes
 
Eli1 said:
Translations are always a difficult job Carly, and i say this as someone who speaks 3 languages, English not being my primary.
I'd say that in this case 'in the beginning' and 'revealed', point you to the same conclusion which is the beginning as we find out more through science for example, which confirms a beginning. And we learned this (beginning) through being revealed through the ages because we didn't take telescopes before Galilee.
That's how i see this without even knowing Hebrew. And i've said before that many words in my native language (Albanian) cannot be translated 100% accurately into English and some words don't even exist to translate into Albanian. For example we don't have 'murder' and 'kill'. It's only kill.
Whether you're innocent or not is left up to the lawyers, but you killed nonetheless so the intent or legality of it in that language doesn't matter.
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Oh I fully agree. Its cool that you speak many different languages! Many people over here dont speak more than one, im trying to learn another but its so hard! I have crazy respect for people who speak more than one, whether thats from diligent study or picking it up naturally through time and experience.

I will say that to my knowledge translation is a very important, and depending on the context there will be many applicable meanings. But to my knowladge here, he was advertising a use of English to support a separate meaning of the scripture. Whether it can be right doesnt always mean it is, at least not traditionally. My point is, English was faithful to the Hebrew text with the title "Genisis", but if we are to try and deconstruct the language to get a fuller understanding, we might as well go to the original text:)

I wonder how many hebrew scripts had the word revealed instead of beginning, I doubt any, but maybe some did. Or how many English translations thought it was fair to do so, and if that would be an accurate representation of the original text. These are just some of my thoughts as I very very highly value truth. But I can also be wrong and even at times close minded.

As for the other things I said, they weren't in relation. Ive noticed that from my understanding, Shittim has varying degrees of belief which could fall under more personal revelation, rather than faithful interpretation. Which I could very much be wrong, but I did add my beliefs of scripture being the ultimate authority here because, respectfully id like to think that most of us believe it is. And if he does believe that great! But if he doesnt, it may give him some things to think about.

I will add that it would be more productive to get to know who he is and ask and listen/talk, but I honestly dont have the time for that because I do all the housework here, and im a wife and my life is VERY busy at times.
 
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KeithAB said:
Where Adam and Eve the first people eve created?
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I believe in a creation prior to the Genesis 1:2 account. Some call this gap theory; others pre-Adamic creation. It's not a commonly held view. Larry Ollison has some excellent teaching on the subject.

What is not clear is what kind of beings were created by God prior to Adam and Eve. If the gap theory is correct, the first creation was also destroyed by a world wide flood. Were there people as we know them in the first creation? I believe so. It's a fascinating subject and it would take more time than I can spare to go over it. Larry Ollison does an excellent job.
 
JohnDB said:
Nope....
Created in this case as in God created the heavens and the earth is a Hebrew word "bara"
It's a somewhat prepositional verb in that a material is required to be stated that you formed the created out of.

You can bara a stone table, bara a wood table, bara a metal table.....whatever but you cannot have a table without the material.

In Adam's case it was the clay, in Eve's case it was Adam's rib.
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But yes this is very true

And still shittims translation may not be faithful, as this is a great translation which is accurate.

My brain is kind of wonky today, so I apologize in advance for the misunderstandings and the misreading of your original response shittim.

But my point does still stand in some regard
 
It is my understanding that God created man and woman on the 6th day as recorded in Gen 1:24-31 and rested on the 7th day. Then on the 8th day he saw there was no man to till the ground and God formed the man Adam, from the dust of the ground and beathed into his nostrils the breath of life, Gen 2:5-8. From Adam's rib God made a woman whom Adam named Eve, Gen 3:20. (Note: in Hebrew rib means curve. The woman was made from the DNA curve of the man.)

So there were people made on the 6th day and then Adam was made on the 8th day after God rested, to be a tiller of the ground. Consider Gen 4:16-17 where Cain went out from the presence of the Lord and dwelt in the land of Nod and knew his wife. If Adam and Eve where the first created, where did Cain get his wife from in the land of Nod? He got her from those that were created on the 6th day.
 
