The Error is Baptism in Jesus name only for salvation
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So, you don't believe Romans 8:16 and 1 John 5:11-13. Just own it. My question was an honest question. Just because there are deceived individuals who confidently and self righteously believe they are most likely saved based on their performance does not mean that NOBODY can have assurance of salvation. Only genuine believers can truly know.
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And he does not. So there is that...
And not only that, just like an agnostic he claims that because he does not know, we cannot know either.
Jeepers. Okay, my story is mine to tell. Lamar does not get to tell me what I do or do not know.
And, I believe what the Scriptures say. We can know. I know.
And not only that, just like an agnostic he claims that because he does not know, we cannot know either.
Jeepers. Okay, my story is mine to tell. Lamar does not get to tell me what I do or do not know.
And, I believe what the Scriptures say. We can know. I know.
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“But some man will say, How are the dead raised up? and with what body do they come? Thou fool, that which thou sowest is not quickened, except it die: and that which thou sowest, thou sowest not that body that shall be, but bare grain, it may chance of wheat, or of some other grain:
…There are also celestial bodies, and bodies terrestrial: but the glory of the celestial is one, and the glory of the terrestrial is another.
There is one glory of the sun, and another glory of the moon, and another glory of the stars: for one star differeth from another star in glory. So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption: it is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body.
There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body. And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit. The first man is of the earth, earthy: the second man is the Lord from heaven.
And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.
Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.”
1 Corinthians 15:35-37, 40-42, 44-45, 47, 49-
…There are also celestial bodies, and bodies terrestrial: but the glory of the celestial is one, and the glory of the terrestrial is another.
There is one glory of the sun, and another glory of the moon, and another glory of the stars: for one star differeth from another star in glory. So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption: it is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body.
There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body. And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit. The first man is of the earth, earthy: the second man is the Lord from heaven.
And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.
Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.”
1 Corinthians 15:35-37, 40-42, 44-45, 47, 49-
Naw that’s what you guys who preach that special different second gospel say when someone else says “ look what the bible actually says about it “
If anyone shows you the real doctrine taught in the Bible . Like baptism for remission of sins in Jesus name you begin immediately creating reasons to disbelieve it
“And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved;
but he that believeth not shall be damned.”
Mark 16:15-16 KJV
“and said unto them, Thus it is written, and thus it behoved Christ to suffer, and to rise from the dead the third day: and that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem. And ye are witnesses of these things.”
Luke 24:46-48 KJV
“Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost: teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.”
Matthew 28:19-20 KJV
“Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins,
and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.”
Acts 2:38-39 KJV
“ ……And the Lord added to the church daily such as should be saved.”
Acts 2: 47
Could you explain baptism for remission of sins a bit an apostle Paul ?
“Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death? Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection: knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin. For he that is dead is freed from sin.
……But God be thanked, that ye were the servants of sin, but ye have obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine which was delivered you. ( he’s talking about baptism of n Jesus name for remission of sins ) Being then made free from sin, ye became the servants of righteousness.”
Romans 6:3-7, 17-18 KJV
If anyone shows you the real doctrine taught in the Bible . Like baptism for remission of sins in Jesus name you begin immediately creating reasons to disbelieve it
“And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved;
but he that believeth not shall be damned.”
Mark 16:15-16 KJV
“and said unto them, Thus it is written, and thus it behoved Christ to suffer, and to rise from the dead the third day: and that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem. And ye are witnesses of these things.”
Luke 24:46-48 KJV
“Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost: teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.”
Matthew 28:19-20 KJV
“Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins,
and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.”
Acts 2:38-39 KJV
“ ……And the Lord added to the church daily such as should be saved.”
Acts 2: 47
Could you explain baptism for remission of sins a bit an apostle Paul ?
“Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death? Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection: knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin. For he that is dead is freed from sin.
……But God be thanked, that ye were the servants of sin, but ye have obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine which was delivered you. ( he’s talking about baptism of n Jesus name for remission of sins ) Being then made free from sin, ye became the servants of righteousness.”
Romans 6:3-7, 17-18 KJV
Jesus did actually say He never knew those who believed in Him in Matthew 7:21-23. Then He went on to explain the importance of laying a proper foundation. I don't believe this was a coincidence. His immediate explanation would seem to indicate the lack of a proper foundation was the reason He had NEVER come to know them. Note what is included in the foundation as revealed in Hebrews 6 below.:
"Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God,
Of the doctrine of baptisms, and of laying on of hands, and of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment." Heb 6:1-2
Each item mentioned, is included in Peter's initial message presented at Pentecost. (Acts 2:4-42) I don't believe this is a coincidence either. I believe it is possible they were never buried together with Jesus. Surely Jesus knows those who believe and buried together with Him through faith and obedience to the NT water baptism command.
"Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God,
Of the doctrine of baptisms, and of laying on of hands, and of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment." Heb 6:1-2
Each item mentioned, is included in Peter's initial message presented at Pentecost. (Acts 2:4-42) I don't believe this is a coincidence either. I believe it is possible they were never buried together with Jesus. Surely Jesus knows those who believe and buried together with Him through faith and obedience to the NT water baptism command.
Then it's an impossible scenario all together.
It's impossible to cast out demons using Jesus name without being saved.
It's impossible to see miracles happen using Jesus name without being saved.
It's impossible to use Jesus name with results and Jesus doesn't know you.
Nothing was said about water Baptism so that's not the issue.
If the first 3 things are true and they backslid then Jesus would never know them in the backslidden condition since they refuse to repent.
