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Could be a play of words. Just doesn't take away from all the other verses like Father and I are one
Who is Jesus Christ in this verse and why they call him The Everlasting Father?
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Could be a play of words. Just doesn't take away from all the other verses like Father and I are one
Let us not forget that God the Father is Speaking in Parables:
PSALMS 78:2
2 I will open my mouth in a parable: I will utter dark sayings of old:
EZEKIEL 20:49
49 Then said I, Ah Lord God! they say of me, Doth he not speak parables?
As well as Our Lord Jesus Christ too.
MARK 4:34
34 But without a parable spake he not unto them: and when they were alone, he expounded all things to his disciples.
Isn't it the word SAT ON THE RIGHT HAND OF GOD a parable too?
To understand the meaning of it, should be revealed by Our Lord Jesus as he was doing in Mark 4:34 to his disciples.
The revelation of Our Lord Jesus can be read in this verse.
EXODUS 15:6
6 Thy right hand, O Lord, is become glorious in power: thy right hand, O Lord, hath dashed in pieces the enemy.
Therefore When Jesus went back in heaven he bring back his GLORIOUS POWER as The Everlasting Father.
The question remain:
If Our Lord Jesus Christ is The Everlasting Father and at the same time He is The Son of God, who is the Holy Ghost?[/QUOTE]
As revealed to us.
Our Lord Jesus in his one body has 2 Roles.
1st Role as the Everlasting Father
2nd Role as the Son of God.
Sometimes he is speaking as the Everlasting Father and sometimes he is Speaking as the Son of God.
Once he told his disciples and he was Speaking in his role as the Everlasting Father. He promised that he will come for them.
JOHN 14:18
18 I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you.
And when he come, he will never leave them until the end of the world.
MATTHEW 28:20
20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world. Amen.
As revealed to us.
Our Lord Jesus in his one body has 2 Roles.
1st Role as the Everlasting Father
2nd Role as the Son of God.
Sometimes he is speaking as the Everlasting Father and sometimes he is Speaking as the Son of God.
Once he told his disciples and he was Speaking in his role as the Everlasting Father. He promised that he will come for them.
JOHN 14:18
JOHN 14:18
18 I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you.
And when he come, he will never leave them until the end of the world.
MATTHEW 28:20
20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of th.[/QUOTE]
Both God the Father and Jesus Christ are referred to as "Everlasting Father" in the Scriptures. But why should that affect Who the Holy Spirit is? The Holy Spirit is sometimes called "the Spirit of Christ," sometimes "the Spirit of God," abd sometimes "the Holy Spirit." Here is an example of each:
“But you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. Now if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he is not His.” (Ro 8:9 NKJV)
“But you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. Now if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he is not His.” (Ro 8:9 NKJV again!)
“Now hope does not disappoint, because the love of God has been poured out in our hearts by the Holy Spirit who was given to us.” (Ro 5:5 NKJV)
Both God the Father and Jesus Christ are referred to as "Everlasting Father" in the Scriptures. But why should that affect Who the Holy Spirit is? The Holy Spirit is sometimes called "the Spirit of Christ," sometimes "the Spirit of God," abd sometimes "the Holy Spirit." Here is an example of each:
“But you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. Now if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he is not His.” (Ro 8:9 NKJV)
“But you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. Now if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he is not His.” (Ro 8:9 NKJV again!)
“Now hope does not disappoint, because the love of God has been poured out in our hearts by the Holy Spirit who was given to us.” (Ro 5:5 NKJV)[/QUOTE]
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When the Lord breathed the Spirit upon the disciples it wasn't a different person.
Acts 2:17
“‘In the last days, God says, I will pour out my Spirit on all people. Your sons and daughters will prophesy, your young men will see visions, your old men will dream dreams.
Even on my servants, both men and women, I will pour out my Spirit in those days, and they will prophesy.
Being therefore exalted at the right hand of God, and having received from the Father the promise of the Holy Spirit, he has poured out this which you see and hear.
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When the Lord breathed the Spirit upon the disciples it wasn't a different person.
Acts 2:17
“‘In the last days, God says, I will pour out my Spirit on all people. Your sons and daughters will prophesy, your young men will see visions, your old men will dream dreams.