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Carlyw said:
True in some sense but how does it relate?
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Well,
Titles are descriptive declarations of responsibilities.

From the Title "First Human" (notice the absent word or implication of "father") to the title of "Mother of all living". Everything meant something.

And usually someone points a question of "Where did Cain's wife come from?" Or "Why did they need a city with only 4 people running around?"

My little city I live in wouldn't hold the Earth's population at the time Cain got married.

And finally,
The original language with its nuances, the intended original audience, and artistic manner it was written are important to really understand what was intended by scripture. Such as the very first verse in the Bible is not a complete sentence. There's no material listed and it's almost like a dangling participle...imagine an "out of" when reading it....there may be a period but that doesn't mean it's a complete sentence. There's another case of this linguistic style in Daniel....but again translators have put a word there when there really is nothing there. It just does not stand out so much.

There's a world that can open up from a proper study of scriptures. Because in history when the scriptures were written, reading and writing was a "rich person hobby". There wasn't a lot of in the world. And things that were written were usually written in an extremely contracted manner. (Ink was expensive too)
This is why "hermeneutics" (the blend of art and sciences used to interpret scripture) also touches one of my favorite types of study which is referred to as apologetics....
But Apologetics is usually thought to be how we prove scriptures are valid or that creation happened....it is not. It's more of proving how and why the scriptures are valuable and extremely understated in most instances. Each snippet comes alive and blows up into some of the richest storytelling of all the literature I've read.

Hollywood has got nothing on scripture even though many of its movies themes were stolen straight from scripture.
 
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JohnDB said:
Well,
Titles are descriptive declarations of responsibilities.

From the Title "First Human" (notice the absent word or implication of "father") to the title of "Mother of all living". Everything meant something.

And usually someone points a question of "Where did Cain's wife come from?" Or "Why did they need a city with only 4 people running around?"

My little city I live in wouldn't hold the Earth's population at the time Cain got married.

And finally,
The original language with its nuances, the intended original audience, and artistic manner it was written are important to really understand what was intended by scripture. Such as the very first verse in the Bible is not a complete sentence. There's no material listed and it's almost like a dangling participle...imagine an "out of" when reading it....there may be a period but that doesn't mean it's a complete sentence. There's another case of this linguistic style in Daniel....but again translators have put a word there when there really is nothing there. It just does not stand out so much.

There's a world that can open up from a proper study of scriptures. Because in history when the scriptures were written, reading and writing was a "rich person hobby". There wasn't a lot of in the world. And things that were written were usually written in an extremely contracted manner. (Ink was expensive too)
This is why "hermeneutics" (the blend of art and sciences used to interpret scripture) also touches one of my favorite types of study which is referred to as apologetics....
But Apologetics is usually thought to be how we prove scriptures are valid or that creation happened....it is not. It's more of proving how and why the scriptures are valuable and extremely understated in most instances. Each snippet comes alive and blows up into some of the richest storytelling of all the literature I've read.

Hollywood has got nothing on scripture even though many of its movies themes were stolen straight from scripture.
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What im hearing is youre very smart and know smart people things.

My brain can not handle this information haha.

But I believe them to be right anyway, from what I can understand. Scripture is beautiful and there are many great and interesting fields of education that make learning scripture more clear/interesting. Do you watch YouTube? Or do you prefer to learn from books or classes? I find that I watch a lot on YouTube but I think that it has broken my brain. I watch and listen but do not retain. I tend to learn better from classes, and books but classes cost money and books do as well, free books however, I dont read because im undisciplined. Now a class, I would go to. Ah...the merits of living in such a fast paced well educated age that often values comfort and convenience.
 
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Carlyw said:
What im hearing is youre very smart and know smart people things.

My brain can not handle this information haha.

But I believe them to be right anyway, from what I can understand. Scripture is beautiful and there are many great and interesting fields of education that make learning scripture more clear/interesting. Do you watch YouTube? Or do you prefer to learn from books or classes? I find that I watch a lot on YouTube but I think that it has broken my brain. I watch and listen but do not retain. I tend to learn better from classes, and books but classes cost money and books do as well, free books however, I dont read because im undisciplined. Now a class, I would go to. Ah...the merits of living in such a fast paced well educated age that often values comfort and convenience.
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I apologize....
I'm trying to keep my answers brief and sometimes use too many fifty cent words....

