Would Christ Vote?

[HeIsHere]

God absolutely appointed Hitler to serve God's purpose. He has appointed everyone that has or has held a position of authority. God also appointed all of the kings, as mentioned in the Old Testament, even though most did evil in the eyes of the Lord.

God has orchestrated all events in the past, the events today, and the events to come. There is prophesy that had to be fulfilled, in the past, now, and in the future. God leaves nothing to chance and is complete control of all final outcomes.

I do not believe for one second God is accountable or the author of evil.

A better translation is: (Romans 13:1) 13 Let every person be in subjection to the superior authorities, for there is no authority except by God; the existing authorities stand placed in their relative positions by God.

 

[HeIsHere]

I'll go with this person.....

It is an abomination [to God and men] for kings to commit wickedness, for a throne is established and made secure by righteousness (moral and spiritual rectitude in every area and relation), (Proverbs 16:12 Amplified Classic).

It is incumbent upon the Body of Christ at this time to hold forth God’s standard and demand it from those in authority. Selah.
Barb Witt

 

[tourist]

I do not believe for one second God is accountable or the author of evil.

A better translation is: (Romans 13:1) 13 Let every person be in subjection to the superior authorities, for there is no authority except by God; the existing authorities stand placed in their relative positions by God.

God certainly does not condone evil but at time permits it so that prophecy can be fulfilled, and for other purposes that, in this present time, are hard to comprehend. Satan is the author of evil, but ultimately, for his glory and to the benefit of those that he loves.

 

[HeIsHere]

God certainly does not condone evil but at time permits it so that prophecy can be fulfilled, and for other purposes that, in this present time, are hard to comprehend. Satan is the author of evil, but ultimately, for his glory and to the benefit of those that he loves.

Yes I would agree, people choose to do evil or support evil and God permits it allows us as well so suffer the consequences.

 

[posthuman]

Every society that has gone the way of sodomy has collapsed.

Frankly every society has collapsed lol

 

[Cameron143]

Frankly every society has collapsed lol

The society of cool people hasn't.

 

[sawdust]

The society of cool people hasn't.

That's because that's a society of one and He's King of kings and Lord of lords.

 

[sawdust]

I agree with you. We as Christians are suppose to be "salt" and "light" in the world:

Matthew 5:13 “You are the salt of the earth. But if the salt loses its saltiness, how can it be made salty again? It is no longer good for anything, except to be thrown out and trampled underfoot.

14 “You are the light of the world. A town built on a hill cannot be hidden. 15 Neither do people light a lamp and put it under a bowl. Instead they put it on its stand, and it gives light to everyone in the house. 16 In the same way, let your light shine before others, that they may see your good deeds and glorify your Father in heaven.

We are suppose to be a godly influence in the world - at the very least let God work through you to be a blessing to the world and so God would be glorified. This would include voting for good candidates or at the very least the ones that would do the least harm.

Don't let the others upset you and just continue to let God work through you in everything you do, including voting or participating in politics - wherever God leads you according to His will so that what you do will bless other people and bring glory to the Lord. Don't lose your saltiness like these discouragers have - remain "salty" and useful to the Lord. If they want to become useless and get thrown out to be trampled underfoot, that's their problem.

I can assure you I'm not upset or put off in any way.

I find it a laughable irony when others think love of country or nationalism is some form of derangement. Who do they think created nationalism?

Acts 17:26
And He has made from one blood every nation of men to dwell on all the face of the earth, and has determined their preappointed times and the boundaries of their dwellings,

The Lord is returning to judge the nations. I work and pray to ensure my corner is up to scratch. Withdrawing oneself from any corner of life's disciplines only serves to let the enemy overrun that part of life.

Thanks for the encouragement.

 

[keepingthingsreal]

Is not Christ our example?
Should we not follow that example?
Christ was unconcerned with the political system He lived under.
He had bigger fish to multiply.
Shouldn't we?

