I rechecked before speaking but there's no such Verse that makes the claim you have made.Don't think that had anything to do with it! He was hated before he was born.
Is this personal belief because it's definitely not Biblically true?
Can We Really Exercise Free Will?
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Is this personal belief because it's definitely not Biblically true?
He died for all so that all unbelievers and believers could stand before Him and be judged.
What many fail to realize... is that no one would exist right today if the sin issue was not dealt with by God.
All mankind would have been forsaken!
Instead of mankind, Jesus was forsaken.
Matthew 27:46
And about the ninth hour Jesus cried out with a loud voice, saying,
“Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani?” that is, “My God, My God, why have You forsaken Me?”
The Cross made it possible for the entire fallen human race not to be wiped out by God and forsaken.
So? When an unbeliever stands before the Lord?
Not one sin will be mentioned to evaluate that unbeliever.
Ask why.
"So you seem to say God is indebted to the sinner" if thats how you interpret anything I've said on here.. its no wonder others dont trust your interpretations of the Bible.
He is jammed in a God's Sovereignty mode.
Might as well be arguing with a Calvinist.
How does some one turn the words " God GAVE man a way out" into "God now owes man something?"
Its blowing my mind. I mean they are completely the opposite things. Not even easily confused with one another.
Its blowing my mind. I mean they are completely the opposite things. Not even easily confused with one another.
I didn't say it did. I said the opposite. To be depraved is morally corrupt. Not to be absent of will. To be totally depraved theologically is to be so morally corrupt to reject God. To reject God is still a choice. Except God's Spirit draws people towards a new heart in Christ. You can be morally corrupt and still be persuaded by the Spirit to come to believe in Christ. That is the gospel. Come to, believe, repent, and accept what Christ has done and then the indwelling, not befo
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No NT account has the change of heart coming before the indwelling. It comes after, meaning they at first had to believe and accept Christ.
Forced conversion or unrelenting grace is unbiblical.
Maybe according to anti-free will doctrines but I do not see as stated above a sinner not having the ability to choose Christ.
True but not slaves of will or mind.
My point is not the difference in OT and NT ways to salvation but to provide proof that totally depravity is false in the sense that righteousness (will to do God's will) was still found before the indwelling.
(Sure there are OT accounts that speak of the Spirit coming upon someone to empower them and then leave. But not in many cases)
Genesis 6:8-9 declares, "Noah, however, found favor in the eyes of the LORD. This is the account of Noah. Noah was a righteous man, blameless in his generation; Noah walked with God."
God found favor/grace towards Noah due to His life being set apart from the depravity of the world.
Found favor due to being righteous not given favor due to being made righteous which is proof that Noah had a choice. To follow the God of his fathers or the ways of the world corrupted by the fallen angels.
(Of course, it was still Noah's faith in God that saved Him both physically and spiritually.)
If righteousness, the will to do God's will, is found before the indwelling of the Spirit, why do we need Christ's imputed righteousness? Wouldn't that mean we are perfectly capable of righteousness on our own?
Salvation throughout all the history of mankind has been through faith. Noah saved by grace through faith ... Abraham saved by grace through faith ... Moses saved by grace through faith ...
None of the OT believers were without sin ... all came to God through faith after God revealed Himself to them.
Believing is the same in both OT and NT ... the difference is OT believers looked to Messiah prior to His death, resurrection, ascension ... we look to Messiah after His death, resurrection, ascension.
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I already said the exception was belief in Christ. That is the condition that must be met.
I agree, there is a difference between His desired will and what He allows. His desire is to save all but not all are saved. Why? Is He not powerful enough to do so? Couldn't He just make people be saved? Of course. But reality and scripture speak of rejection and Hell. Conclusion: It is man who chooses to reject God.
Of course. God knows but He is also not just a God of the beginning and the end. He is in the present as well. Knowing in the present who rejects Him unto their death is the only way a name is blotted from the Book of Life.
Meaning God has everyone in His Book of Life with the desire that they meet the condition. When they do not, they are blotted out.
Here is where it gets cool.
Revelation 13:8 (ESV)
8 and all who dwell on earth will worship it, everyone whose name has not been written before the foundation of the world in the book of life of the Lamb who was slain.
God absolutely knows who responds to Him. The names are written before the foundation of the world. BUT....
Revelation 3:5 ESV
The one who conquers will be clothed thus in white garments, and I will never blot his name out of the book of life. I will confess his name before my Father and before his angels.
How can a name be blotted out if God had already written the saved within it? Because God is outside of time. He can see the present just as He sees the end. Only those who conquer, overcome, and gain the victory will be in the Book of Life. Those who reject Him are blotted out.
To give everyone the chance of salvation. Christ died for all, correct? He may not know them in eternity but He sure desired and tried to.
Scripture tells us righteousness is imputed by God to those who believe:
Romans 4:3-5 For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness. Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt. But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.
and please note, Romans 4 tells us faith is not works.
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Nope. An unbeliever can still do a righteous act in not murdering out of anger but that hardly save them from their debt of sin. Only Christ can do that. Good question though.
Our heart is changed by what we come to think with God's Word.
Thinking with Bible doctrine that you did not think with prior to salvation.
The Heart is where we think with in regard to our values and new priorities in Christ.
“As a man thinks in his heart, so is he.”
Proverbs 23:7
God gives us a new heart by providing Christians with Bible doctrine to think with and to live by.
A new heart to replace our old heart with its way of thinking that we developed while living for the world.
grace and peace ............
Yes, evil men still do tighteous deeds.
Matthew 7:11 KJV — If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children, how much more shall your Father which is in heaven give good things to them that ask him?
2 Corinthians 5:17 KJV — Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.
If any man be IN Christ, what happen? It says he us a ne creature, hence given a new heart' desire for God. The condition is you need to be IN Christ by faith first.
If any man be IN Christ, what happen? It says he us a ne creature, hence given a new heart' desire for God. The condition is you need to be IN Christ by faith first.
Yeah if what calvinists teach is correct, this verse is just absolutely untruthful and God is lying to the israelites.
Conclusion: Calvinism is false.
There is a thing that happens .. its called being BORN AGAIN. Then we are no longer a bad tree.
Fruits worthy of metanoia is in the Bible:
Matthew 3:8
Produce fruit in keeping with repentance.
Acts 26:20
First to those in Damascus and Jerusalem, then to everyone in the region of Judea, and then to the Gentiles, I declared that they should repent and turn to God, performing deeds worthy of their repentance.
Yes He did. The idea of two wills is something imagined, just philosophy which the Bible tells us to avoid.
Omniscient God would offer His gift of grace to people He knows won't accept it because He loves them and the people are at fault not Him.
Amen. Once you have a preconceived interpretive grid like TULIP, you must force all of Scripture to adhere to it and you gotta make all these non-biblical categories.
Effectual call, general call, decretive will, permissive will, revealed will and a whole lot of other words they use.
They are fighting against windmills though, the only converts calvinists seem to get is people who are ALREADY Christian, very rarely do they convert unbelievers, for obvious reasons. They are infamous for fishing in a barrel.
No one else inside of Christianity believes every single thing is predestined. No one. Its just them. Outside of Christianity I can only think of islam that also teaches its all predestined