Can We Really Exercise Free Will?

[cv5]

We all exist at the pleasure of God. There are sheep and goats. Jesus didn't come to change goats into sheep, but to seek and to save the sheep. There are wheat and tares. No record of God changing tares into wheat. Why do such realities bother you so?

Evidently you do not understand either parable.

"Changing" goats and tares isn't the point of either.
How could anyone get this wrong is beyond me, but well within the capacity of the super-determinists.

 

[Rufus]

Corpse man.

No conscience.

No sense.

So...you don't believe that man is made in God's image, do you? What makes you think for a nanosecond that man possesses powers that God himself doesn't have? Since God cannot sin because of his holy nature, then what makes you think that sinful man can choose to become something he is not? God cannot do this, so why do you think his clay pots can?

Oh wait...I know. I just remembered. You think that leopards and Ethiopians can learn to change their appearance just like Israel learned how to do evil (Jer 13:23). You're foolish belief gives a whole new meaning to "no sense"!

 

[Genez]

No I did not! And, I did not choose to follow God! He chose me long ago and made me His.

He chose you and predestined you to discover your belief in this day in time.
Why?
He chose you for the Bride for His beloved Son.

Besides... Not all saved people choose to follow God. That is a fact.

 

[Rufus]

“If one doesn't want to acknowledge that, they can bury their head in the sand. But the God most people imagine is only a fraction of who God is. For whatever reason, that makes people uncomfortable”

yeah he also deals very justly according to what they chose to do and tells them about good and evil and the consequences of the choices they make. Like any good parent would do knowing thier children must make choices when they grow up because the truth that people try to bury thier head in the sand because it makes them uncomfortable is
More like this

“Now all has been heard; here is the conclusion of the matter: Fear God and keep his commandments, for this is the duty of all mankind. For God will bring every deed into judgment, including every hidden thing, whether it is good or evil.”
‭‭Ecclesiastes‬ ‭12:13-14‬ ‭NIV‬‬

“Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, and shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life;

and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.”
‭‭John‬ ‭5:28-29‬ ‭


Which seems pretty relevant to clarify so as not to think he’s just randomly by his Will and not thier works and choices. Acting harshly and unjustly . Seems relevant to me relating to what you were saying .

“God “will repay each person according to what they have done.” To those who by persistence in doing good seek glory, honor and immortality, he will give eternal life.

But for those who are self-seeking and who reject the truth and follow evil, there will be wrath and anger. There will be trouble and distress for every human being who does evil: first for the Jew, then for the Gentile; but glory, honor and peace for everyone who does good: first for the Jew, then for the Gentile. For God does not show favoritism.”

“For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, so that each of us may receive what is due us for the things done while in the body, whether good or evil.”
‭‭2 Corinthians‬ ‭5:10‬ ‭

It seems relevant because it’s wrath being provoked by man’s actions that comes upon places like soddom and Gomorrah because of thier wickedness, not because he just feels like destroying them or it’s part of some master plan of his Will.

What I had said was all those examples you used were because the people rebelled against god and provoked his wrath seemed relevant

But if you want to see people avoid truth and “bury thier heads in the sand “
lol show them this consistent truth from the Bible. And then watch them duck and cover

“And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be. I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last.”
‭‭Revelation‬ ‭22:12-13‬ ‭

Little do you realize that the gracious gift of the Fear of the Lord was promised only to God's covenant people. This gift is never promised to the world. Stay tuned....I plan to expound some more on this irrefutable truth!

 

[Cameron143]

It bothers them because they think that all mankind has some inalienable right to His grace. God owes it to all mankind.

This is certainly one aspect of the problem. More largely, they focus merely on the attribute of love and make God out to be a heavenly Teddy Bear.

 

[Rufus]

He chose you and predestined you to discover your belief in this day in time.
Why?
He chose you for the Bride for His beloved Son.

Besides... Not all saved people choose to follow God. That is a fact.

Which proves they were never saved from the power of sin -- therefore, never saved to begin with. Since such people do not follow God, this means they're following their real father -- the father of lies. Didn't know the world is filled with Judas types, did you?

 

[Magenta]

FWers are indeed quite PROUD of the miraculous powers of their flesh and will. After all, they have deceived themselves into thinking they CAN do things that even the all-powerful Creator of the universe cannot do.

Another quite perplexing and even bizarre aspect of their view is they show they have no idea what it means
to be raised to new new life in Christ, which is quite foundational to the Christian message. Look at what studier
said in 10,221 and tell me how that level of lack of understanding came from all their years of study. It boggles the mind.

 

[cv5]

He chose me long ago and made me His.

You think so huh? Well I think that you have a big problem. You and the rest of the super-determinists need to do a double take and reassess your sentiment and philosophy.

Jhn 8:33
They answered him, We be Abraham's seed, and were never in bondage to any man: how sayest thou, Ye shall be made free?
(translation: we are pre-selected chosenites, its in the bag, and far beyond your criticism or judgement)

Jhn 8:37
I know that ye are Abraham's seed; but ye seek to kill me, because my word hath no place in you.
(translation: no, not really. Wake up and smell the coffee)

Jhn 8:39
They answered and said unto him, Abraham is our father. Jesus saith unto them, If ye were Abraham's children, ye would do the works of Abraham. But now ye seek to kill me, a man that hath told you the truth, which I have heard of God: this did not Abraham.
(translation: yes we are! Jesus: no you are not!)

Jhn 8:41
Ye do the deeds of your father. Then said they to him, We be not born of fornication; we have one Father, even God.
(translation: yes we are pre-selected chosenites because we say so, and if we SAY that we know God that's good enough)

Jhn 8:44
Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.
(translation: you have made a big mistake believing the Satanic lie of pre-selected choseniteism, and this will end in disaster).