According to the opening verses of the second psalm and the interpretation of them that we are given in Acts 4:24-28, the political system that Christ lived under had been foreordained by God at least 1000 years earlier or when David wrote the second psalm.

Does anybody believe that human voting would have changed what God had foreordained to be done?

Israel rejected God when they cried out for an earthly king to rule over them.

 

[Slimsumo]

Frankly every society has collapsed lol

True. You have given me a lot of good things to think about and I will definitely stop watching politics so much. I never vote but I am spending too much time watching and following something I have no way to change. Its just not very evidently not biblical to care about these things, our job is spiritual not political.

All the leaders are wicked anyways, in their own way. In Europe you have the liberal soft kind of wickedness that promotes sin and in Russia and Islamic countries you have the more hands on type of wicknedness where people are actually physically harmed for no proper reason.

Only time we get good leadership is when Jesus comes back, like you said mate.

 

[tourist]

The society of cool people hasn't.

True. Same goes for the Island of Misfit Toys.

 

[sawdust]

Does anybody believe that human voting would have changed what God had foreordained to be done?

Has it occurred to you that God may be using human voting to His advantage? Maybe the reality we live in is a combination of human will and God utilizing human decision to effect His plan. If not, we may as well make no decisions for anything for if God has decided all things directly, nothing we do makes a difference.

 

[keepingthingsreal]

Has it occurred to you that God may be using human voting to His advantage? Maybe the reality we live in is a combination of human will and God utilizing human decision to effect His plan. If not, we may as well make no decisions for anything for if God has decided all things directly, nothing we do makes a difference.

Fair questions, and I have pondered these things in the past.

Here a just a few things from scripture which immediately come to my mind.

God raised up Pharaoh.
Joseph got into political office by interpreting a dream, and not by way of a public vote.
Daniel also got into political office by interpreting a dream, and not by way of a public vote.
Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego got into political office after escaping a fiery furnace unscathed, and not by way of public vote.
Many of Israel's kings were called by God, and not by way of a public vote, and others attained to the throne by way of assassination, and not by way of a public vote.
God called Cyrus by name before he was even born.
God foreordained Pilate and Herod, per Psalm 2, to rule in Israel during Christ's incarnation, and Christ told Pilate that he would have no power over him if it had not been given him from above.

On the contrary, in Matthew 15:12-14, Jesus said that the religious leaders of his day had not been planted by God. How did they get in such positions of power? By God's choosing or by man's choosing?

The children of Israel, when given a "vote," chose Barabbas over Jesus.

Do you understand what I am saying?

 

[posthuman]

True. You have given me a lot of good things to think about and I will definitely stop watching politics so much. I never vote but I am spending too much time watching and following something I have no way to change. Its just not very evidently not biblical to care about these things, our job is spiritual not political.

All the leaders are wicked anyways, in their own way. In Europe you have the liberal soft kind of wickedness that promotes sin and in Russia and Islamic countries you have the more hands on type of wicknedness where people are actually physically harmed for no proper reason.

Only time we get good leadership is when Jesus comes back, like you said mate.

history has shown over and over when the church involves itself in government and when government involves itself in the church both are equally bad and both corrupt each other.

the answer to the OP is really clear to me: no Jesus would not vote. He is God and could have become a man in any society and any position He wished - He chose not to become a man with a vote, but one among an oppressed people with wicked governments, and wicked misguided religious leaders. and He didn't say a word against the government, in fact was more polite with Pilate than with the high priest. He discouraged rebellion against either, but simply to live righteously.

it's not as though i have never voted. but the current climate of the heretical apostolic movement involving itself with nationalism is very dangerous in my opinion. this is how we got the RCC with popes leading armies and conquering half of Europe. did that end well? nope.

 

[posthuman]

Fair questions, and I have pondered these things in the past.

Here a just a few things from scripture which immediately come to my mind.