It's impossible to cast out demons using Jesus name without being saved.
It's impossible to see miracles happen using Jesus name without being saved.
It's impossible to use Jesus name with results and Jesus doesn't know you.
Nothing was said about water Baptism so that's not the issue.
If the first 3 things are true and they backslid then Jesus would never know them in the backslidden condition since they refuse to repent.
How does water baptism bury someone with Christ? He was buried in a tomb? This here let's one know that baptism doesn't actually bury someone with Christ physically. What is being spoken of is not literal, but symbolic.
That this should need to be explained to someone who presents themselves as a student and teacher of the scripture is telling. The link to Christ in baptism is one by faith and is spiritual.
That this should need to be explained to someone who presents themselves as a student and teacher of the scripture is telling. The link to Christ in baptism is one by faith and is spiritual.
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Consider the definition of iniquity below. It is very interesting. As noted, iniquity is defined as a deviation off of the right path. It is possible those in the Matthew 7 account rejected the need to believe and obey God's message presented initially by Peter on the Day of Pentecost.
" In the Old Testament of the 11 words translated "iniquity," by far the most common and important is `awon (about 215 times). Etymologically, it is customary to explain it as meaning literally "crookedness," "perverseness," i.e. evil regarded as that which is not straight or upright, moral distortion (from ` iwwah, "to bend," "make crooked," "pervert"). Driver, however (following Lagarde), maintains that two roots, distinct in Arabic, have been confused. In Hebrew, one = "to bend," "pervert" (as above), and the other = "to err," "go astray"; that `awon is derived from the latter, and consequently expresses the idea of error, deviation from the ight path, rather than that of perversion" (International Standard Bible Encyclopaedia)
How does one deviate from the right path? They deviate off the right path when they refuse to take God’s established path in order to become His bride. (Acts 2:4-42)
“Verily, verily, I say unto you, he that entereth not by the door into the sheepfold, but climbeth up some other way, the same is a thief and a robber.” John 10:1
If you will recall, Jesus said He was going to prepare a place and would return for His bride and enter into the marriage supper of the lamb in the last day. He will return and receive to Himself those who are already His bride. We are not told that we will become his bride after leaving this earth: “Let us be glad and rejoice, and give honour to him: for the marriage of the Lamb is come, and His wife hath made herself ready.” Revelation 19:7
The following excerpt was taken from the Jewish learning website, “For centuries the Jewish bride has immersed herself in a mikveh--a ritual bath--in preparation for her wedding. The bridal mikveh was a woman's first trip to a place that would be part of her life's rhythms… According to the Talmud, the ultimate source of all water is the river that emerged from Eden. By immersing in the mikveh, people participate in the wholeness of Eden and are reborn as pure as Adam and Eve. Mikveh also represents the physical source of life--the womb--from which humans enter the world untouched by sin. For brides and grooms mikveh is a physical enactment of the passage from being unmarried to married. Entering the huppah [marriage canopy] is a public declaration of a change in status; entering the mikveh is a private transforming moment….” Myjewishlearning.com
The above paints a vivid picture of the spiritual reality that occurs when people believe and obey God's NT command and become His bride.
The following post addresses this in detail:
https://christianchat.com/bible-discussion-forum/natural-and-spiritual-marriage-parallels.182003/
" In the Old Testament of the 11 words translated "iniquity," by far the most common and important is `awon (about 215 times). Etymologically, it is customary to explain it as meaning literally "crookedness," "perverseness," i.e. evil regarded as that which is not straight or upright, moral distortion (from ` iwwah, "to bend," "make crooked," "pervert"). Driver, however (following Lagarde), maintains that two roots, distinct in Arabic, have been confused. In Hebrew, one = "to bend," "pervert" (as above), and the other = "to err," "go astray"; that `awon is derived from the latter, and consequently expresses the idea of error, deviation from the ight path, rather than that of perversion" (International Standard Bible Encyclopaedia)
How does one deviate from the right path? They deviate off the right path when they refuse to take God’s established path in order to become His bride. (Acts 2:4-42)
“Verily, verily, I say unto you, he that entereth not by the door into the sheepfold, but climbeth up some other way, the same is a thief and a robber.” John 10:1
If you will recall, Jesus said He was going to prepare a place and would return for His bride and enter into the marriage supper of the lamb in the last day. He will return and receive to Himself those who are already His bride. We are not told that we will become his bride after leaving this earth: “Let us be glad and rejoice, and give honour to him: for the marriage of the Lamb is come, and His wife hath made herself ready.” Revelation 19:7
The following excerpt was taken from the Jewish learning website, “For centuries the Jewish bride has immersed herself in a mikveh--a ritual bath--in preparation for her wedding. The bridal mikveh was a woman's first trip to a place that would be part of her life's rhythms… According to the Talmud, the ultimate source of all water is the river that emerged from Eden. By immersing in the mikveh, people participate in the wholeness of Eden and are reborn as pure as Adam and Eve. Mikveh also represents the physical source of life--the womb--from which humans enter the world untouched by sin. For brides and grooms mikveh is a physical enactment of the passage from being unmarried to married. Entering the huppah [marriage canopy] is a public declaration of a change in status; entering the mikveh is a private transforming moment….” Myjewishlearning.com
The above paints a vivid picture of the spiritual reality that occurs when people believe and obey God's NT command and become His bride.
The following post addresses this in detail:
https://christianchat.com/bible-discussion-forum/natural-and-spiritual-marriage-parallels.182003/
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