You’ll have to go to a lot if churches and see if they’re being used. Why do you ask? What spiritual gifts have you observed so far? Please list tge spiritual gifts and tell us which ones you have seen and not seen. Please be concise and specific, with appropriate biblical scriptures and verses. Please be correct,
Are all the spiritual gifts still active today?
- Thread starter Roughsoul1991
- Start date
-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
If you believe that these people were great healers.. then there is nothing anyone could say to help you except the lord Himself. I will keep you in my thoughts and perhaps one day, the Holy Spirit will make these things clear. While I understand, at this moment in time, you would believe I am the one who needs help.
Go in peace
They were great anointed healers, no doubt about it. Kenneth Hagin had the top surgeon in the world tell him he had to die, he had been born with three fatal diseases. On his bed paralyzed from the waist down with the doomful news, he reached out to the Bible. He was healed by believing Mk 11:23-24, all documented. He lived til his late 80's preaching and healing all the way. I don't hold with those who think miracles are of the past, that's untrue to us believers. You must not know a thing about Smith Wigglesworth either. You certainly don't have to believe these preacher's ministries and I absolutely 100% do. Gnite✝
I am replying to show you that I didn't just come up with that answer off the top of my head. Other great commentators saw this verse the same way. Example:
Albert Barnes on Romans 11:29
For the gifts - The favors or benefits which God bestows on men. The word χάρισμα charisma properly denotes any benefit which is conferred on another as a mere matter of favor, and not of reward; see Rom_5:15-16; Rom_6:23. Such are all the favors which God bestows on sinners including pardon, peace, joy, sanctification, and eternal life.
John Gill
For the gifts and calling of God,.... By "gifts" are meant, not the gifts of nature and providence, as life, health, strength, riches, and honour, which God sometimes gives, and repents of, and takes away; as he repented that he had made man upon earth, and Saul king of Israel; which must be understood by an "anthropopathy", after the manner of men, and that not of a change of the counsel of his mind, but of the course of his providence: nor do gifts here design external gifts of grace, or such gifts of the Spirit, which qualify men for ministerial work, for public service in the church; for these may be taken away, as the "parable" of the "talents" shows, Mat_25:29; see 1Co_13:8; but the special and spiritual gifts of God's free grace, which relate to the spiritual and eternal welfare of the souls of men, even that, grace which was given to God's elect in Christ before the world was, and all those spiritual blessings wherewith they were then blessed in him:
Just an update on the posting that claimed the miraculous healing of Kenneth Hagin illness as a young child. He claimed the following -
- Who was he - Kenneth Erwin Hagin (August 20, 1917 – September 19, 2003) was an American preacher. He is known for pioneering the Word of Faith movement, following in the footsteps of E. W. Kenyon.
- What was his claim - According to Hagin, he was born with a deformed heart and what was believed to be an incurable blood disease. He was not expected to live and at age 15 he became paralyzed and bedridden. In April 1933 he converted to Christianity. During a dramatic conversion experience, he reported dying, due to the deformed heart, three times in 10 minutes, each time seeing the horrors of hell and then returning to life. He remained paralyzed after his conversion.
On August 8, 1934, he says he was raised from his deathbed by a revelation of "faith in God's Word" after reading Mark 11:23–24.[6] He was also healed of his paralysis and never struggled with walking. His dramatic healing is detailed in Roberts Liardon's book God's Generals
- Results of a deep dive into the facts - The provided context does not contain any medical evidence regarding Kenneth E. Hagin's illness. It details his personal testimony of being bedridden at age 15 due to a deformed heart and an incurable blood disease, which doctors believed would be fatal, and his reported miraculous healing in August 1934 after a spiritual experience. However, the sources do not offer any independent medical documentation or any evidence to substantiate the nature or existence of his diagnosed conditions. The information presented is based solely on Hagin's own account and the narrative of his ministry.