None of this stuff is very complicated. It's just coming from a different way of thinking than what we do today.

The knowledge and wisdom that comes from this section of the Bible is very important because it tells us who we are and why we are loved so much by God.

People today like to use some very fancy reasons for why their bad behavior is "unimportant to God if He existed at all"....while the truth is exactly the opposite.

I'm sure you have heard the news recently about a guy getting shot who told people these very things. People don't like the truth....especially when they wish to continue to do bad things and are demanding you applaud them for their bad behavior. I'm not so public with the telling...but I do enjoy it.
 
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shittim said:
The word in the teaching I mentioned was "revealed" for the word "created", which we often find in Genesis.
best wishes
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The closest we can get to "revealed" meaning is in the word "morning". As in "there was evening. There was morning, the third day"

The word Evening and the word morning here are used as double entendres for becoming chaos/obscurity for "Evening" and becoming ordered/clarity for "morning"
That word for "morning" is where possibly the word "revealed" could be tortured out of the creation account. But it's said in a poetic fashion of repetition....and if this is understood the intended meaning of "God created order out of chaos" is apparent.

Not that God revealed order in the chaos.
 
Carlyw said:
What im hearing is youre very smart and know smart people things.

My brain can not handle this information haha.

But I believe them to be right anyway, from what I can understand. Scripture is beautiful and there are many great and interesting fields of education that make learning scripture more clear/interesting. Do you watch YouTube? Or do you prefer to learn from books or classes? I find that I watch a lot on YouTube but I think that it has broken my brain. I watch and listen but do not retain. I tend to learn better from classes, and books but classes cost money and books do as well, free books however, I dont read because im undisciplined. Now a class, I would go to. Ah...the merits of living in such a fast paced well educated age that often values comfort and convenience.
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And to answer your questions about reading vx YouTube....I've done both.

I spent a lot of time reading books. Both physical books and electronic. I cross referenced a lot of things and for several years I could be found at the breakfast table buried under a pile of opened books by my family wanting breakfast but finding no room to eat their coco puffs.

So....that's when I would finally clean up the mess and help my wife fuss at them so they could get lunches packed and off to school on time.

So...yes, I read very fast but I'm not a speed reader. High retention rates for what I read as well. But again....I'm not normal. I just have my talents.

I only sometimes wish my talents made me more fun at parties....

But I love good stories from YouTube....I listen to those all the time. (And audio books from the library so I can do two things at once).
 
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I seem to have started a firestorm here. Let's see what Gods word has to say.
Genesis 1:26 And God said let Us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let THEM (how many is them 10, 100, 1,000 I do not know God did not say.) have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth (not the garden He gave Adam to tend), and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth. Verse 27. So God created man in His own image, in the image of God He created them male and female created He them. Verse 28 And God blessed them and God said unto them, "Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it . . . Replenish the earth that means there had to be something there before this all happened.
Genesis 2:1 Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them.
We need to look at this word host: #6635 in the Strongs Concordance tsaba it comes from #6633 a mass of persons organized for war (an army)
I would encourage you to read 2nd Peter 3 1-8 He covers all 3 ages the one that was the one we live in today and the one to come.
Keith
 
If God formed Adam out of clay, dust, dirt, whatever then yes Adam was the first man. If we look at his actions of rebellion to effect all man kind then yes Adam was the first man.
Part of trusting God is Trusting his word. I find that chopping up God's word leads us to a point of a Grey area that has to be explained away in one form or another. Leading people to draw away from the truth than to embrace it.
This has caused so much confusion in the family of God that it leaves a ? Rather than a .
 
Karlon said:
Jesus Christ, maybe is the 1st person created.
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But Jesus Christ wasn't created. He is eternal, like God the Father, and it was through Him that all things were created:

“In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God. All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made.” (Joh 1:1-3 NKJV)

“And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we beheld His glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father, full of grace and truth.” (Joh 1:14 NKJV)
 
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