Even on my servants, both men and women, I will pour out my Spirit in those days, and they will prophesy.
Being therefore exalted at the right hand of God, and having received from the Father the promise of the Holy Spirit, he has poured out this which you see and hear.[/QUOTE]
Thank you for your reply. To save any misunderstanding, can I explain that my post appeared wrongly. Some of my words were omitted, and soe of the words of the post I was replying to appeared as if they were part of my post.
What I was actually questioning was why GodsGood keeps asking: "If Our Lord Jesus Christ is The Everlasting Father and at the same time He is The Son of God, who is the Holy Ghost? " What I intended to post was something saying that I didn't understand why Jesus Christ being sometimes referred to as Everlasting Father and more often as Son of God makes any difference to what the bible says about the Holy Spirit.
I have no idea why my earlier post appeared as such gobbledygook. I have just noticed that a similar thing has happened here in my reply to you. Some of your words appear as if they are part of my post.
As revealed to us.
Our Lord Jesus in his one body has 2 Roles.
1st Role as the Everlasting Father
2nd Role as the Son of God.
Sometimes he is speaking as the Everlasting Father and sometimes he is Speaking as the Son of God.
Once he told his disciples and he was Speaking in his role as the Everlasting Father. He promised that he will come for them.
JOHN 14:18
18 I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you.
And when he come, he will never leave them until the end of the world.
MATTHEW 28:20
20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world. Amen.[/QUOTE]
Let us not forget when Jesus made a promised in John 14:18 & Matthew 28:20. He speaks in his Role as The Everlasting Father.
He said "I will come back and will never leave you"
When this promised of Jesus as Everlasting Father fulfilled?
Jesus fulfilled his promised on the day of Pentecost.
Jesus came back in the form of the Holy Spirit.
And from then he never leave them because he dwelt in each of them.
ACTS 2:1-4
2 And when the day of Pentecost was fully come, they were all with one accord in one place.
2 And suddenly there came a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind, and it filled all the house where they were sitting.
3 And there appeared unto them cloven tongues like as of fire, and it sat upon each of them.
4 And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.
He is the Holy One, the beginning and the End, Savior, Lord God Almighty, Jehovah Jired, Creator, Father, Alpha and Omega, Lamb of God, Christ, Messiah, Emmanual, --------------------------
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One way competent Bible scholars have interpreted the meaning of this name is with the understanding that it (as with many, if not most, of the other Israelites' personal names) does not apply directly to the owner of that personal name (as we can see with "Elijah," "Abijah," etc.) but is, instead, a statement praising the Father, Jehovah God.
Personal names in the ancient Hebrew and Greek are often somewhat cryptic to us today. The English Bible translator must fill in the missing minor words (especially in names composed of two or more Hebrew words) such as "my," "is," "of," etc. in whatever way he thinks best in order to make sense for us today in English.
Therefore, the personal name at Is. 9:6 has been honestly translated as:
"And his name is called: Wonderful in counsel is God the Mighty, the everlasting Father, the Ruler of peace" - The Holy Scriptures, JPS Version (Margolis, ed.) to show that it is intended to praise the God of the Messiah who performs great things through the Messiah.
‘For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called, ‘Wonderful, Counselor [IS] The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.’ The two letter word ‘is,’ is usually not stated in Hebrew. Rather, the ‘is’ is understood.” - https://edward-t-babinski.blogspot.com/2016/04/prophecy-about-jesus-mighty-god.html
The Leeser Bible also translates it:
“Wonderful, counsellor of the mighty God, of the everlasting Father, the prince of peace”
Also, An American Translation (by trinitarians Smith and Goodspeed) says:
"Wonderful counselor is God almighty, Father forever, Prince of peace."
From the Is. 9:6 footnote in the trinity-supporting NET Bible:
".... some have suggested that one to three of the titles that follow ['called'] refer to God, not the king. For example, the traditional punctuation of the Hebrew text suggests the translation, 'and the Extraordinary Strategist, the Mighty God calls his name, "Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace."'"
And,
‘Wonderful in counsel is God the mighty, the Everlasting Father, the Ruler of Peace’ (Hertz 1968).