Do Christians then believe just the word of a man. Do we not believe Jesus Christ, in part, because of the large number of verifications given by many witnesses. God Himself tells us not to believe in the testimony of one man, it must be at least two are three. So then, as the Boreans would say, were is the medical evidence.
- Who was he - Kenneth Erwin Hagin (August 20, 1917 – September 19, 2003) was an American preacher. He is known for pioneering the Word of Faith movement, following in the footsteps of E. W. Kenyon.
- What was his claim - According to Hagin, he was born with a deformed heart and what was believed to be an incurable blood disease. He was not expected to live and at age 15 he became paralyzed and bedridden. In April 1933 he converted to Christianity. During a dramatic conversion experience, he reported dying, due to the deformed heart, three times in 10 minutes, each time seeing the horrors of hell and then returning to life. He remained paralyzed after his conversion.
On August 8, 1934, he says he was raised from his deathbed by a revelation of "faith in God's Word" after reading Mark 11:23–24.[6] He was also healed of his paralysis and never struggled with walking. His dramatic healing is detailed in Roberts Liardon's book God's Generals
- Results of a deep dive into the facts - The provided context does not contain any medical evidence regarding Kenneth E. Hagin's illness. It details his personal testimony of being bedridden at age 15 due to a deformed heart and an incurable blood disease, which doctors believed would be fatal, and his reported miraculous healing in August 1934 after a spiritual experience. However, the sources do not offer any independent medical documentation or any evidence to substantiate the nature or existence of his diagnosed conditions. The information presented is based solely on Hagin's own account and the narrative of his ministry.
Do Christians then believe just the word of a man. Do we not believe Jesus Christ, in part, because of the large number of verifications given by many witnesses. God Himself tells us not to believe in the testimony of one man, it must be at least two are three. So then, as the Boreans would say, were is the medical evidence.
Information on the infamous Smith Wigglesworth - (10 June 1859 – 12 March 1947) was a British evangelist who was influential in the early history of Pentecostalism. He was born in Menston, Yorkshire, England, to an impoverished family and worked in the fields and factories from a young age, which left him illiterate until he married Mary Jane "Polly" Featherstone in 1882. Polly taught him to read the Bible, which he considered the only book he ever read. He became a born-again Christian at the age of eight and was confirmed by a Bishop in the Church of England, baptized by immersion in a Baptist church, and received Bible teaching from the Plymouth Brethren while apprenticing as a plumber.
Wigglesworth's ministry was characterized by a strong belief in faith healing, often attributing illness to demonic forces. He practiced various methods, including laying hands on people, anointing with oil, distributing prayer handkerchiefs (one of which was sent to King George V), and, controversially, hitting or punching afflicted body parts, often violently shaking the sick and the elderly in their beds, which he justified as confronting the devil rather than the person. He believed that healing came through faith and once declared, "I'll only pray for you once, to pray twice is unbelief".
There are numerous accounts and claims that Smith Wigglesworth raised people from the dead, most notably the assertion that he performed this feat fourteen times. It seems however, he could not cure his daughters deftness or his own problem with kidney stones.
To sum things up, we see an all to familiar pattern in the following: However, these accounts are not authenticated by medical or independent historical evidence. Critics argue that no verifiable documentation exists to prove any of these resurrections, and that the stories are largely based on personal testimonies, religious publications, and the writings of Wigglesworth himself and his associates. The Pentecostal scholar Gary B. McGee notes that Wigglesworth's methods, which sometimes involved physical force, were part of his belief in spiritual warfare against demonic forces causing illness. Despite the widespread belief in these miracles within Pentecostal circles, mainstream scholars and skeptics maintain that the claims lack credible, objective proof.
Wigglesworth's ministry was characterized by a strong belief in faith healing, often attributing illness to demonic forces. He practiced various methods, including laying hands on people, anointing with oil, distributing prayer handkerchiefs (one of which was sent to King George V), and, controversially, hitting or punching afflicted body parts, often violently shaking the sick and the elderly in their beds, which he justified as confronting the devil rather than the person. He believed that healing came through faith and once declared, "I'll only pray for you once, to pray twice is unbelief".