God raised up Pharaoh.
Joseph got into political office by interpreting a dream, and not by way of a public vote.
Daniel also got into political office by interpreting a dream, and not by way of a public vote.
Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego got into political office after escaping a fiery furnace unscathed, and not by way of public vote.
Many of Israel's kings were called by God, and not by way of a public vote, and others attained to the throne by way of assassination, and not by way of a public vote.
God called Cyrus by name before he was even born.
God foreordained Pilate and Herod, per Psalm 2, to rule in Israel during Christ's incarnation, and Christ told Pilate that he would have no power over him if it had not been given him from above.

On the contrary, in Matthew 15:12-14, Jesus said that the religious leaders of his day had not been planted by God. How did they get in such positions of power? By God's choosing or by man's choosing?

The children of Israel, when given a "vote," chose Barabbas over Jesus.

Do you understand what I am saying?

and Joseph wasn't trying to get political power, nor was Daniel, nor even David, amen. God appointed them, not men.

Moses even tried really hard to avoid it!

 

[posthuman]

God foreordained Pilate and Herod, per Psalm 2, to rule in Israel during Christ's incarnation, and Christ told Pilate that he would have no power over him if it had not been given him from above.

and He told Pilate flat out He is the Messiah - there are only a few people who He said this directly too, and that short list includes Pilate and the woman at the well in John 4: both Gentile!

something like this is far more worthwhile to meditate on than what secular power currently controls some pagan nations senate for a couple of years.

 

[posthuman]

True. Same goes for the Island of Misfit Toys.

my employer!

 

[HeIsHere]

history has shown over and over when the church involves itself in government and when government involves itself in the church both are equally bad and both corrupt each other.

This has nothing to do with individuals who are believers voting or going into politics.

 

[posthuman]

This has nothing to do with individuals who are believers voting or going into politics.

no, but it does have to do with the justifications they give in discussions like this.

i am not against exercising the vote we have in places like my country here, and i maintain that refusing to vote for any of a slate of wicked candidates is tantamount to voting for the non-existant "good" one.
but i am very much against what worldly people do to take advantage of the sheep in places like my country, making merchandise of the gospel to fake some allegiance in order to buy their votes - and i am very alarmed by the idea that giving some man who does such things enormous worldly power is somehow a "Christian" thing to do.

it's not. it's entirely secular, and it's a combination of a very shrewd, very power-hungry liar taking advantage of a very misguided apostolic movement that has for decades been working patiently to try to take control of the government in this country, to eventually install the equivalent of a protestant pope, crazily similar to the lds "white horse prophecy"

but overall as i said the thread topic question seems clearly settled, and what i would hopefully communicate to everyone involved here whether you agree with my take on the situation or not, is to be extremely suspicious of anyone who tries to appeal to your faith in exchange for worldly gain.

 

[HeIsHere]

no, but it does have to do with the justifications they give in discussions like this.

i am not against exercising the vote we have in places like my country here, and i maintain that refusing to vote for any of a slate of wicked candidates is tantamount to voting for the non-existant "good" one.
but i am very much against what worldly people do to take advantage of the sheep in places like my country, making merchandise of the gospel to fake some allegiance in order to buy their votes - and i am very alarmed by the idea that giving some man who does such things enormous worldly power is somehow a "Christian" thing to do.

it's not. it's entirely secular, and it's a combination of a very shrewd, very power-hungry liar taking advantage of a very misguided apostolic movement that has for decades been working patiently to try to take control of the government in this country, to eventually install the equivalent of a protestant pope, crazily similar to the lds "white horse prophecy"

but overall as i said the thread topic question seems clearly settled, and what i would hopefully communicate to everyone involved here whether you agree with my take on the situation or not, is to be extremely suspicious of anyone who tries to appeal to your faith in exchange for worldly gain.

I absolutely agree with you in this post regarding Trump and how he pandered to Christians and used the Christian faith to ingratiate himself with believers.

However, it is not only him that is the problem, Christians supporting him also bear a great deal of the blame, they made themselves his acolytes, I find it very disturbing.

I just do not agree with your view/use of "worldly" and secular which in and of itself is not all evil.