The Gospels and the Mystery
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“Jesus never preached a Gospel that included His death, burial and resurrection yet to come. “
Can you admit when you are completely wrong and it’s shown to you ? That’s the only way for us to learn
“And he began to teach them, that the Son of man must suffer many things, and be rejected of the elders, and of the chief priests, and scribes, and be killed, and after three days rise again.”
Mark 8:31 KJV
“For he taught his disciples, and said unto them, The Son of man is delivered into the hands of men, and they shall kill him; and after that he is killed, he shall rise the third day.”
Mark 9:31 KJV
“He is not here, but is risen: remember how he spake unto you when he was yet in Galilee, saying, The Son of man must be delivered into the hands of sinful men, and be crucified, and the third day rise again. And they remembered his words,”
Luke 24:6-8 KJV
more than that the Old Testament prophets preached it many times over that’s where Paul’s doctrine came from
“Having therefore obtained help of God, I continue unto this day, witnessing both to small and great, saying none other things than those which the prophets and Moses did say should come: that Christ should suffer, and that he should be the first that should rise from the dead, and should shew light unto the people, and to the Gentiles.”
Acts 26:22-23
Paul is an apostle of Jesus no different from Peter or John and there is no other gospel but the gospel Jesus himself first preached that saves anyone who will accept it, it’s not a good idea to preach other gospels
“I marvel that ye are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ unto another gospel: which is not another; but there be some that trouble you, and would pervert the gospel of Christ.”
Galatians 1:6-7 KJV
Can you admit when you are completely wrong and it’s shown to you ? That’s the only way for us to learn
“And he began to teach them, that the Son of man must suffer many things, and be rejected of the elders, and of the chief priests, and scribes, and be killed, and after three days rise again.”
Mark 8:31 KJV
“For he taught his disciples, and said unto them, The Son of man is delivered into the hands of men, and they shall kill him; and after that he is killed, he shall rise the third day.”
Mark 9:31 KJV
“He is not here, but is risen: remember how he spake unto you when he was yet in Galilee, saying, The Son of man must be delivered into the hands of sinful men, and be crucified, and the third day rise again. And they remembered his words,”
Luke 24:6-8 KJV
more than that the Old Testament prophets preached it many times over that’s where Paul’s doctrine came from
“Having therefore obtained help of God, I continue unto this day, witnessing both to small and great, saying none other things than those which the prophets and Moses did say should come: that Christ should suffer, and that he should be the first that should rise from the dead, and should shew light unto the people, and to the Gentiles.”
Acts 26:22-23
Paul is an apostle of Jesus no different from Peter or John and there is no other gospel but the gospel Jesus himself first preached that saves anyone who will accept it, it’s not a good idea to preach other gospels
“I marvel that ye are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ unto another gospel: which is not another; but there be some that trouble you, and would pervert the gospel of Christ.”
Galatians 1:6-7 KJV
Everytime he preached the cross, it was to his disciples and his disciples had no clue what he was talking about. Peter even rebuked Jesus for mentioning his death.
Luke 18:
31 Then he took unto him the twelve, and said unto them, Behold, we go up to Jerusalem, and all things that are written by the prophets concerning the Son of man shall be accomplished.
32 For he shall be delivered unto the Gentiles, and shall be mocked, and spitefully entreated, and spitted on:
33 And they shall scourge him, and put him to death: and the third day he shall rise again.
34 And they understood none of these things: and this saying was hid from them, neither knew they the things which were spoken.
I ask you, what is the gospel of the kingdom that the Lord and his disciples openly preached to the lost sheep of Israel? It certainly was not the Lord’s death, burial, and resurrection.
Luke 18:
31 Then he took unto him the twelve, and said unto them, Behold, we go up to Jerusalem, and all things that are written by the prophets concerning the Son of man shall be accomplished.
32 For he shall be delivered unto the Gentiles, and shall be mocked, and spitefully entreated, and spitted on:
33 And they shall scourge him, and put him to death: and the third day he shall rise again.
34 And they understood none of these things: and this saying was hid from them, neither knew they the things which were spoken.