There are numerous accounts and claims that Smith Wigglesworth raised people from the dead, most notably the assertion that he performed this feat fourteen times. It seems however, he could not cure his daughters deftness or his own problem with kidney stones.
To sum things up, we see an all to familiar pattern in the following: However, these accounts are not authenticated by medical or independent historical evidence. Critics argue that no verifiable documentation exists to prove any of these resurrections, and that the stories are largely based on personal testimonies, religious publications, and the writings of Wigglesworth himself and his associates. The Pentecostal scholar Gary B. McGee notes that Wigglesworth's methods, which sometimes involved physical force, were part of his belief in spiritual warfare against demonic forces causing illness. Despite the widespread belief in these miracles within Pentecostal circles, mainstream scholars and skeptics maintain that the claims lack credible, objective proof.
Hebrews 13:8
New International Version
Jesus Christ is the same yesterday and today and forever.
New Living Translation
Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today, and forever.
English Standard Version
Jesus Christ is the same yesterday and today and forever.
King James Bible
Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.
New King James Version
Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today, and forever.
New American Standard Bible
Jesus Christ is the same yesterday and today, and forever.
Let that sink in for a moment...
I DON"T CARE if fanatics dance on the floor,
I DON"T CARE if I don't see another miracle the rest of my days,
I DON"T CARE What the mostly catholic early church fathers said,
I CAN"T HELP what the modern churches are doing,
I CAN'T HELP it if charismatics or any one else keep looking for false signs,
I DON"T CARE what sinful, liberal theologians are spewing,
THE CHRIST, THE SON OF THE LIVING GOD HAS NOT CHANGED!!!
HE"S STILL THE SAME, & no unbelieving, devil-oppressed" church goer" is going to change my mind!
HE STILL SENDS the Holy Spirit to empower the true church, He's still the head of the church, & He still sits at the right hand of power, KING OF KINGS, LORD OF LORDS to the glory of God the Father!!! And not anything anyone else says will change that!
ALL I WANT RIGHT NOW is for Jesus to come get me out of this unbelieving mess!
New International Version
Jesus Christ is the same yesterday and today and forever.
New Living Translation
Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today, and forever.
English Standard Version
Jesus Christ is the same yesterday and today and forever.
King James Bible
Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.
New King James Version
Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today, and forever.
New American Standard Bible
Jesus Christ is the same yesterday and today, and forever.
Let that sink in for a moment...
I DON"T CARE if fanatics dance on the floor,
I DON"T CARE if I don't see another miracle the rest of my days,
I DON"T CARE What the mostly catholic early church fathers said,
I CAN"T HELP what the modern churches are doing,
I CAN'T HELP it if charismatics or any one else keep looking for false signs,
I DON"T CARE what sinful, liberal theologians are spewing,
THE CHRIST, THE SON OF THE LIVING GOD HAS NOT CHANGED!!!
HE"S STILL THE SAME, & no unbelieving, devil-oppressed" church goer" is going to change my mind!
HE STILL SENDS the Holy Spirit to empower the true church, He's still the head of the church, & He still sits at the right hand of power, KING OF KINGS, LORD OF LORDS to the glory of God the Father!!! And not anything anyone else says will change that!
ALL I WANT RIGHT NOW is for Jesus to come get me out of this unbelieving mess!
Oh yeah, BTW,
IF God quit giving to His church all gifts for ministry, He would have to apologize to the rest of us for showing partiality.
So, get out of your unbelief & quit saying God don't do that no more, or you'll stand before God for bearing false witness against the Almighty & sowing unbelief to His church.
IF God quit giving to His church all gifts for ministry, He would have to apologize to the rest of us for showing partiality.
So, get out of your unbelief & quit saying God don't do that no more, or you'll stand before God for bearing false witness against the Almighty & sowing unbelief to His church.