 

[Rufus]

This is certainly one aspect of the problem. More largely, they focus merely on the attribute of love and make God out to be a heavenly Teddy Bear.

I think it was Genez (but I stand to be corrected) who basically said recently that God "took responsibility for the Fall". With that kind of carnal mindset it's easy to understand how that would lead to an attitude of entitlement to His grace.

 

[Cameron143]

Evidently you do not understand either parable.

"Changing" goats and tares isn't the point of either.
How could anyone get this wrong is beyond me, but well within the capacity of the super-determinists.

How many sheep have you been made aware of that were formerly goats? And have you ever planted a garden? Have you ever planted tares and wheat sprouted?

I'm pretty sure...each after its own kind...is a biblical teaching.

 

[Kroogz]

How many sheep have you been made aware of that were formerly goats? And have you ever planted a garden? Have you ever planted tares and wheat sprouted?

I'm pretty sure...each after its own kind...is a biblical teaching.

So, no new creation in Christ. We were always sheep and wheat. Got it.

 

[BillyBob]

You think so huh? Well I think that you have a big problem.

Thank you for pointing that out!

 

[Cameron143]

So, no new creation in Christ. We were always sheep and wheat. Got it.

If you go back to Genesis, you will find that each new thing comes from its own kind. Becoming a new creation in Christ doesn't change us from a human into something else. We are still human.

 

[Cameron143]

Thank you for pointing that out!

If it's any consolation, I think you have more than just 1 problem.

 

[BillyBob]

If it's any consolation, I think you have more than just 1 problem.

Potato-Heads spend a lot of time crying their eyes out!

 

[Magenta]

Thank you for pointing that out!

We'd have bigger longer lasting problems had God not saved us due to His great everlasting love!

Praise the Lord for He is good His love endures forever

 

[Magenta]

Which proves they were never saved from the power of sin -- therefore, never saved to begin with.
Since such people do not follow God, this means they're following their real father -- the father of lies.
Didn't know the world is filled with Judas types, did you?

Jesus said everyone God gives Him will come to Him... and He casts none out.

John 6 v 37 All that the Father gives me will come to me, and whoever comes to me I will never cast out.

 

[Magenta]

Potato-Heads spend a lot of time crying their eyes out!

Jesus had a big job opening all your eyes! .

Hebrews 13 v 14~ This world is not our home; we are looking forward to our everlasting home in heaven. There will be no more death or mourning or crying or pain

 

[Rufus]

In our fallen state, WHICH WE DID NOT CHOOSE FOR?
We are responsible before God?

NOW, IF WE CHOSE TO BE THAT WAY?
Then we would all suffer God's wrath.

Why can't you get that concept straight?

Did you choose to be born with a fallen nature?

I am asking YOU!
Did YOU choose for that?

No, you did not...
Someone else made that choice.

Now, what we do about it?
That will determine about the issue of God's wrath.

Get that straight, please!

Learn the difference between the wrath of God, and being forsaken by God.

Jesus was forsaken for our sins.
God did not blow him up to include Jesus in his wrath for our sins.

Now, we're getting very close the crux of the matter with Original Sin. The more you talk, the the deeper you dig your own grave!

You sound more and more like arrogant, prideful, unrepentant Adam who tried to justify his sin by responding to God's question with:

Gen 3:12
12 The man said, "The woman you put here with me — she gave me some fruit from the tree, and I ate it."
NIV

For someone who claims to NOT be in Adam, you Shirley do come off as being of one mind, heart and soul with your ancient daddy! Talk about soulmates! You, like Adam, are disavowing any culpability before God since you did not personally choose your predicament -- just like Adam did not get to personally choose who his wife would be! Like Adam, you are calling into question God's righteousness, goodness and wisdom. Adam clearly implied that God gave him defective goods, so his response to God infers, "How can I be responsible for the bad merchandise you gave me? I didn't ask for this woman! This is all on YOU!" It's no wonder at all that there is no record whatsoever in scripture that Adam owned his sin, confessed his sin and repented of it. In fact, quite the opposite! Adam hid his sin (Job 31:33)!

And not surprisingly, you also sound a lot like the tranny who shot up a bunch of kids in a Catholic Church in WI. In this heartbreaking story, I read a few excerpt's from this sick person's manifesto wherein he lamented (to paraphrase), "I didn't choose to be born; I didn't choose to be like this; and you (the victims in the church) won't choose to die."

For a professing Christian you truly have some very strange bedfellows...

 

[Rufus]

You think so huh? Well I think that you have a big problem. You and the rest of the super-determinists need to do a double take and reassess your sentiment and philosophy.

Jhn 8:33
They answered him, We be Abraham's seed, and were never in bondage to any man: how sayest thou, Ye shall be made free?
(translation: we are pre-selected chosenites, its in the bag, and far beyond your criticism or judgement)

Jhn 8:37
I know that ye are Abraham's seed; but ye seek to kill me, because my word hath no place in you.
(translation: no, not really. Wake up and smell the coffee)

Jhn 8:39
They answered and said unto him, Abraham is our father. Jesus saith unto them, If ye were Abraham's children, ye would do the works of Abraham. But now ye seek to kill me, a man that hath told you the truth, which I have heard of God: this did not Abraham.
(translation: yes we are! Jesus: no you are not!)

Jhn 8:41
Ye do the deeds of your father. Then said they to him, We be not born of fornication; we have one Father, even God.
(translation: yes we are pre-selected chosenites because we say so, and if we SAY that we know God that's good enough)

Jhn 8:44
Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.
(translation: you have made a big mistake believing the Satanic lie of pre-selected choseniteism, and this will end in disaster).

But the spiritual father of all God's elect, including Billy Bob, myself, etc. is Abraham! Don't you know that Abraham is the father of everyone who has truth faith!?