I ask you, what is the gospel of the kingdom that the Lord and his disciples openly preached to the lost sheep of Israel? It certainly was not the Lord’s death, burial, and resurrection.
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As I stated in a previous post, there is good reason to doubt Paul's authorship of the book of Hebrews, mainly that it was written by someone who was NOT an apostle, but worked closely with them. It's also a legitimate observation that Paul ALWAYS identified himself as the author in ALL his epistles, where in Hebrews, we see no such signature. Yes, Paul was indeed an apostle, something the author of Hebrews lever laid claim. The only address of an "apostle" in Hebrews was a reference to Christ Himself in 3:1.
MM
MM
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Man, we don't need the Greek or Hebrew languages to prove Paul's authorship, frankly, you are not an expert in these languages just like me. 
MM
I have heard it said that Paul doesn't lay claim to the book of Hebrews as he does with his other epistles, because the Lord doesn't want the body of Christ thinking the book of Hebrews was written doctrinally to them, the body of Christ, but to the Hebrew people after the fulness of the Gentiles be come in. Just a thought...
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Yes, I've heard that as well, but I suspect that the Gentile churches Paul planted were well aware of the fact that Paul also preached to the local Jews in the local synagogues, given that some of the Gentile converts were once Gentile proselytes FROM the local synagogues, and some were even Jewish-born folks who chose to follow Christ, but not very many, as is true today from among the orthodox Jews.
So, I only maintain that there is a great measure for the unknown as to who the actual author of Hebrews really is, and it obviously wasn't important to the writer of Hebrews to identify himself, other than to say that he learned his gospel from the apostles, which is the polar opposite to what Paul declared to us all when he said that he learned not from any man his Gospel, but only from Christ. The author of Hebrews stated the opposite.
MM
So, I only maintain that there is a great measure for the unknown as to who the actual author of Hebrews really is, and it obviously wasn't important to the writer of Hebrews to identify himself, other than to say that he learned his gospel from the apostles, which is the polar opposite to what Paul declared to us all when he said that he learned not from any man his Gospel, but only from Christ. The author of Hebrews stated the opposite.
MM
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the gospel of the kingdom is the only true gospel it’s the same thing paul preached to both Jew and gentile. The flaw is you’ve created another gospel that’s for gentiles the gospel of the kingdom includes Jesus life d ministry siffering death resurrection and ascention to the throne in heaven . . But heres more scripture to prove it or more for you to dismiss I mean
“And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.”
Matthew 24:14 KJV
Let’s look at Paul’s words now
“And now, behold, I know that ye all, among whom I have gone preaching the kingdom of God, shall see my face no more.”
Acts 20:25 KJV
“And Paul dwelt two whole years in his own hired house, and received all that came in unto him, preaching the kingdom of God, and teaching those things which concern the Lord Jesus Christ, with all confidence, no man forbidding him.”
Acts 28:30-31 KJV
There’s no second gospel there’s one gospel it was first preached to Israel then after they rejected it it was preached to gentiles by the remnant who believed it .
There’s no other gospel
“I marvel that ye are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ unto another gospel: which is not another; but there be some that trouble you, and would pervert the gospel of Christ. But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed. As we said before, so say I now again, If any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed.”
Galatians 1:6-9 KJV
It isnt a good idea to preach other gospels theres Gods gospel and then many false ones to hear Gods gospel we have to hear Jesus
“And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.”
Matthew 24:14 KJV
Let’s look at Paul’s words now
“And now, behold, I know that ye all, among whom I have gone preaching the kingdom of God, shall see my face no more.”
Acts 20:25 KJV
“And Paul dwelt two whole years in his own hired house, and received all that came in unto him, preaching the kingdom of God, and teaching those things which concern the Lord Jesus Christ, with all confidence, no man forbidding him.”
Acts 28:30-31 KJV
There’s no second gospel there’s one gospel it was first preached to Israel then after they rejected it it was preached to gentiles by the remnant who believed it .
There’s no other gospel
“I marvel that ye are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ unto another gospel: which is not another; but there be some that trouble you, and would pervert the gospel of Christ. But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed. As we said before, so say I now again, If any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed.”