Because man adds and subtracts what fits man and does not understand is out for the self and others under his thrall
Turn to God Father in risen Son sincerely, ask Daddy, PaPa, Father for truth in all things, who wants what is only best for us all, not a few
God loves us all, otherwise, why did Son go willingly to that cross?
No, Smith Wigglesworth did not have kidney stones at the end of his life, although he suffered from them for several years decades earlier. He died peacefully in 1947 at the age of 87.
Of course there's gonna be naysayers against the anointing...
"And he was amazed at their unbelief". In this passage, Jesus returns to His hometown of Nazareth but is unable to perform many miracles there due to the people's skepticism and lack of faith. Their refusal to believe in Him, despite the evidence of His power and teachings, is what caused Jesus to marvel.
So I recently came across a book called The 3 Colors Of Ministry using the trinatarian model to highlight the spiritual gifting including the way God has empowered us.
Very intriguing information as most people lean more heavily towards one of the three manifestations of God.
God the Father (Creator)
God the Son ( The Word)
God the Spirit (power)
In the center of the circle is God connecting all 3 showing all 3 to be God.
If not balanced the extreme often falls into 3 categories.
(Green) The far reaching liberal or progressive churches often worship more of Creation.
(Red) The far reaching dogmatic churches often lean solely on the Word.
(Blue) The far reaching charismatic churches often lean solely more on the Power.
What is often missing is balance towards the center.
Very intriguing information as most people lean more heavily towards one of the three manifestations of God.
God the Father (Creator)
God the Son ( The Word)
God the Spirit (power)
In the center of the circle is God connecting all 3 showing all 3 to be God.
If not balanced the extreme often falls into 3 categories.
(Green) The far reaching liberal or progressive churches often worship more of Creation.
(Red) The far reaching dogmatic churches often lean solely on the Word.
(Blue) The far reaching charismatic churches often lean solely more on the Power.
What is often missing is balance towards the center.
Jesus' power and miracles were known by all; so not believing in Him in spite of that is indeed unfortunate. But there's no evidence that Hagin or Wigglesworth had any powers at all. So believing in them isn't the smart thing to do but the dumb thing.
Maybe you haven't been looking in the right places for verification? I agree that we don't need biblical evidence, all we have to do is to examine real world evidence through common people testimonies. These are people like you and me (or board members) These are the boots on the ground for the Lord and mostly from people who do not have a ministry and they aint selling any books, just working people searching for the Lord..and one day God said, ok, bless that man's prayers with an answer, and that becomes their testimony. People with no reason to lie.
Besides, nowadays a lot of people have webcams handy in their homes and then they have a supernatural encounter with the Lord in healing or revelation or whatever. A sign from Heaven! We all like that and it's easy for people to become excited and reach for that web cam to talk about it!
It is not hard to read people's person, body language, tonal clues grammer and speech patterns.
Many are easily spotted as fakes. Also many, are recognized as potentially credible. Mix in some prayerful thoughtfulness and the Holy Spirit Will Guide You Into ALL Truth! That's true and He will confirm it for you if your faith is weak. I have been there done that and got the T-shirt.
Would like to hear my personal Testimony of healing to myself that I prayed for and received one night? I'd be glad to recount it for you!
No. I've prayed for myself or others and received healing. That's not what I'm talking about.
Did anyone ever get healed?
I've heard a lot of credible testimonies, Healings, casting out of evil spirits and even raising the dead.
I was watching a video testimony one day and I couldn't decide if he sounded credible or not so I prayed while I was watching it, Lord is this true?
And the Lord quickened me in spirit to confirm to me that it was indeed true. I wasn't positive at the time what happened all I really knew at that point was, something happened inside of me! It had to be God because I was just praying for the truth, so maybe God was confirming it for e? I did remain skeptical at the time because I was i uncharted territory!
I didn't even know what quickened in spirit means, but it's in scripture, but I didn't find that for a month or so, lol. I tried to talk about it to Christian Brothers & Sisters online, and how could I say what happened and convey what happened? So I likened it to a submarine "pinging" another submarine, because that's sort of like what happened in my spirit. Like a burst of spiritual energy within myself? Like that.