Of course it could also be honestly translated: "Wonderful Counselor and Mighty God is the Eternal Father of the Prince of Peace."
And the Tanakh by the JPS, 1985, translates it:
[1]"The Mighty God is planning grace;
[2] The Eternal Father [is] a peaceable ruler."
This latter translation seems particularly appropriate since it is in the form of a parallelism. Not only was the previous symbolic personal name introduced by Isaiah at Is. 8:1 a parallelism ("Maher-Shalal-Hash-Baz" means [1]"quick to the plunder; [2] swift to the spoil" - NIV footnote) but the very introduction to this Messianic name at Is. 9:6 is itself a parallelism: [1]"For unto us a child is born; [2] unto us a son is given." It would, therefore, be appropriate to find that this name, too, was in the form of a parallelism as translated by the Tanakh above.
So it is clear, even to a number of trinitarian scholars, that Is. 9:6 does not imply that Jesus is Jehovah God.
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What other scriptures should we throw out like Father and I are one??
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Trinitarian Professor William Barclay writing in his popular Daily Study Bible Series, The Gospel of John, Vol. 2, The Westminster Press, 1975, pp. 74, 75, 76 says:
“Now we come to the supreme claim [of John 10:30]. ‘I and the Father are one,’ said Jesus. What did he mean? Is it absolute mystery, or can we understand at least a little of it? Are we driven to interpret it in terms of essence and hypostasis and all the rest of the metaphysical and philosophic notions about which the makers of creeds fought and argued? Has one to be a theologian and a philosopher to grasp even a fragment of the meaning of this tremendous statement?
“If we go to the Bible itself for the interpretation,” continues Barclay, “we find that it is in fact so simple that the simplest mind can grasp it. Let us turn to the seventeenth chapter of John’s Gospel, which tells of the prayer of Jesus for his followers before he went to his death: ‘Holy Father, keep them in thy name, which thou hast given me, that they may be one, even as we are one’ (John 17:11). Jesus conceived of the unity of Christian with Christian as the same as his unity with God.”
John 14:9
He who has seen Me has seen the Father; so how can you say, 'Show us the Father'?
John 3:11
Amen Amen, I say to you, We speak what We know and testify what We have seen
John 8:14
Even if I bear witness of Myself, My witness is true, for I know where I came from and where I am going
Revelation 22:3
the throne of God and of The Lamb shall be in it, and His servants shall serve Him.
throne is singular.
one throne: of God, of the Lamb.
His is singular. Him is singular.
One God, One Master of the servants:
The Father and The Lamb.
I go to myself? nah
A little while, and ye shall not see me: and again, a little while, and ye shall see me, because I go to the Father. John 16:16
The father is sitting on his own right hand? nahFor David is not ascended into the heavens: but he saith himself, YHWH said unto my Lord, Sit thou on my right hand, Until I make thy foes thy footstool. Acts 2:34-35
This will help. Just understand the request of Phillip. He said Lord SHOW US THE FATHER.
And look at the answer of Jesus.
JOHN 14:8-9
8 Philip said, “Lord, show us the Father and that will be enough for us.”
9 Jesus answered: “Don’t you know me, Philip, even after I have been among you such a long time? Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father. How can you say, ‘Show us the Father’?
There is only One Throne in heaven seen by Apostle John.
The One True God is sitting in the Throne.
Would you recognize the One True God sitting in the Throne?
REVELATION 4:2
2 And immediately I was in the spirit: and, behold, a throne was set in heaven, and one sat on the throne.
Mat 11:27
All things have been delivered to me by my Father; and no one knows the Son except the Father, and no one knows the Father except the Son and any one to whom the Son chooses to reveal him.
All things have been delivered to me by my Father; and no one knows the Son except the Father, and no one knows the Father except the Son and any one to whom the Son chooses to reveal him.
Peter replied, “Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. And you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. Acts 2:38
Notice: It doesn't matter if one is baptized in the name of Yeshua ( Jesus ), or the Father, Son, or H.S.
Notice: It doesn't matter if one is baptized in the name of Yeshua ( Jesus ), or the Father, Son, or H.S.
Barclay was a universalist and evolutionist.
I am a convinced universalist. I believe that in the end all men will be gathered into the love of God.: Barclay