Galatians 1:6-9 KJV
It isnt a good idea to preach other gospels theres Gods gospel and then many false ones to hear Gods gospel we have to hear Jesus
Preaching the kingdom of God and preaching the gospel of the kingdom are two different things. Paul never preached the gospel of the kingdom, but the gospel of the grace of God. The gospel of the grace of God is the only gospel that should be preached during this dispensation. The gospel of the kingdom will once more be in effect during the tribulation.
Btw, Paul's gospel, the gospel of the grace of God, has gone out to all the world, preached to every creature under heaven, and made known to all nations. The end has not yet come because it is not the same as the gospel of the kingdom. This is clear.
Btw, Paul's gospel, the gospel of the grace of God, has gone out to all the world, preached to every creature under heaven, and made known to all nations. The end has not yet come because it is not the same as the gospel of the kingdom. This is clear.
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No doubt, Paul may have used amunensis as he had his eye problem yet this does not mean he havent authored it. The author stated to have it written a few words as in v22 yet in turns out has a thirteenth chapter hence the author let someone do it for him and the mist probable is Timothy. The style of Paul addressing himself in his letters to the churches or personal letters is understandable for he was writing to the gentile readers and not the Jews. The absence of his name carries no weight of no Paul's authorship and there are many reasons why he did not intend to do it that way. No mentioning over hete but, a better witness Peter said he had written to Jews.
It doesn’t matter if Paul wrote Hebrews this is who paul was and note what he says in the end
“After that, he was seen of James; then of all the apostles. And last of all he was seen of me also, as of one born out of due time. For I am the least of the apostles, that am not meet to be called an apostle, because I persecuted the church of God. But by the grace of God I am what I am: and his grace which was bestowed upon me was not in vain; but I laboured more abundantly than they all: yet not I, but the grace of God which was with me. Therefore whether it were I or they, so we preach, and so ye believed.”
1 Corinthians 15:7-11 KJV
the argument over if Paul was one of the authors of Hebrews is irrelevant he was one only one of many witnesses of the gospel. Called to preach to both Jew and gentile. He’s just another apostle a great one like the rest but paup doesn’t have a monopoly on truth Hebrews is as true and relevant to chrirtians as any New Testament book
theres an idea tbat if Paul dodnt write it it isn’t for us that’s totally off base like he said there “I’m an apostle I worked harder than all of the apostles by Gods grace and it doesn’t matter which of us preached the gospel to you we preach it and then you believe it “
Hebrews is just like any other New Testament scripture whether Paul wrote parts of it or didn’t
“After that, he was seen of James; then of all the apostles. And last of all he was seen of me also, as of one born out of due time. For I am the least of the apostles, that am not meet to be called an apostle, because I persecuted the church of God. But by the grace of God I am what I am: and his grace which was bestowed upon me was not in vain; but I laboured more abundantly than they all: yet not I, but the grace of God which was with me. Therefore whether it were I or they, so we preach, and so ye believed.”
1 Corinthians 15:7-11 KJV
the argument over if Paul was one of the authors of Hebrews is irrelevant he was one only one of many witnesses of the gospel. Called to preach to both Jew and gentile. He’s just another apostle a great one like the rest but paup doesn’t have a monopoly on truth Hebrews is as true and relevant to chrirtians as any New Testament book
theres an idea tbat if Paul dodnt write it it isn’t for us that’s totally off base like he said there “I’m an apostle I worked harder than all of the apostles by Gods grace and it doesn’t matter which of us preached the gospel to you we preach it and then you believe it “
Hebrews is just like any other New Testament scripture whether Paul wrote parts of it or didn’t
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Colossians 1:
5 For the hope which is laid up for you in heaven, whereof ye heard before in the word of the truth of the gospel;
6 Which is come unto you, as it is in all the world; and bringeth forth fruit, as it doth also in you, since the day ye heard of it, and knew the grace of God in truth:
5 For the hope which is laid up for you in heaven, whereof ye heard before in the word of the truth of the gospel;
6 Which is come unto you, as it is in all the world; and bringeth forth fruit, as it doth also in you, since the day ye heard of it, and knew the grace of God in truth:
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I think you missed the point. The writer of Hebrews admitted to have gotten their instruction, teaching, revelation and affirmation from men. Paul stated that he got his instruction, teaching, revelation and affirmation NOT from any man, but from Christ. That resonates with deep questions for the claim of his being the author. Eye problems? I've heard that fable before, but nobody has yet come up with anything that would demand Paul had to have someone else write for him...but, even if he did, that doesn't cast into doubt the glaring divide between the stated sources for the revelations written about.