Eventually I ran across
Romans 8:11
11 But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you..../KJV
It happened more and more while I was watching testimonial videos on youtube. It didn't happen with all testimony videos, just some of them.
I asked the Lord in prayer one time to give me Discernment of the truth and He answered me immediately, He said practice your discernment by looking for Me within the people you meet, look for Me.../
So, Brother. Honestly, do you think I'm totally nuts? A little nuts? What?
In studying the gifts from the scriptures I struggle to see how the modern church's use of the sign gifts compares to Biblical examples.
When did tongues become gibberish? Versus known languages?
When did healing or miracles involve these ritualistic practices? And claims without evidence?
When did demonic deliverance need drawn-out rituals?
When did prophecy allow for prophets to be in error?
Now I'm not a cessationist as I believe God can and has worked in all of the gifts as he wills.
But I do question authenticity when what I see doesn't match the scriptures or early church history.
When did tongues become gibberish? Versus known languages?
When did healing or miracles involve these ritualistic practices? And claims without evidence?
When did demonic deliverance need drawn-out rituals?
When did prophecy allow for prophets to be in error?
Now I'm not a cessationist as I believe God can and has worked in all of the gifts as he wills.
But I do question authenticity when what I see doesn't match the scriptures or early church history.
Because the Lord wants us to walk in Faith. Believe Him and trust Him.
If you ask 1000 different people how the Lord speaks to them or helps them, you'll get 1000 different answers. The Lord is like that. Even though the world is exploding with Miracles right now, many of them are overseas, where they haven't been indoctrinated so much like in the United States. God doesn't give out public proof. God gives out personal proofs. God does not do magic shows!
So there are two camps pf people right now, the people who have never any proof so they say it went away, and the other people who have received personal proofs. I have many Testimonies of the gifts manifesting around me. They didn't stop, but some will not see it or hear it. Eyes to see, ears to hear.
I've been witness to pretty supernatural stuff happening. Nothing on the level of part the red sea, but supernatural nonetheless. The Lord told me once that, He likes to do big miracles in front of large crowds, so He gets more converts out of it. And also He mentioned something about, don't pray for signs a lot, He doesn't want to have to demonstrate a miracle every time when He visits a Believer. Just understand, that we can trust Him and be anxious for nothing and walk in your faith.
If you've read about a certain miracle or sign in scripture, then you could expect Him to do the same things for you. Ye have not because ye ask not!
I spoke in tongues before. After I became interested i tongues (from testimonies) and sought that for myself. Two different well intentioned Brothers in Christ said they could teach me how!
But if I'm understanding tongues right, that is the Holy Spirit praying to the Lord for us because we know not how to pray like we ought to. So how in the world could anyone teach me to put words into the Holy Spirit's mouth?! Oh, no, I wont do that. I said thanks anyway, I'll pray about it.
Then awhile later one day I was sitting and about to pray for something, and I was gathering my heart and my thoughts before beginning to pray. And when I opened my mouth to speak in prayer, what came out of my mouth was tongues that I did not understand what was being said though! I knew what it had to be, the Holy Spirit, so I stood down and listened and let Him finish! After a few minutes, He finished and then I sent up, my own feeble prayer, lol.
I did not do that. I never tried to speak in tongues. That was supernatural and real. Sometimes, several times I realize as I am waking up from sleep, that I am mumbling in tongues. (Whoa). If it happens it happens and if it don't it don't. True story.
In scripture, the miracles performed was never specifically just for personal proof. It could always be verified by others. Which is also how Luke wrote much of his accounts through eyewitness accounts.
Scripture speaks of two types of tongues. A personal prayer language and corporate gathering. In corporate gatherings, it was always an untaught language in someone's native language being heard. In a corporate gathering, it required an interpreter.
Paul mentions that personal prayer in tongues is edifying but to get an understanding is better.