Hmm. I'm not sure what English translation you read from, but the book of Hebrews literally drips the elixir of Jewish targeting.
MM
Hmm. I'm not sure what English translation you read from, but the book of Hebrews literally drips the elixir of Jewish targeting.
MM
Being water baptized and simply believing in the death, burial and resurrection on the third day are not the same foundations for any Gospel...except a very confusing, amalgamated Gospel. Water baptism unto remission of sins simply doesn't fit in with grace through faith. So, if you would, please explain how any work can possibly add anything, supplement in any way, or even fit in with what is unmerited favor...otherwise known ads "grace".
This is one of a number of dichotomies that I haven't yet seen anyone get around without tripping the wires of language and doctrinal concept confusions.
Thanks
MM
This is one of a number of dichotomies that I haven't yet seen anyone get around without tripping the wires of language and doctrinal concept confusions.
Thanks
MM
Romans 4:12 And the father of circumcision to them who are not of the circumcision only, but who also walk in the steps of that faith of our father Abraham, which he had being yet uncircumcised.
This is one of many verses and contexts that remains so overlooked by the singular Gospel crowd.
The sentiments in favor of believing in a singular Gospel throughout, thus being forced by that former gospel message, which demanded the work of water baptism for the remission of sins, and then trying to intermix that with righteousness through faith, and thus saved by grace (unmerited favor), that is a paradoxical dichotomy...given that Abraham never, at any time, practiced nor taught water baptism.
Faith, apart from any work, as it applies to us today who are under the Gospel of Grace, works play not one solitary part in our salvation through the shed Blood of Christ Jesus, His burial and resurrection on the third day. Water baptism, although a very nice outward showing of something that has already happened, is not going to remit anyone's sins in any way. Believing that it does is a diminishment of the Blood of Christ for us. That is not true of those who were under the Kingdom Gospel, and will be under it in the tribulation and the Millennial Kingdom, but it is not at all binding upon us today.
The Law was in full force, even after the resurrection of Christ:
Acts 21:20 And when they heard it, they glorified the Lord, and said unto him, Thou seest, brother, how many thousands of Jews there are which believe; and they are all zealous of the law:
The Judaizers simply did not understand nor know the mystery revealed through Paul. They too were singular Gospel followers. They thought they were doing good service unto the Lord, but were working against the Lord and against Paul as it turned out.
In addition to myself, my Messianic brothers in the Lord Jesus Christ know precisely what this is saying, reading it in the non-Alexandrian Greek texts. We are not so Westernized that we are blinded by this Westernized form of Christianity that dabbles so deeply, and is therefore greatly infected, with the pathetic and feeble sentiments of replacement theology throughout. It's my hope that more who follow the corruptions of Westernized Christianity will break free of that warped mindset that the enemy of our souls has worked so hard to foist upon so many within the body of Christ.
MM
This is one of many verses and contexts that remains so overlooked by the singular Gospel crowd.
The sentiments in favor of believing in a singular Gospel throughout, thus being forced by that former gospel message, which demanded the work of water baptism for the remission of sins, and then trying to intermix that with righteousness through faith, and thus saved by grace (unmerited favor), that is a paradoxical dichotomy...given that Abraham never, at any time, practiced nor taught water baptism.
Faith, apart from any work, as it applies to us today who are under the Gospel of Grace, works play not one solitary part in our salvation through the shed Blood of Christ Jesus, His burial and resurrection on the third day. Water baptism, although a very nice outward showing of something that has already happened, is not going to remit anyone's sins in any way. Believing that it does is a diminishment of the Blood of Christ for us. That is not true of those who were under the Kingdom Gospel, and will be under it in the tribulation and the Millennial Kingdom, but it is not at all binding upon us today.
The Law was in full force, even after the resurrection of Christ:
Acts 21:20 And when they heard it, they glorified the Lord, and said unto him, Thou seest, brother, how many thousands of Jews there are which believe; and they are all zealous of the law:
The Judaizers simply did not understand nor know the mystery revealed through Paul. They too were singular Gospel followers. They thought they were doing good service unto the Lord, but were working against the Lord and against Paul as it turned out.
In addition to myself, my Messianic brothers in the Lord Jesus Christ know precisely what this is saying, reading it in the non-Alexandrian Greek texts. We are not so Westernized that we are blinded by this Westernized form of Christianity that dabbles so deeply, and is therefore greatly infected, with the pathetic and feeble sentiments of replacement theology throughout. It's my hope that more who follow the corruptions of Westernized Christianity will break free of that warped mindset that the enemy of our souls has worked so hard to foist upon so many within the body of Christ.
MM
what’s your point ?
of course the gospel was sent to the world
“And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.”
Mark 16:15-16 KJV
I’m not understanding why you quoted that verse Paul’s one of the people carrying out the commission to preach the gospel to everyone …..it doesn’t then create a different gospel
“For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ.”
John 1:17
“Pilate therefore said unto him, Art thou a king then? Jesus answered, Thou sayest that I am a king. To this end was I born, and for this cause came I into the world, that I should bear witness unto the truth. Every one that is of the truth heareth my voice.”
John 18:37
“Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me. If ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also: and from henceforth ye know him, and have seen him.”
John 14:6-7 KJV
of course the gospel was sent to the world
“And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.”
Mark 16:15-16 KJV
I’m not understanding why you quoted that verse Paul’s one of the people carrying out the commission to preach the gospel to everyone …..it doesn’t then create a different gospel
“For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ.”
John 1:17
“Pilate therefore said unto him, Art thou a king then? Jesus answered, Thou sayest that I am a king. To this end was I born, and for this cause came I into the world, that I should bear witness unto the truth. Every one that is of the truth heareth my voice.”
John 18:37
“Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me. If ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also: and from henceforth ye know him, and have seen him.”
John 14:6-7 KJV
“They too were singular Gospel followers. “
“Now after that John was put in prison, Jesus came into Galilee, preaching the gospel of the kingdom of God, and saying, The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel.”
Mark 1:14-15 KJV
“And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.”
Matthew 24:14 KJV
“And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.”
Mark 16:15-16 KJV
“And they went forth, and preached every where, the Lord working with them, and confirming the word with signs following. Amen.”
Mark 16:20 KJV
“And Paul dwelt two whole years in his own hired house, and received all that came in unto him, preaching the kingdom of God, and teaching those things which concern the Lord Jesus Christ, with all confidence, no man forbidding him.”
Acts 28:30-31 KJV
“but there be some that trouble you, and would pervert the gospel of Christ. But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.”
Galatians 1:6-8
maybe they just believed what is actually there and understand Paul wasn’t cursing Jesus and the other apostles and claiming a different gospel
“Now after that John was put in prison, Jesus came into Galilee, preaching the gospel of the kingdom of God, and saying, The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel.”
Mark 1:14-15 KJV
“And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.”
Matthew 24:14 KJV
“And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.”
Mark 16:15-16 KJV
“And they went forth, and preached every where, the Lord working with them, and confirming the word with signs following. Amen.”
Mark 16:20 KJV
“And Paul dwelt two whole years in his own hired house, and received all that came in unto him, preaching the kingdom of God, and teaching those things which concern the Lord Jesus Christ, with all confidence, no man forbidding him.”
Acts 28:30-31 KJV
“but there be some that trouble you, and would pervert the gospel of Christ. But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.”
Galatians 1:6-8
maybe they just believed what is actually there and understand Paul wasn’t cursing Jesus and the other apostles and claiming a different gospel